***Aftermarket LSD Reviews***
I've used both the Quaife and the Cusco yes. For my own car, I've had the Cusco now for about 3.5-4 years. I'm currently building a new rear with a different ratio ring and pinion and I chose to use another Cusco one (we keep both on the shelf so I could have used either one). My car has always been mostly street driven, but has seen track time in the past. I can't see anytime soon where my car would see a track again (variety of reasons). It's not a matter of putting the power down more effectively - they both do it very well, and neither one has any faults in this department. I like the adjustability the Cusco affords me, it costs a bit less, and unlike a helical unit, it's always working, no matter the situation. Like I said, personal preference.
Thanks...you're the only one I've come across that have used both. Its also great to hear driving impressions of both as well as to many people enter into a purchase based off of singular reviews of a product. This piece along w/ install is def not inexpensive by any means and the more info in the comparo the better.
yep I agree
the Quaife is very smooth, very quiet. If Nissan could ever work out a deal with them, it would be ideal to be included from the factory. However, feel wise, it doesn't have quite the lockup that the Cusco does (it's a noticeable difference to me, but sorta depends on the person driving I suppose). Both units are MUCH more confidence inspiring than a stock viscous - even if that stock unit is new. As time goes on and mileage increases, the already low lockup of the stock viscous one goes down further (they don't deal with heat very well at all either). Granted, even a stock viscous is a noticeable difference to no LSD at all, but stepping into a car with any of these other aftermarket units installed is literally a night and day difference. If the car had a Quaife from stock, I probably would not change it. However given a choice between the 2, my own preference is a clutch type for the reasons I mentioned previously
the Quaife is very smooth, very quiet. If Nissan could ever work out a deal with them, it would be ideal to be included from the factory. However, feel wise, it doesn't have quite the lockup that the Cusco does (it's a noticeable difference to me, but sorta depends on the person driving I suppose). Both units are MUCH more confidence inspiring than a stock viscous - even if that stock unit is new. As time goes on and mileage increases, the already low lockup of the stock viscous one goes down further (they don't deal with heat very well at all either). Granted, even a stock viscous is a noticeable difference to no LSD at all, but stepping into a car with any of these other aftermarket units installed is literally a night and day difference. If the car had a Quaife from stock, I probably would not change it. However given a choice between the 2, my own preference is a clutch type for the reasons I mentioned previously
I previously installed a quaife LSD in my RSX and really liked it. Not the most fun thing to do on jack-stands. Now that I have the Z I was unsure whether I wanted to go with quaife again or buy a clutch type LSD. Reading through this thread has helped a lot.
I am not going to be purchasing one until spring but I wanted to know how much you (Z1 Performance) charge for install.
Dan
I am not going to be purchasing one until spring but I wanted to know how much you (Z1 Performance) charge for install.
Dan
I previously installed a quaife LSD in my RSX and really liked it. Not the most fun thing to do on jack-stands. Now that I have the Z I was unsure whether I wanted to go with quaife again or buy a clutch type LSD. Reading through this thread has helped a lot.
I am not going to be purchasing one until spring but I wanted to know how much you (Z1 Performance) charge for install.
Dan
I am not going to be purchasing one until spring but I wanted to know how much you (Z1 Performance) charge for install.
Dan
Found a pretty decent write-up:
Differential Overview (Gear vs Clutch Type)
This article is part of our special collection:
Drivetrain
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
Quaife LSD
Quaife LSD
The hypoid style works off of the torque actually being applied to the ground from the faster spinning wheel, while the clutch style keys off the torque spinning through the axle of the faster wheel.
Quaife is a mechanical diff that uses hypoid gears to bias the torque between the 2 wheels. The gear designs creates internal torque multiplication based off of the torque applied to the ground from the wheel with the least resistance. Quaife biases torque only under acceleration.
The ATS is a clutch style differential. I'm not sure what the lockup % is on it, but as one wheel spins faster than the other in a given situation, the pre-loaded clutch mechanism will engage and that % of torque applied to the spinning faster spinning axle will be applied to the side with traction. The ATS is a 1.5/2 way diff so it will lockup and transfer torque under acceleration and deceleration.
So take this for example: Your car generates 200 lb-ft at the wheels. So that's 100 lb-ft of torque to each axle under ideal conditions and that power is being applied to the road surface. As one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, more power starts to go through that axle, and less of it is being transferred to the ground, ie, 150 lb-ft is going through the spinning axle and only 50 lb-ft is being applied to the ground. The rest gets lost as wheel spin. With an open diff, you'd only have the other 50 lb-ft of axle torque being applied to the wheel with traction.
The Quaife uses its internal bias ratio (say 5:1) to multiply the torque actually being applied to the ground of the spinning wheel to the axle with traction. So 5 x 50 = 250 lb-ft. Since you only generated 200 lb-ft up front, you can't bias that much, but you bias 150 lb-ft (200 total potential - 50 of what is actually getting to the ground) to the other side. This is almost an extreme example because the moment you get away from the 50/50 split, the Quaife starts biasing torque instantly. The only downside to this design is if one wheel has no resistance; ice, wheel in the air, etc... Zero x anything is zero, nothing to bias. Why some people pan the Quaife as a track diff.
In the above situation, the ATS would work differently than the Quaife. As power is applied and the clutches lock, the lockup ratio kicks in, say 60%. So as one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, the other wheel will be at least 60% as fast, or gets 60% of the power applied to that faster spinning axle. If the lockup ratio is too high, in low speed turns, you will get tire drag as the clutch locks and the inner and outer tire are too varied in speed.
Couple other key points. Quaife is zero maintenance and has a lifetime warranty, even with track use. ATS claims longer life than metal clutches, but those carbon clutches will still eventually lose effectiveness, particularly if tracked aggressively and requires more maintenance with more frequent oil changes.
I consider both to be the best of their respective designs. But if you have a street driven vehicle and want unobtrusive action, get the Quaife. If you plan to do some serious track events and are OK with the extra maintenance, give the ATS a look. If you have the open diff, go Quaife, if you have the VLSD, I'd lean towards ATS for ease of install. For reference, I had the VLSD, now I have the Quaife. Very happy with it. Probably the best option for street is the Quaife. ATS is best for hardcore trackers.
Nismo is like the ATS, except for metal clutch packs, which is another story in terms of operation and effectiveness. Its not nearly as smooth or quiet.
VLSD is an open diff that uses a viscous coupling. Its facing gears from each axle side in a semi-solid liquid. So when one side starts to spin, the internal gear on that side spins faster. The fluid reacts to the movement, and causes the facing gear to spin, transferring power to the slower spinning wheel. Its a quiet, non-servicable design. Only engages with wheel spin and transfers maybe 25-40% of the power. With high power setups, the viscous fluid can get cooked and get too thin, affecting its ability to transfer the power through the gearing. Its popular for OE use because there is no noise and its transparent under normal driving, but in situations with wheel spin, it engages just enough to be useful.
Differential Overview (Gear vs Clutch Type)
This article is part of our special collection:
Drivetrain
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
Quaife LSD
Quaife LSD
The hypoid style works off of the torque actually being applied to the ground from the faster spinning wheel, while the clutch style keys off the torque spinning through the axle of the faster wheel.
Quaife is a mechanical diff that uses hypoid gears to bias the torque between the 2 wheels. The gear designs creates internal torque multiplication based off of the torque applied to the ground from the wheel with the least resistance. Quaife biases torque only under acceleration.
The ATS is a clutch style differential. I'm not sure what the lockup % is on it, but as one wheel spins faster than the other in a given situation, the pre-loaded clutch mechanism will engage and that % of torque applied to the spinning faster spinning axle will be applied to the side with traction. The ATS is a 1.5/2 way diff so it will lockup and transfer torque under acceleration and deceleration.
So take this for example: Your car generates 200 lb-ft at the wheels. So that's 100 lb-ft of torque to each axle under ideal conditions and that power is being applied to the road surface. As one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, more power starts to go through that axle, and less of it is being transferred to the ground, ie, 150 lb-ft is going through the spinning axle and only 50 lb-ft is being applied to the ground. The rest gets lost as wheel spin. With an open diff, you'd only have the other 50 lb-ft of axle torque being applied to the wheel with traction.
The Quaife uses its internal bias ratio (say 5:1) to multiply the torque actually being applied to the ground of the spinning wheel to the axle with traction. So 5 x 50 = 250 lb-ft. Since you only generated 200 lb-ft up front, you can't bias that much, but you bias 150 lb-ft (200 total potential - 50 of what is actually getting to the ground) to the other side. This is almost an extreme example because the moment you get away from the 50/50 split, the Quaife starts biasing torque instantly. The only downside to this design is if one wheel has no resistance; ice, wheel in the air, etc... Zero x anything is zero, nothing to bias. Why some people pan the Quaife as a track diff.
In the above situation, the ATS would work differently than the Quaife. As power is applied and the clutches lock, the lockup ratio kicks in, say 60%. So as one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, the other wheel will be at least 60% as fast, or gets 60% of the power applied to that faster spinning axle. If the lockup ratio is too high, in low speed turns, you will get tire drag as the clutch locks and the inner and outer tire are too varied in speed.
Couple other key points. Quaife is zero maintenance and has a lifetime warranty, even with track use. ATS claims longer life than metal clutches, but those carbon clutches will still eventually lose effectiveness, particularly if tracked aggressively and requires more maintenance with more frequent oil changes.
I consider both to be the best of their respective designs. But if you have a street driven vehicle and want unobtrusive action, get the Quaife. If you plan to do some serious track events and are OK with the extra maintenance, give the ATS a look. If you have the open diff, go Quaife, if you have the VLSD, I'd lean towards ATS for ease of install. For reference, I had the VLSD, now I have the Quaife. Very happy with it. Probably the best option for street is the Quaife. ATS is best for hardcore trackers.
Nismo is like the ATS, except for metal clutch packs, which is another story in terms of operation and effectiveness. Its not nearly as smooth or quiet.
VLSD is an open diff that uses a viscous coupling. Its facing gears from each axle side in a semi-solid liquid. So when one side starts to spin, the internal gear on that side spins faster. The fluid reacts to the movement, and causes the facing gear to spin, transferring power to the slower spinning wheel. Its a quiet, non-servicable design. Only engages with wheel spin and transfers maybe 25-40% of the power. With high power setups, the viscous fluid can get cooked and get too thin, affecting its ability to transfer the power through the gearing. Its popular for OE use because there is no noise and its transparent under normal driving, but in situations with wheel spin, it engages just enough to be useful.
Found a pretty decent write-up:
Differential Overview (Gear vs Clutch Type)
This article is part of our special collection:
Drivetrain
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
Quaife LSD
Quaife LSD
The hypoid style works off of the torque actually being applied to the ground from the faster spinning wheel, while the clutch style keys off the torque spinning through the axle of the faster wheel.
Quaife is a mechanical diff that uses hypoid gears to bias the torque between the 2 wheels. The gear designs creates internal torque multiplication based off of the torque applied to the ground from the wheel with the least resistance. Quaife biases torque only under acceleration.
The ATS is a clutch style differential. I'm not sure what the lockup % is on it, but as one wheel spins faster than the other in a given situation, the pre-loaded clutch mechanism will engage and that % of torque applied to the spinning faster spinning axle will be applied to the side with traction. The ATS is a 1.5/2 way diff so it will lockup and transfer torque under acceleration and deceleration.
So take this for example: Your car generates 200 lb-ft at the wheels. So that's 100 lb-ft of torque to each axle under ideal conditions and that power is being applied to the road surface. As one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, more power starts to go through that axle, and less of it is being transferred to the ground, ie, 150 lb-ft is going through the spinning axle and only 50 lb-ft is being applied to the ground. The rest gets lost as wheel spin. With an open diff, you'd only have the other 50 lb-ft of axle torque being applied to the wheel with traction.
The Quaife uses its internal bias ratio (say 5:1) to multiply the torque actually being applied to the ground of the spinning wheel to the axle with traction. So 5 x 50 = 250 lb-ft. Since you only generated 200 lb-ft up front, you can't bias that much, but you bias 150 lb-ft (200 total potential - 50 of what is actually getting to the ground) to the other side. This is almost an extreme example because the moment you get away from the 50/50 split, the Quaife starts biasing torque instantly. The only downside to this design is if one wheel has no resistance; ice, wheel in the air, etc... Zero x anything is zero, nothing to bias. Why some people pan the Quaife as a track diff.
In the above situation, the ATS would work differently than the Quaife. As power is applied and the clutches lock, the lockup ratio kicks in, say 60%. So as one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, the other wheel will be at least 60% as fast, or gets 60% of the power applied to that faster spinning axle. If the lockup ratio is too high, in low speed turns, you will get tire drag as the clutch locks and the inner and outer tire are too varied in speed.
Couple other key points. Quaife is zero maintenance and has a lifetime warranty, even with track use. ATS claims longer life than metal clutches, but those carbon clutches will still eventually lose effectiveness, particularly if tracked aggressively and requires more maintenance with more frequent oil changes.
I consider both to be the best of their respective designs. But if you have a street driven vehicle and want unobtrusive action, get the Quaife. If you plan to do some serious track events and are OK with the extra maintenance, give the ATS a look. If you have the open diff, go Quaife, if you have the VLSD, I'd lean towards ATS for ease of install. For reference, I had the VLSD, now I have the Quaife. Very happy with it. Probably the best option for street is the Quaife. ATS is best for hardcore trackers.
Nismo is like the ATS, except for metal clutch packs, which is another story in terms of operation and effectiveness. Its not nearly as smooth or quiet.
VLSD is an open diff that uses a viscous coupling. Its facing gears from each axle side in a semi-solid liquid. So when one side starts to spin, the internal gear on that side spins faster. The fluid reacts to the movement, and causes the facing gear to spin, transferring power to the slower spinning wheel. Its a quiet, non-servicable design. Only engages with wheel spin and transfers maybe 25-40% of the power. With high power setups, the viscous fluid can get cooked and get too thin, affecting its ability to transfer the power through the gearing. Its popular for OE use because there is no noise and its transparent under normal driving, but in situations with wheel spin, it engages just enough to be useful.
Differential Overview (Gear vs Clutch Type)
This article is part of our special collection:
Drivetrain
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
ATS (Carbonetics) LSD
Quaife LSD
Quaife LSD
The hypoid style works off of the torque actually being applied to the ground from the faster spinning wheel, while the clutch style keys off the torque spinning through the axle of the faster wheel.
Quaife is a mechanical diff that uses hypoid gears to bias the torque between the 2 wheels. The gear designs creates internal torque multiplication based off of the torque applied to the ground from the wheel with the least resistance. Quaife biases torque only under acceleration.
The ATS is a clutch style differential. I'm not sure what the lockup % is on it, but as one wheel spins faster than the other in a given situation, the pre-loaded clutch mechanism will engage and that % of torque applied to the spinning faster spinning axle will be applied to the side with traction. The ATS is a 1.5/2 way diff so it will lockup and transfer torque under acceleration and deceleration.
So take this for example: Your car generates 200 lb-ft at the wheels. So that's 100 lb-ft of torque to each axle under ideal conditions and that power is being applied to the road surface. As one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, more power starts to go through that axle, and less of it is being transferred to the ground, ie, 150 lb-ft is going through the spinning axle and only 50 lb-ft is being applied to the ground. The rest gets lost as wheel spin. With an open diff, you'd only have the other 50 lb-ft of axle torque being applied to the wheel with traction.
The Quaife uses its internal bias ratio (say 5:1) to multiply the torque actually being applied to the ground of the spinning wheel to the axle with traction. So 5 x 50 = 250 lb-ft. Since you only generated 200 lb-ft up front, you can't bias that much, but you bias 150 lb-ft (200 total potential - 50 of what is actually getting to the ground) to the other side. This is almost an extreme example because the moment you get away from the 50/50 split, the Quaife starts biasing torque instantly. The only downside to this design is if one wheel has no resistance; ice, wheel in the air, etc... Zero x anything is zero, nothing to bias. Why some people pan the Quaife as a track diff.
In the above situation, the ATS would work differently than the Quaife. As power is applied and the clutches lock, the lockup ratio kicks in, say 60%. So as one wheel starts to slip and spin faster, the other wheel will be at least 60% as fast, or gets 60% of the power applied to that faster spinning axle. If the lockup ratio is too high, in low speed turns, you will get tire drag as the clutch locks and the inner and outer tire are too varied in speed.
Couple other key points. Quaife is zero maintenance and has a lifetime warranty, even with track use. ATS claims longer life than metal clutches, but those carbon clutches will still eventually lose effectiveness, particularly if tracked aggressively and requires more maintenance with more frequent oil changes.
I consider both to be the best of their respective designs. But if you have a street driven vehicle and want unobtrusive action, get the Quaife. If you plan to do some serious track events and are OK with the extra maintenance, give the ATS a look. If you have the open diff, go Quaife, if you have the VLSD, I'd lean towards ATS for ease of install. For reference, I had the VLSD, now I have the Quaife. Very happy with it. Probably the best option for street is the Quaife. ATS is best for hardcore trackers.
Nismo is like the ATS, except for metal clutch packs, which is another story in terms of operation and effectiveness. Its not nearly as smooth or quiet.
VLSD is an open diff that uses a viscous coupling. Its facing gears from each axle side in a semi-solid liquid. So when one side starts to spin, the internal gear on that side spins faster. The fluid reacts to the movement, and causes the facing gear to spin, transferring power to the slower spinning wheel. Its a quiet, non-servicable design. Only engages with wheel spin and transfers maybe 25-40% of the power. With high power setups, the viscous fluid can get cooked and get too thin, affecting its ability to transfer the power through the gearing. Its popular for OE use because there is no noise and its transparent under normal driving, but in situations with wheel spin, it engages just enough to be useful.
Wait..so the whole part when talking about the Quaife "The only downside to this design is if one wheel has no resistance; ice, wheel in the air, etc... Zero x anything is zero, nothing to bias. Why some people pan the Quaife as a track diff." So if one wheel is off the ground no power is going to it and all power to the one on the ground ? It's a down side but good enough to be a track diff ? I'm confused.
the Quaife only works if both wheels are on the ground and have traction. This is why it's not the best for an all out track setup, and a clutch type is preferred. It's upside is that it is quiet and smooth.
What's the level of maintenance required for the Cusco vs. Carbonetic? Also how long do those LSD's typically last? I've heard metal wears out faster from some and carbon wears faster from others, so I have no idea what is the truth. I know the Carbonetic requires frequent oil changes with their special fluid. Since the Cusco is also a clutch-type, does it also require frequent oil changes?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
The cusco is a clutch type, from what I have been reading. I was planning on buying the 1.5. My car is my daily driver and also sees the track alot. Would the 1.5 still be the way to go for a mix of street and track.
What's the level of maintenance required for the Cusco vs. Carbonetic? Also how long do those LSD's typically last? I've heard metal wears out faster from some and carbon wears faster from others, so I have no idea what is the truth. I know the Carbonetic requires frequent oil changes with their special fluid. Since the Cusco is also a clutch-type, does it also require frequent oil changes?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
to this day, we've never once had to sell a single set of replacement disks for the Cusco LSD, regardless of the car. As far as the oil changes, nothing special at all required time wise - I change mine every 20k miles or so.
Yes, the 1.5 way is the best overall setup for street and track use.
I've never run into any disk issues with the Carbonetics either, but they require significantly more frequent oil changes vs the Cusco, and they are not adjustable like the Cusco is - so really comes down to the individuals personal preference. Both have worked out great for us to date.
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What's the level of maintenance required for the Cusco vs. Carbonetic? Also how long do those LSD's typically last? I've heard metal wears out faster from some and carbon wears faster from others, so I have no idea what is the truth. I know the Carbonetic requires frequent oil changes with their special fluid. Since the Cusco is also a clutch-type, does it also require frequent oil changes?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
On another note, is the Nismo also a clutch-type?
The Carbonetic in my opinion is a much better choice as far as durability and drivability compared to a metal clutch type.
Carbonetic will require more frequent oil changes but the disks will last 5 to 6 times longer the metal type differentials. Not to mention the metal type being extremely noisy with a harsh engagement.
The Carbonetic in my opinion is a much better choice as far as durability and drivability compared to a metal clutch type.
The Carbonetic in my opinion is a much better choice as far as durability and drivability compared to a metal clutch type.
If I didn’t already have Quaife, I'd be looking into AutoTech's version.
Last I heard it was still under development for G & Z... but it might be ready by now?
http://www.autotech.com/prod_drive_wavetracDiffs.htm
Autotech used to be quaife america...and that's when there were availability issues fwiw. Since that distributorship is now with a another firm, there are no such issues.