eManage Ulimate--Almost here..and MUCH IMPROVED!
09-01-2005, 03:55 PM
#421
Originally Posted by spdkils
I've read thru the EU manual a few times now, looked over settings etc.
If I were to install the EU "WITH" the UniCHIP could I use the data logger to gather all the information needed to replace the uniCHIP with the EU @ the ~same~ settings?
(Read timing, read I/J Duty cycles, etc.)
Then just make a map to replace the uniCHIP.
(Since the Unichip actualy has LESS load points... And less overall features... I think it is substandard to the EU. However tuning on a load based dyno using the little injector/timing ***** would be VERY cool.)
spdkils
If I were to install the EU "WITH" the UniCHIP could I use the data logger to gather all the information needed to replace the uniCHIP with the EU @ the ~same~ settings?
(Read timing, read I/J Duty cycles, etc.)
Then just make a map to replace the uniCHIP.
(Since the Unichip actualy has LESS load points... And less overall features... I think it is substandard to the EU. However tuning on a load based dyno using the little injector/timing ***** would be VERY cool.)
spdkils
Interesting idea...but honestly...it would probably be faster just to retune from the EU from scratch.
09-03-2005, 10:09 PM
#422
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
In theory..yes...but this would take quite some time to gather all of the data in the Unichip. You would have to kit the vast majority of the load sites, and then save the logs.
Interesting idea...but honestly...it would probably be faster just to retune from the EU from scratch.
Interesting idea...but honestly...it would probably be faster just to retune from the EU from scratch.
We used the auto tune feature today... Its VERY cool.
Works like charm... I guess the only caveate is to ENSURE that you A/F on the LM/LC matches what the EU sees.
Also because it only modifies a SINGLE CELL at a time, and I believe the EU uses the avg for all cells around the cell you're in... Once you hit the cell it is going to modify... it will lean/richen it will get it "perfect" however the cells around it won't be.
So AVG those cells, find out what the number would be... and smooth the area... do it again.. this time it should be more scaled and have a good number in that cell. Smooth the area AGAIN... and repeat until it doesn't move the number, and all adjacent cells are 'smooth'.
Well... thats what worked well for us anyhow.
/example
15
-16
29
avg = 9 1/3rd.... So make the middle cell 9.5, the top one 8.0, and the bottom one 12 or 13... It seems to work well... is this sound advice? Maybe... try it... We didn't run lean... so... it seems to work all right.
We actualy used all cells adjacent to do the math... not just the top/bottom one. RPM lower/higer, as well as boost lower/higher then divided it by 5 to get the avg. Then smoothed the area using the outcome. It got us close...
spdkils
Last edited by spdkils; 09-03-2005 at 10:56 PM.
09-03-2005, 10:25 PM
#423
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Good Input - spdkils
spdkils
This is very good input to this subject.. The info you posted gives everyone a clearer understanding of how the Emanage-Ultima operated.. Very Cool
Cheers Amy
-
This is very good input to this subject.. The info you posted gives everyone a clearer understanding of how the Emanage-Ultima operated.. Very Cool
Cheers Amy
-
Originally Posted by spdkils
So I've been tuning my brothers 240...
We used the auto tune feature today... Its VERY cool.
Works like charm... I guess the only caveate is to ENSURE that you A/F on the LM/LC matches what the EU sees.
Also because it only modifies a SINGLE CELL, and I believe the EU uses the avg for all cells around the cell you're in... Once you hit the cell it is going to modify... it will lean/richen it will get it "perfect" however the cells around it won't be.
So AVG those cells, find out what the number would be... and smooth the area... do it again.. this time it should be more scaled and have a good number in that cell. Smooth the area AGAIN... and repeat until it doesn't move the number, and all adjacent cells are 'smooth'.
Well... thats what worked well for us anyhow.
/example
15
-16
29
avg = 9 1/3rd.... So make the middle cell 9.5, the top one 8.0, and the bottom one 12 or 13... It seems to work well... is this sound advice? Maybe... try it... We didn't run lean... so... it seems to work all right.
We actualy used all cells adjacent to do the math... not just the top/bottom one. RPM lower/higer, as well as boost lower/higher then divided it by 5 to get the avg. Then smoothed the area using the outcome. It got us close...
spdkils
We used the auto tune feature today... Its VERY cool.
Works like charm... I guess the only caveate is to ENSURE that you A/F on the LM/LC matches what the EU sees.
Also because it only modifies a SINGLE CELL, and I believe the EU uses the avg for all cells around the cell you're in... Once you hit the cell it is going to modify... it will lean/richen it will get it "perfect" however the cells around it won't be.
So AVG those cells, find out what the number would be... and smooth the area... do it again.. this time it should be more scaled and have a good number in that cell. Smooth the area AGAIN... and repeat until it doesn't move the number, and all adjacent cells are 'smooth'.
Well... thats what worked well for us anyhow.
/example
15
-16
29
avg = 9 1/3rd.... So make the middle cell 9.5, the top one 8.0, and the bottom one 12 or 13... It seems to work well... is this sound advice? Maybe... try it... We didn't run lean... so... it seems to work all right.
We actualy used all cells adjacent to do the math... not just the top/bottom one. RPM lower/higer, as well as boost lower/higher then divided it by 5 to get the avg. Then smoothed the area using the outcome. It got us close...
spdkils
09-04-2005, 05:34 PM
#424
Nice work. Yes, the AF target auto tune feature is very neat. I always caution customers, to insure they check the accuracy of their AF sensors frequently, as a defective or worn out lambda sensor can spell disaster.
Keep up the good work!
Keep up the good work!
09-07-2005, 02:16 PM
#425
I am still holding off on the EU until I decide to go with a fuel return system and up the boost some more, and until I see some testing results from some other systems such as the UTEC... However, I do have a question. I asked this back in the beginning of this thread, but it has never been answered... now that a couple people have it, and now that is has been tested and all, someone might be able to give an answer or opinion/thought...
If all the neccessary components (return fuel system, and such) were bought and installed on the car, would it be possible to safely tune the Z to lets say 450+rwhp on stock internals?
I have seen some Z's pushing 450+rwhp with other management systems, so I'm wondering if the same is achievable with the EU. The EU seems like a great tool, and so I would assume it would be possible. I'm just looking to get some feedback from some of the people that have the EU now, and I just want to see how confident they are in it. May be there's even somebody that has already achieved this with the EU...
If all the neccessary components (return fuel system, and such) were bought and installed on the car, would it be possible to safely tune the Z to lets say 450+rwhp on stock internals?
I have seen some Z's pushing 450+rwhp with other management systems, so I'm wondering if the same is achievable with the EU. The EU seems like a great tool, and so I would assume it would be possible. I'm just looking to get some feedback from some of the people that have the EU now, and I just want to see how confident they are in it. May be there's even somebody that has already achieved this with the EU...
Last edited by Jaki; 09-07-2005 at 02:19 PM.
09-07-2005, 04:15 PM
#426
450whp on a stock block is entirely possible. Only time will tell in terms of engine life and longevity. The two critical pieces of a safe FI system are a proper return fuel system, and precise and accurate tuning. If you have these two elements dialed in correctly, there is no reason that an EU car, or a Unichip car can achieve this goal.
09-07-2005, 07:41 PM
#427
so far the emanage ultimate has been a nitemare to install.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
09-07-2005, 09:15 PM
#428
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Originally Posted by sentry65
so far the emanage ultimate has been a nitemare to install.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
sharif can give u all the guidance you/your shop will need...dont bother calling greddy, they don't know...u can pm me if u like, i can try to supply some of the answers that i was given from sharif
09-07-2005, 10:06 PM
#429
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I spent an afternoon soldering on the Autosport harness, not too difficult. The wires are all labeled. If you have any questions, shoot them our way. Don't hate the EU just because your shop has had problems, it is really a great unit.
09-07-2005, 10:45 PM
#430
Originally Posted by sentry65
so far the emanage ultimate has been a nitemare to install.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
I just can't believe this. My shop claims to have taken 15 hours to install it. They say the instruction booklet is completely screwed up. That the wire diagrams are totally screwed up. They had to call Greddy. Greddy doesn't care. 15 (suposively) hours later it's finally installed. They still havent done crap to load the software or tune it. I haven't had very good luck with the shop I chose. I'll leave a lot of the details out because they're still not done and maybe they'll do something to make up for my trouble. I'm going to be without my car for 4 days because they're installing it.
I'm really starting to wish I didn't get the emanage ultimate and just waited for the Utech.....
This sounds like an issue with the shop, rather than the EU. I can understand your frustration though.....
Greddy CS is difficult at times...call me instead.
09-08-2005, 06:04 AM
#432
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I'd have to say it's your shop too, not the EU. I found the EU easy to install, and although I do have wiring experience I wouldn't think it'd be difficult for someone who's new to it to do it properly as the instructions and diagrams are very self-explanatory. The installation manual is decent.
I'd only make one note on a mistake I found: the Analog Input/Output pins are correct in the pinout chart on page 11 but then reversed mistakenly on the diagram on page 19. IIRC input is pin 31 and output is 37.
I'd only make one note on a mistake I found: the Analog Input/Output pins are correct in the pinout chart on page 11 but then reversed mistakenly on the diagram on page 19. IIRC input is pin 31 and output is 37.
09-08-2005, 09:17 AM
#433
well we'll see what ends up happening with my shop. I've just had the worst experience with them, but will give them the opportunity to make it right with me since they haven't billed me yet since my car is STILL in the shop waiting to get on their dyno - which I was told I should have been able to do that anytime this week, but they ended up renting out their dyno to a race team for the week and won't let my car on it until they're done.
My installer turns out his' partially color blind too......had to have a lot of other people confirm that the right wire is hooked up to the right thing. There's just a lot of things I'm frusturated about with them, but I'll do them the respect to not bash the crap out of them and run their name thru the dirt until they have the opportunity to make things right with me because I understand that crap happens. I'm trying to be the cool understanding customer. I suppose that makes them feel like if someone were to get bumped, I'd be someone to bump since I'm laid back when I'm there.
Something is up though. The installer went over with me shoing me his notes sketched on the EU manual showing that their pin out diagrams were all wrong. That he had to move all sorts of jumpers around. Last night I hung out until closing cause it seemed like there was this chance I was going to get my car back last night. They ended up getting a fair amount of work done (like 2 hours worth) and they were getting ready to send me out on my way without first loading the EU software and plugging their crap into the EU to adjust the settings - the idea of getting on the dyno was non-existent and they didn't seem thrilled about hooking a wideband A/F up and driving down the street to make sure my car wouldn't blow up or something. I had to actually step in and say hey I'm not comfortable with driving my car with no idea of what it's settings are set at let alone reading what they actually are. The head guy agreed and my car gets to stay there another 2 days until the dyno is available to use.
Everyone around the shop was saying how the installer has been working his butt off on my car - like 15 hours. I think (hope) they're just saying that to make me feel better as in they're not neglecting my car. If they end up charging me 15 hours to install the EU, I'm flat out going to take legal action if they're not willing to make things right with me.
I guess I should have bought the autosport harness huh? I just bought the EU and EU harness. If that would have saved me all this grief, I would have bought the autosport harness in a heartbeat. I was under the impression it would make things smoother, but only save maybe an hour of work
My installer turns out his' partially color blind too......had to have a lot of other people confirm that the right wire is hooked up to the right thing. There's just a lot of things I'm frusturated about with them, but I'll do them the respect to not bash the crap out of them and run their name thru the dirt until they have the opportunity to make things right with me because I understand that crap happens. I'm trying to be the cool understanding customer. I suppose that makes them feel like if someone were to get bumped, I'd be someone to bump since I'm laid back when I'm there.
Something is up though. The installer went over with me shoing me his notes sketched on the EU manual showing that their pin out diagrams were all wrong. That he had to move all sorts of jumpers around. Last night I hung out until closing cause it seemed like there was this chance I was going to get my car back last night. They ended up getting a fair amount of work done (like 2 hours worth) and they were getting ready to send me out on my way without first loading the EU software and plugging their crap into the EU to adjust the settings - the idea of getting on the dyno was non-existent and they didn't seem thrilled about hooking a wideband A/F up and driving down the street to make sure my car wouldn't blow up or something. I had to actually step in and say hey I'm not comfortable with driving my car with no idea of what it's settings are set at let alone reading what they actually are. The head guy agreed and my car gets to stay there another 2 days until the dyno is available to use.
Everyone around the shop was saying how the installer has been working his butt off on my car - like 15 hours. I think (hope) they're just saying that to make me feel better as in they're not neglecting my car. If they end up charging me 15 hours to install the EU, I'm flat out going to take legal action if they're not willing to make things right with me.
I guess I should have bought the autosport harness huh? I just bought the EU and EU harness. If that would have saved me all this grief, I would have bought the autosport harness in a heartbeat. I was under the impression it would make things smoother, but only save maybe an hour of work
Last edited by sentry65; 09-08-2005 at 09:21 AM.
09-08-2005, 09:34 AM
#434
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The Autosport harness was key to an easy installl. I installed my Emange blue without it and it took several hours of frustration. When I upgraded to the Ultimate, the Autosport was a no-brainer.
09-08-2005, 09:36 AM
#435
hmm yeah i guess i seriously messed up then and am going to have to pay out my nose for this pos
apparently I got a completely way off idea about the autosport harness not being a huge deal - that thing could have saved me probalby $1000 in installation fees. I'm seriously pissed. Last night I utterly destroyed my keyboard because of all this. WTF didn't anyone say the autosport harness is a must have item for installing this thing without spending 2 days trying to wire it up?
the shop originally told me they'd need my car for most of 1 day to get it done and tuned. I dropped it off 2 days ago on tuesday
to date, this thing has been the biggest freaking mistake I've ever decided to have put on my car
sorry for all the ranting, just so frusturated and it's completely consuming me so I can't even get any work done today
apparently I got a completely way off idea about the autosport harness not being a huge deal - that thing could have saved me probalby $1000 in installation fees. I'm seriously pissed. Last night I utterly destroyed my keyboard because of all this. WTF didn't anyone say the autosport harness is a must have item for installing this thing without spending 2 days trying to wire it up?
the shop originally told me they'd need my car for most of 1 day to get it done and tuned. I dropped it off 2 days ago on tuesday
to date, this thing has been the biggest freaking mistake I've ever decided to have put on my car
sorry for all the ranting, just so frusturated and it's completely consuming me so I can't even get any work done today
Last edited by sentry65; 09-08-2005 at 09:52 AM.
09-08-2005, 09:47 AM
#436
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Originally Posted by sentry65
hmm yeah i guess i seriously messed up then and am going to have to pay out my nose for this pos
apparently I got a completely way off idea about the autosport harness not being a huge deal - that thing could have saved me probalby $1000 in installation fees. I'm seriously pissed. I utterly destroyed my keyboard last night because of all this
apparently I got a completely way off idea about the autosport harness not being a huge deal - that thing could have saved me probalby $1000 in installation fees. I'm seriously pissed. I utterly destroyed my keyboard last night because of all this
hey man... it's not your fault that this guy is colorblind and learning "how to" with your car...you shouldn't pay for it...figure out his hourly charge and pay no more than 4-5 hrs tops!!!
have the installer contact sharif so he can clear it up...
and BTW, i haven't got on the dyno yet (would like to soon to dial in my timing more carefully),...my car is pretty much dialed just from datalogging on the street. pm me if you have any questions...
(I just bought the innovative XD-1 too, so that will ensure that my mixtures are right on--what type of wideband are you running? did you get the harness to link it to the ultimate?-very helpful!!!
--i will be selling a fairly new AEM wideband if anybody is interested)
hey: if you drive out here (6hrs or so to albuquerque)..i'll wire it with you for free
09-08-2005, 09:57 AM
#437
yeah thanks, hopefully they don't try to pull some crap and rape me. I'll raise hell if they try any of that.
I made a point to them several times that Sharif has offered to answer questions and even had a couple of the my350Z theads copied to a CD of installation tips/troubleshooting stuff. I don't think he ever bothered with any of that, but I made it a point to him a few times that those resources were available
I made a point to them several times that Sharif has offered to answer questions and even had a couple of the my350Z theads copied to a CD of installation tips/troubleshooting stuff. I don't think he ever bothered with any of that, but I made it a point to him a few times that those resources were available
09-08-2005, 10:03 AM
#438
Sentry, I am starting to get more and more uncomfortable with this shop. Please make sure they are very careful with the tuning, and understand how the EU and software operate. I would not allow them to tune the car if it was their first experience with the EU, or at least the emanage blue.
The jumpers are correct from the factory. They shouldnt need any changes, unless one was misplaced accidentally. I am 100% sure that the pins and wires needed for the 350Z install are all correct.
The autosport isnt manditory, but should save about 1 hr labor. There are other things going on here that are causing the delay. I really do feel for you, and I hope the end result is satisfactory. I can tell the guys at your shop are at least TRYING to make this correct.
Let us know how it works out.
The jumpers are correct from the factory. They shouldnt need any changes, unless one was misplaced accidentally. I am 100% sure that the pins and wires needed for the 350Z install are all correct.
The autosport isnt manditory, but should save about 1 hr labor. There are other things going on here that are causing the delay. I really do feel for you, and I hope the end result is satisfactory. I can tell the guys at your shop are at least TRYING to make this correct.
Let us know how it works out.
09-08-2005, 10:22 AM
#440
alright, well just got off the phone and the shop isn't going to charge me a crazy amount. They're going to charge me basically 6 hours for installing the emanage, then 2 hours for trans fluid, bleeding the brakes and clutch fluid, spark plugs, clutch line etc. So basically it's about what I thought it'd be only it took a few days to actually happen
So I'll get my car tomorrow morning and road tune it for an hour or two.
I'm still not sure what to make of them saying the wiring diagram in the manual was wrong. My car is a 2002 aug build date and apparently when he talked to greddy, greddy told them over the phone what the proper pin outs should be so who knows, maybe he was looking at the wrong thing or something, but he supposivly got the true wiring diagram from them over the phone and he had someone double check his work (since he's 30% colorblind)
sorry for all the venting. I usually expect things to not go smooth, but this has been crazy
So I'll get my car tomorrow morning and road tune it for an hour or two.
I'm still not sure what to make of them saying the wiring diagram in the manual was wrong. My car is a 2002 aug build date and apparently when he talked to greddy, greddy told them over the phone what the proper pin outs should be so who knows, maybe he was looking at the wrong thing or something, but he supposivly got the true wiring diagram from them over the phone and he had someone double check his work (since he's 30% colorblind)
sorry for all the venting. I usually expect things to not go smooth, but this has been crazy