DougieStyle

Im sure this has been discussed b4, and I tried searching so all im asking is for someone to point me in the right direction of some information on this swap.

Thanks, Doug

AznIceRckt

this is the route i'm going to go also (most likely).

my logic is this:
aps / jwt / pe TT kit 7k
fuel system 2k+
pistons/rods 2k+
cams 1k.
ecu or tuning or both... 2k+

including a clutch, some oil pan/cooler options, radiator, exhaust, its atleast a 15k decision to do boost on the vq35 reliably, unless you want to supercharge (still a good 10k).

rb26+rb25 transmission, 3500.
hks tomei apexi or other... cam gears, cams... 1200+-
custom frount mount... 1500+-
ecu/lots of tuning/fabrication ... 6-7k?

now with stock r34 turbines, this should pound out atleast 450whp reliably. reliably... meaning, bouncing off redline reliable, something i wouldn't do in a boosted built vq.

its really the next level that entices me though, with a single turbo kit, nothing fancy... an hks or similar, will easily bring the rb26 to 600whp levels. 1000+hp is possibly with internals.


but, you will mainly need custom motor mounts, tranny mounts, and a custom driveshaft. also, be prepared to lose any electronics, a/c, abs, vdc traction control, ebd, blah blah. getting small things like windows and door locks to work might be a pain too.

try talking to signal. they did chris fosbergs 350z, which has a sr20det in it. ORC Japan (ogura racing clutch), has a 350z with an rb26dett in it, built by top secret. This car has already debuted in Japan, seen it in option videos, the motor sounds wicked. I believe its a mostly stock rb with a blitz single turbo, pushing 600ps.

Ryuji Miki will be driving it now for top secret. The fact that the ORC 350z is drifted is somewhat of a testament for me to the rb26's reliability. Notice nearly every drift 350z no longer runs a vq engine.

---

The rb26 looks like it will be a tight fit though, ORC had to cut the glass-fibre composite layer that covers the radiator. I'm still considering an rb25. Cost for the motor is much less, but parts are hard to find.

I believe ECU options and wiring will be the hardest part to tackle. Another member let me know that the AEM EMS has an rb26 version/harness, so I'm looking into this.

There are several 350z's in japan with rb26's. Its a more logical choice then boosting the VQ for me. An engine is an engine. I prefer to have an engine originally designed for boost, then trying to convert an n/a engine to boost reliably.

So from that frame of mind (mine), doing an rb26 swap makes more sense then a vq TT.

-phil

DougieStyle

thanks alot for all the info, im planning on a rb26 powered G35 coupe after i get back from hot rod u. will this be the first?

Rickdogg

iTrader: (234)

Interesting thread. Keep it coming

Brandon@Forged

IMO it's not worth it, you guys should realize how hard it is to get RB26DETT parts in the USA, you're talking about importing almost everything, at least with 350Z stuff 50-75% of it can be bought here in the U.S.

Not to mention last time I checked RB26DETT parts weren't very cheap.

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Your custom work price is quite a bit understated. The guy who put the SR20DET into that car spent abut $10k for the fab work....

So lets break this down:

Fab work ~ $10k
RB26DETT (including ECU tranny etc) ~$3800
Stand Alone (AEM) ~$1500
Tuning Standalone ~$2000
Total Cost: $17,300

Power output: roughly 400 RWHP.. (thats being generous) Considering Paul Walkers Skyline that AEBS built with a Tomei Gensis Stage 3 Motor is putting out about 460-480 with a GRIP of other mods


Using the ~400 RWHP example lets do this with a VQ35

Turbonetics Single Turbo kit: $4750
Install costs $1000

Total cost: $5750

Power output: 386 RWHP RELIABLE

Not happy lets go APS..

APS TT kit: $8000
Install time: $2000
Tuning: $1000

total cost $11,000

Power output: ~400 RWHP RELIABLE

Want to make BIG power:
SGP Stage 3 long block including forged internals, cams, headwork, valve springs, valve job, all ARP fastners: $7500
Turbonetics Single Turbo kit (tuner version) $4000
1000 CC injectors: $1000
HKS FCON V PRO: $1500
Tuning time: $1500
Install costs: $3000
Walbro Fuel Pump: $150
AAM Spec 2 Fuel system: $1000
Total cost: $19,650

Power output: Over 650 RWHP reliable as F@CK.

And for an addtional MAYBE $2000 for fab work and turbo you could squeze in a 62-1 or 68-1 and make well into the 750s-800s


The point is for MUCH cheaper you an make the same power reliably. Or for about 2k more you can make 200+ more HP and be even MORE reliable...

AznIceRckt

You make very good points I'll take into account. My main drawback on boosting the VQ is reliability. Without internals, I don't think boost on the VQ is reliable.

How many thrown rods have we seen from stock internals? From what I've read, 7-9 psi will toast the motor even with good timing and tuning. Gurgen was running, what, 7-10psi ish with J+S safeguard, and a grip of reliability mods, still threw a rod.

From that, I decided that I will NEVER boost my VQ without internals. Its asking an engine to withstand pressures it was not originally intended for. I also wouldn't boost a VQ unless I had enough money lying around for a shortblock incase I blew my engine, which costs more then two rb26 engines combined (with no trannies).


---
Now moving to your point of doing an SGP long-block and TT, for around 20k done. I do believe that this setup, pistons/rods/ and maybe sleeves, will be reliable, to a point.

Reliable as in, I'm going to go to Buttonwillow or Big Willow and run WOT for 15-20 min, IMO, no. The oil temps and water will bake pretty fast, but once again, this I don't know for sure (speculation pretty much).

But, if you ask members that have built TT vq's, like gq626 or gurgen, I highly doubt they would run at a track or canyon for long periods of time without having an eagle eye on the temp gauges. There is always a chance I am completely wrong, but then again, there is a chance that I am completely right.

---
As for doing an RB26 swap, parts really are not that much.
From the greddy website:

IS BNR34 RB26DETT Single T78 or T88 Turbo upgrade, SUS mani, Type R w/g 11520070-3 $5450-5650

Thats retail as well, so 4-5k for a T78 or T88? Lag city I would assume, but a T88H will put out, what, 1200whp (not reliably ofcourse)?

NIS BNR32/BCNR33 RB26DETT 272 / 10.0 Exhaust GREX High Camshaft 13522788 $580.00
NIS BNR32/BCNR33 RB26DETT 272 /10.5 Exhaust GREX High Camshaft 13522789 $580.00

NIS BNR32/BCNR33/BNR34 RB26DETT Exhaust GREX Adj. Cam Sprocket 13523302 $138.00
NIS BNR32/BCNR33 RB26DETT GREX Valve Spring 13523610 $300.00
NIS BNR32/BCNR33/BNR34 RB26DETT 1.0 mm 88 dia. GREX Metal Head Gasket 13521265 $380.00

So retail, cams cam gears head gasket and valve springs are 2100+, meaning, with a turbo kit, and FMIC, I'm looking at a minimum of 8k in parts, not even including fuel injectors, oil cooler, etc.

An Rb26 with a built head and stock internals, will put out atleast 450-500whp, more on race fuel.

http://www.topsecretjpn.com/0300supra.shtml

Smoky might be exagerating (unless he built the internals), but the last time I saw this Supra in an option video, Smoky claimed 650ps, and the RB26 had stock internals and N1 turbines. The car clocked I believe... 205ish in England in the rain, Smoky actually went to jail for it too, haha.

Now Paul Walker's GT-R... the Tomei engines are equipped with Catalytic converters, and are boosted mildly. They are built to be somewhat legal crate motors in Japan and they use FACTORY cats, not even high-flow cats.

http://www.tomei-p.co.jp/_2003web-ca..._rb26dett.html

480ps with cats, at 8000rpm, at 1.3 bar (barely 20psi) of boost. Keep in mind AWD's dyno poorly, esp a GT-R, with 3 differentials, and 18 X 10.5 or so wheels.

*Now, another thing that draws me into the RB is the higher redline. With an extra 1000rpm limit, my car will see higher speeds. Pairing a custom driveshaft to a 350EVO 3.9 FD, would be rediculous acceleration, and speed in gears as well.

Rb's can sustain 9000rpm+ redlines with the right internals as well.

As far as getting parts, my parents live in Taiwan, and I have easy purchasing power for parts not available in the U.S., regardless though, many many companies have parts for the rb26.

As far as tuning, blast racing? signal? xs or sp even, they all have tuning experience with the rb, although I know it will cost me a lot.

---

As far as blowing engines. If I theoretically blew an rb, I could have access to another longblock for under 2500. What if I blew an SGP block? How much would it cost to fix (if fixable). I certainly wouldn't spend another several grand for another built block.

But anyway, how long have I been writing? sorry essay post.


EVERYONE CHIME IN THOUGH! I want your opinions.
SGP, Z1, gurgen, gq626, miaplaya, or anybody?

-Plus, my car is AUTO right now, and I am determined to convert it to manual. I'll be plopping in a tilton or ap pedal box if my research shows it can be done. A 6-speed 350z/g35 tranny will still be atleast 1k for me to purchase. Plus with an RB swap, I will have an extra engine and tranny in perfect running order, just sitting around.

-Keep in mind my car is stripped, has no a/c, and the fuse is pulled right now for abs/vdc, so theoretically I'm not losing any features of the G35.

Thanks for the tips MIAPLAYA, let me know next time you are out at turbonetics, I live very close to them, would definitely love to see your car and chat. Get that bad-boy fixed soon!

-Phil

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

My main issue with the Rb26 is not reliability its proven...but rather the fabrication costs to actually swap it. Sure the parts aren't THAT much but for the same cust roughly 10k you could buy and swap in a SGP longblock. Would this hold up at the track absolutely. No worse then an RB26 would built and putting out that much power. Sure gurgen blew his car with little boost and good tune but who knews what happened there. There are many more people making over 400 without blowing motors then there are people who did. And like I said with a fully built longblock you;re in good shape. Having the motor built is not necessarily going to mean that you have to be EXTRA careful with heat. Thats with ANY motor. A good cooling system can remedy that. Look what happened to the Tomei RB26 in the SCC test. Failed becuase of heat... It happens to any motor period. I think for the cost you could certainly make a damn good reliable VQ turbo motor.

thrifiddytt

Amen to that...my cousin has a hard enough time finding parts for his skyline, and he's in Japan!

DougieStyle

Aznicerckt you said "What if I blew an SGP block? How much would it cost to fix (if fixable)." Whats do you mean "if fixible" why would it not be like fixing any problem on a vq35?

Brandon@Forged

BTW, tons of people have named the VQ35DE to dominate the RB26DETT and 2JZGTE soon, reason being is displacement over those engines. It has near the same potential of HP but has more displacement and will make more power.

350zdanny

The VQ35 will likely never dominate the 2JZGTE at anything. Than engine is about as bullet proof as bullet proof comes. Maybe pound for pound the VQ can make a bit more HP in the end, but the 2JZ is one of the strongest factory engines ever produced and the internals are capable of much more punishment than the VQ. Sorry for the OT post.

I like the idea of dumping an RB26 in the Z but I have to agree with Miaplaya in saying that it's just not cost effective. It would certainly be unique though.

Brandon@Forged

I'm not saying the VQ is stronger stock...i'm saying when both of them are fully built and it's all said and done the VQ35DE is going to have more power...that's what everyone's saying at least.

Also I had a recent discussion with some buddies and we found out the RB26DETT in the Skyline has a faster time than the Supra, no 2JZGTE has ever dominated the RB26DETT in the 1/4 times.

AznIceRckt

I mean, theoretically, say I threw a rod or cracked a piston or something, or completely toasted the block, that would be an expensive repair, or replacement.

The thing actually drawing me away from the RB right now is weight distribution. The FM is nice, keeping the engine back in the engine bay. The RB should be more stretched out, skewing the weight over the axle like a normal front-engine rear-drive car.

I need to do some weight researches. Anyone know the VQ long-block weight?

-phil

DougieStyle

Would it be just as possible to put the rb26 in the g35

thrifiddytt

why not just buy an old 240sx and throw a rb26 in that, mounts are out now that you can better position it..you can keep your VQ and just wait to see what happens with the aftermarket development.

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Absolutely. McKinney Motorsports out in Santee, CA has an entire swap kit for dropping in a RB25 or RB 26 into a 240...That would be a drift MACHINE....

supra crazy

iTrader: (22)

Exactlyy what im doing my rb26 comes next week!!!


and i would like tp know how the hell are you gonna spend 10k on fab work!
custom mounts, downpipes, exhaust, and drive shaft does not cost 10 grand.

and personally I think the rb26 may be old but it has way more potential and better balance than a a vq35.

10,00rpm here I come!

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Well if you've looked at the engine bay of a Z lately you'll notice the firewall isn't exactly a mile away. You are DEFINITELY going to have to modify more than just the mounts and exhaust system. Theres going to be a lot of chassis work involved...

Zexy

iTrader: (55)

I hope Aznricerocket has some big pocket.