TurboXS Announces the Z UTEC Release
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Actually its closer to the HKS F-con pro. Full timing control, separate injector drivers, extra soleniod control, etc etc. It can do a lot more than the emanage ultimate. This is all base on my knowledge of similar Turboxs products.
-Tuan
-Tuan
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Think of it as a standalone at full throttle and nothing at low loads/throttle. At a preset point(tps based) it stops letting the ecu control the fuel and ignition and creates its signals that are sent to the ecu. It has it's own ignition and fuel injector drivers. My question is there a way to use low impedence injectors? I know that it will scale the maf voltage to the ecu at all times so we can run bigger injectors but can it actually drive the injectors itself at all times using low impedence injectors?
I love the UTEC. I know it well from the WRX days. If you can navigate around hyperterminal you are good to go(if you know something about tuning). This thing could blow your engine up just as easy as the EU as Sharif has warned all of you about.
I love the UTEC. I know it well from the WRX days. If you can navigate around hyperterminal you are good to go(if you know something about tuning). This thing could blow your engine up just as easy as the EU as Sharif has warned all of you about.
Originally Posted by XBS
I still don't understand is this a full stand alone systems or basically a piggy back like emanage ultimate?
Last edited by theking; 08-19-2005 at 01:28 PM.
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Okay guys, I'll try to answer as many questions here as I can since I have tuned this product MANY times.
With regards to ignition timing, the UTEC is full stand alone. You do not make +/- changes by percentage ar any of that garbage. You enter the exact timing for that load site.
The fuel control is piggyback, so you'd be adding or subtracting from the factory load sites.
The UTEC communicates through Hyper Terminal. I find it sort of primitive, but it does work. You can tune several maps that can be switched on the fly if you have the external switch. If not, you can switch the maps on the ecu box itself.
The UTEC can be used to tune all load sites, not just the WOT areas. You do have the option, however, to enter "ecu" into any load site. Obviously this will revert that particular site back to factory parameters.
Changes made to maps are not real time, but this isn't a huge deal at all. You basically just make your changes and exit and save.
Injector scaling is another cool feature.
Knock control threshholds are adjustable, but beware. The best way to set the threshholds if you decide to modify them is with a set of det cans. Turbo XS actually has a setup they sell called the Pro Tuner with built in det cans and wideband. VERY cool. It will also interface with the UTEC.
The datalogger is also sort of primitive, but again, it works. Logs are read in raw data form, but I'm sure you excel wizards can make cool graphs if you like.
I know I'm leaving stuff out, but I'll try to help answer any questions.
With regards to ignition timing, the UTEC is full stand alone. You do not make +/- changes by percentage ar any of that garbage. You enter the exact timing for that load site.
The fuel control is piggyback, so you'd be adding or subtracting from the factory load sites.
The UTEC communicates through Hyper Terminal. I find it sort of primitive, but it does work. You can tune several maps that can be switched on the fly if you have the external switch. If not, you can switch the maps on the ecu box itself.
The UTEC can be used to tune all load sites, not just the WOT areas. You do have the option, however, to enter "ecu" into any load site. Obviously this will revert that particular site back to factory parameters.
Changes made to maps are not real time, but this isn't a huge deal at all. You basically just make your changes and exit and save.
Injector scaling is another cool feature.
Knock control threshholds are adjustable, but beware. The best way to set the threshholds if you decide to modify them is with a set of det cans. Turbo XS actually has a setup they sell called the Pro Tuner with built in det cans and wideband. VERY cool. It will also interface with the UTEC.
The datalogger is also sort of primitive, but again, it works. Logs are read in raw data form, but I'm sure you excel wizards can make cool graphs if you like.
I know I'm leaving stuff out, but I'll try to help answer any questions.
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Originally Posted by aalzuhair
What about rev limiter and speed limiter, will the UTEC have full control over it?
Az
Az
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STFU: (sorry, that sounds rude even though it's your screenname!)
Thanks for commenting on the UTEC... a couple more questions:
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
Thanks for commenting on the UTEC... a couple more questions:
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
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Originally Posted by zero2prove
Actually its closer to the HKS F-con pro. Full timing control, separate injector drivers, extra soleniod control, etc etc. It can do a lot more than the emanage ultimate. This is all base on my knowledge of similar Turboxs products.
-Tuan
-Tuan
Actually, its very simliar to the eManage Ultimate in many ways, and a little bit better in a couple of areas.
The EU has drivers for the injectors and coils...the EU fires them. It is still dependent on the factory signal, but adds IPW directly, vs. adjusting the MAF signal.
The great feature on the UTEC that I like is the ability to set the numerical value for timing, just like a full standalone. The EU displays real time timing, but at this point, you cant "set" the timing. I can see in the software, that it has this function preset, but the software coding needed to make it work is still being developed by Greddy.
I will be getting a test unit shortly, and would like to see how the functionality and tunabily compares to the EU.
One area that "may" be an issue is for very high boost cars, where 80-100% fuel increases may be needed. At present time, the UTEC can increase fuel +/- 50% via MAF offset. The EU can increase fuel 100% via IPW increases directly.
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so nobody has answered my original question, does the UTEC alter the pulsewidths directly or simply modify the MAF input signal to force the ECU to change its output? kind of sounds like the latter, which is way inferior to the former IMO. If we're going to go that route we might as well use the Haltech interceptor and at least get a GUI The biggest thing that concerns me about the faked MAF inputs is what sorts of other things will get changed since the ECU thinks the motor is running under a different set of conditions than it actually is... eg. what about variable cam timing? if we're telling the ECU that airflow is half as much as it actually is, the stock ECU may do something completely non-optimal (with respect to WOT performance) with the cam timing... it will also likely change the ignition timing, which may not matter if we completely remap all conditions, but could certainly screw up anything mapped as "ECU"...
any more comments on this guys?
any more comments on this guys?
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Originally Posted by 2JZfan
STFU: (sorry, that sounds rude even though it's your screenname!)
Thanks for commenting on the UTEC... a couple more questions:
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
Thanks for commenting on the UTEC... a couple more questions:
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
As far as the scalar applying to those load sites that are marked ecu, I don't think so. The ecu sites are reverted back to the factory computer. I could be wrong on this, but I doubt it from what I remember. I rarely use the ecu setting, so it has never been something I explore.
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Originally Posted by 2JZfan
so nobody has answered my original question, does the UTEC alter the pulsewidths directly or simply modify the MAF input signal to force the ECU to change its output?
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The UTEC doesn't turn on above any tps. The UTEC is always on. You can set it to ecu at any load site if you like.
Fuel Control- The UTEC takes control of your vehicles fuelling at a define-able TPS point that is programmable. Fuel is tuned by an MAF offset table, a simple but effective technique. The load reference we use is RPM vs. MAF Voltage. The UTEC can also take in our optional MAP sensor to tune RPM vs. MAP or you can just use the MAP reading in your datalogs. This allows the fuel map to be adjusted at each of the 250 rpm resolution with over 10 different load sites from zero to rev limit.
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could someone who has used both comment on the feasibility of swapping the APS unichip (for ST in my case) for the UTEC? while i think (haven't confirmed) altered atmosphere can tune my unichip (or a couple places in connecticut), it would be nice to be able to do it myself.
ahm
ahm
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Originally Posted by amolaver
could someone who has used both comment on the feasibility of swapping the APS unichip (for ST in my case) for the UTEC? while i think (haven't confirmed) altered atmosphere can tune my unichip (or a couple places in connecticut), it would be nice to be able to do it myself.
ahm
ahm
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As sharif said as long as you are close enough(within 50%) to get the af right then this is perfect. Since you can drive the ignition directly you don't have to worry about the maf change putting you on a different spot in reguards to timing. If you are running the right injectors for your horsepower level then it should cause no problems.
Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
It changes the MAF input to the stock ECU which results in the stock ECU adding more fuel.
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Jermaine,
Can you elaborate on the fuel control strategy? Piggybacks mostly seem to be broken up into two groups - a) one that "fakes" a load signal to trick the factory ECU to output a different injector pulsewidth and b) one that actually intercepts and modifies the control signals on their way to the individual injectors (like the new E-Manage Ultimate). Which group does the UTEC fall into?
Also, it sounds like from your description that spark is controlled directly by the UTEC. Is that correct? Does it actually have 6 individual ignition drivers? If so, any comments on the liklihood of coils being fried in the key-on, no-run condition like we see with the E-Manage?
Thanks,
Jeff
Can you elaborate on the fuel control strategy? Piggybacks mostly seem to be broken up into two groups - a) one that "fakes" a load signal to trick the factory ECU to output a different injector pulsewidth and b) one that actually intercepts and modifies the control signals on their way to the individual injectors (like the new E-Manage Ultimate). Which group does the UTEC fall into?
Also, it sounds like from your description that spark is controlled directly by the UTEC. Is that correct? Does it actually have 6 individual ignition drivers? If so, any comments on the liklihood of coils being fried in the key-on, no-run condition like we see with the E-Manage?
Thanks,
Jeff
The UTEC has the hardware drivers to basically drive the car without the stock ecu but that is not the design that we want. We actually have drivers for the following VTC, Drive By Wire, Ignition Coils and Injectors. I am probably missing some other things as well but those are the main things. The UTEC even has the ability to communicate with your vehicles CAN-BUS (this will not be enabled in the original software). The Nissan Engineers spent countless hours making a car drive smooth, why would you want to re-engineer those efforts. Your time would be best suited driving and enjoying not tuning tip in enrichments schemes. The UTEC is a hybrid called a parallel engine management system.
The UTEC will not fry coils if the key is left on for long periods of time. If that happens that is just bad engineering and we wouldn't release a product that does that, I personally wouldn't even buy something that does that. The UTEC will emulate whatever the stock ECU would do under start up conditions. So if the coil were to actually fry, it would have done the same without the UTEC.
so how'd this compare with the Emanage Ultimate?
What about NA cars? I'm sure this would go pretty good with the NA Zs correct? What's up with this neglection of NA cars and engine management components being placed on the FI forum?
I wonder if we can also remove/modify the rev limiter and maybe even the speed limiter like you can with the emanage
The UTEC has the drivers on board to control VTC as well, I don't have a potential date for the availability of this software version but this will definitely help getting turbochargers spooled quicker.
When will this be available? Let me know if you need a tester
-Tuan
-Tuan
[quote]
you have no idea how happy I am to hear these news..
Way to go TurboXS, I'm very excited to hear and see more. I'm also available in case you need any testing help. My car is bone stock with just a jwt intake.
Way to go TurboXS, I'm very excited to hear and see more. I'm also available in case you need any testing help. My car is bone stock with just a jwt intake.
Looks very promising. I believe the retail price is around $1000 or so, plus MAP sensor for the FI guys. I would assume you can use an existing MAP sensor and ouput that to the UTEC. I can't wait to test one of these units out. I am very happy that more manufactueres are getting into the ECU game with the VQ. IMHO, the more options the customers have...the better.
how many maps does the Emanage Ultimate allow?
It'd be nice to have 3 maps for NA
1 for performance on pump gas
1 for gas mileage
1 for race gas and even more performance
It'd be nice to have 3 maps for NA
1 for performance on pump gas
1 for gas mileage
1 for race gas and even more performance
So i've been looking around at some WRX tuning forums where the UTEC is big...
looks like this thing (or at least the subie version) uses a text based interface through a terminal program? is that the deal with the Z one? I can type 80+ words/minute and have been writing assembly code for more than half of my life, so i'm not exactly "scared" of a text interface, but when I'm blasting down the road and trying to tune with my non-steering-wheel-hand I think i'd prefer a GUI of some sort...
also looks like you basically tell this thing when to kick in and the rest of the time the factory computer runs the show... i see lots about tuning strategies that have to work hand-in-hand with the factory ECU (eg. making changes to minimize learned fuel corrections and having to coerce the factory ECU into accepting different injector sizes even with the UTEC in place) -- not exactly what I'd consider full fuel control like an F-Con... is this subie specific or what?
phunk, based on your comments it sounds like you've actually used one of these things before, can you shed some light on the tuning interface? hopefully this WRX forum i found was just a misinformation site put up by Greddy to keep interest high on the E-manage and the real UTEC is nothing like this
flame away!
looks like this thing (or at least the subie version) uses a text based interface through a terminal program? is that the deal with the Z one? I can type 80+ words/minute and have been writing assembly code for more than half of my life, so i'm not exactly "scared" of a text interface, but when I'm blasting down the road and trying to tune with my non-steering-wheel-hand I think i'd prefer a GUI of some sort...
also looks like you basically tell this thing when to kick in and the rest of the time the factory computer runs the show... i see lots about tuning strategies that have to work hand-in-hand with the factory ECU (eg. making changes to minimize learned fuel corrections and having to coerce the factory ECU into accepting different injector sizes even with the UTEC in place) -- not exactly what I'd consider full fuel control like an F-Con... is this subie specific or what?
phunk, based on your comments it sounds like you've actually used one of these things before, can you shed some light on the tuning interface? hopefully this WRX forum i found was just a misinformation site put up by Greddy to keep interest high on the E-manage and the real UTEC is nothing like this
flame away!
The UTEC's Open Loop Fuelling Systems when tuned correctly has a flawless hand off between the factory ECU and UTEC. Lets not get it confused we could control fuel just like the F-Con but this is not our goal. It would leave you with hours of restructuring a fuel table for every condition possible and then hoping it works for conditions you have not tuned for. Our goal is less time tuning more time enjoying your vehicle.
Thanks for commenting on the UTEC... a couple more questions:
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
some have mentioned that the UTEC only kicks in above a certain TPS, IMO this is no good for a turbo car where you can still have significant boost at half throttle under one condition (going up a steep hill in a high gear) and vacuum at half throttle under another condition (going down a hill in a low gear). So assume we set the UTEC up to be "on" at all TPS readings, then does it just come down to where we put "ECU" in the map vs. where we put an actual number (as far as determining who's running the show)? And what about running larger injectors, does the injector scalar still apply globally even if we are opting for "ECU" mapping or even if we haven't reached the target TPS?
Thanks,
Jeff
One area that "may" be an issue is for very high boost cars, where 80-100% fuel increases may be needed. At present time, the UTEC can increase fuel +/- 50% via MAF offset. The EU can increase fuel 100% via IPW increases directly.