Originally Posted by biggersNISMO

I respectfully disagree with your statement here. From the information and feedback posted on t h e 3 7 0 z (. ) c o m, a lot of the 370z guys are chosing GTM over Stillen. There's actually people who have ditched Stillens SC system and gone with GTM's becaused of hot start issues, canned tune problems, and other experiences.

Originally Posted by ronn1

There's one big fly in the ointment...for Calif owners, GTM doesn't have CARB approval. As far as issues with Stillen Kit vs GTM and people swapping the two...I can't comment...but I bet you can't show me more than ONE that did that...and that single instance wouldn't rise to the the level any significance for the total # of 370 Stillen kits *out there*. If you can document MULIPLE instances of this, please post it here. I would be interested.

Originally Posted by biggersNISMO

GTM has already promised they will have CARB approval shortly, and I believe Sam will come through eventually... (kind of like how Stillen promised a SC for the HR 3 years ago and eventually delivered)... I'm not going to speculate how much market share Stillen has in the 370z SC community, but it is clear many on the other members on the 370z forums are preferring GTM's product.

So far, no one has returned a GTM SC for a Stillen SC, but yet someone has returned the Stillen SC to get a GTM SC. That speaks for itself.

the 3 70 z ----> TechArea ----> Engine & Drivetrain ----> Forced Induction. (anyone can find info, if they chose to search, i won't do it for them)

I'm not bashing Stillen or praising GTM. I'm just pointing out that there is plenty of info on both products (not on this forum specifically, but its out there). Both products have been bought and tested in the real world by independent users. Both have had problems. (GTM with the fluttering problems) & (Stillen with 7 different canned tunes that have been a let down). I can't expect a product to be perfect... Or can I??? (after the amount of money put into buying the product one would hope so).

Anyways, the information is out there. And if someone is serious about buying a product, they will do their research on it, before investing. I'm not going to clutter this thread with bashing. Josh and Kyle @ Stillen can defend their product if they wish. And Sam @ GTM can defend his own.

ronn1 can pm me if you wish to quarrel, but i have no beef with you. I wish you well in all your endeavors. good day sir.

Originally Posted by biggersNISMO

GTM has already promised they will have CARB approval shortly, and I believe Sam will come through eventually... (kind of like how Stillen promised a SC for the HR 3 years ago and eventually delivered)... I'm not going to speculate how much market share Stillen has in the 370z SC community, but it is clear many on the other members on the 370z forums are preferring GTM's product.

So far, no one has returned a GTM SC for a Stillen SC, but yet someone has returned the Stillen SC to get a GTM SC. That speaks for itself.

the 3 70 z ----> TechArea ----> Engine & Drivetrain ----> Forced Induction. (anyone can find info, if they chose to search, i won't do it for them)

I'm not bashing Stillen or praising GTM. I'm just pointing out that there is plenty of info on both products (not on this forum specifically, but its out there). Both products have been bought and tested in the real world by independent users. Both have had problems. (GTM with the fluttering problems) & (Stillen with 7 different canned tunes that have been a let down). I can't expect a product to be perfect... Or can I??? (after the amount of money put into buying the product one would hope so).

Anyways, the information is out there. And if someone is serious about buying a product, they will do their research on it, before investing. I'm not going to clutter this thread with bashing. Josh and Kyle @ Stillen can defend their product if they wish. And Sam @ GTM can defend his own.

ronn1 can pm me if you wish to quarrel, but i have no beef with you. I wish you well in all your endeavors. good day sir.

Originally Posted by biggersNISMO

GTM has already promised they will have CARB approval shortly, and I believe Sam will come through eventually... (kind of like how Stillen promised a SC for the HR 3 years ago and eventually delivered)... I'm not going to speculate how much market share Stillen has in the 370z SC community, but it is clear many on the other members on the 370z forums are preferring GTM's product.

So far, no one has returned a GTM SC for a Stillen SC, but yet someone has returned the Stillen SC to get a GTM SC. That speaks for itself.

the 3 70 z ----> TechArea ----> Engine & Drivetrain ----> Forced Induction. (anyone can find info, if they chose to search, i won't do it for them)

I'm not bashing Stillen or praising GTM. I'm just pointing out that there is plenty of info on both products (not on this forum specifically, but its out there). Both products have been bought and tested in the real world by independent users. Both have had problems. (GTM with the fluttering problems) & (Stillen with 7 different canned tunes that have been a let down). I can't expect a product to be perfect... Or can I??? (after the amount of money put into buying the product one would hope so).

Anyways, the information is out there. And if someone is serious about buying a product, they will do their research on it, before investing. I'm not going to clutter this thread with bashing. Josh and Kyle @ Stillen can defend their product if they wish. And Sam @ GTM can defend his own.

ronn1 can pm me if you wish to quarrel, but i have no beef with you. I wish you well in all your endeavors. good day sir.

Originally Posted by 350z006

Wake up and smell the coffee...not once has GTM successfully gotten CARB approval for any of their FI products; and my money is that they never will ...too much time and money involved, leave it to biggest companies to get stuff like that done...

That being said, I do feel that the GTM SC kit for the HR has more potential for power (that's the real reason why you think it's the preferred kit), but do you know why? Because it's setup is harder to CARB...I'm positive the reason the Stillen kit seems so cumbersome is because they actually took the time and the money to ensure their kit passes CARB...

Originally Posted by ronn1

CARB is really what sets them apart...at least for prospective Cali customers.
No way I'm going to put in a kit that's not going pass Cali smog when that time comes. Performance potential aside, personally I don't want a 450WHP street car that's going to be on the ragged edge as far as motor and tranny.
BTW..you characterized Stillen as *cumbersome*...to me it's a pretty clean set up...no maze of pipes and intercooler plumbing. The only unique plumbing is the water to air set up, which is pretty unobtrusive to me.

Originally Posted by 350z006

Oh...don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the Vortech blowers being used on the Stillen kit, much better than the roots setup on the DE Stillen kit, and I'm also a Vortech owner myself (with a CARB sticker, if I may add)

However that water-air setup to me limits how much you can upgrade the Stillen HR kit...for me if i want to pulley down or change blowers to increase boost, I can just upgrade the air-to-air intercooler...can't just do that with that air-water setup...

Originally Posted by ronn1

Have them take a look at the pics in this thread...very detailed. It's a G37 set up but should be identical for 350Z. Pretty FOOKIN' SWEET..NO?

http://forums.nicoclub.com/beshoff-s...l-t497533.html

















Coolant Pump for Intercooler:


Air to water IC exchanger:








Wallpro 255 fuel pump:


INSTALLED:

Originally Posted by weiboy718

Hey, that's my car!

Originally Posted by ronn1

Yep..that's what I thought. Care to share the whole *story* with us
I just posted Stillen's response to your *epic* experience (see post #43 here) so please lay it all out for us...AGAIN.

Originally Posted by weiboy718

nah! i'd rather not go through this again! although i did had a bad experience with the S/C kit but the other products i've gotten from them had been flawless and got nothing but good things to say. their customer service was awesome too, they've always been there whether i had a question or a problem. it was answered fairly quick!

i was an early adopter for their S/C i'm sure you know that. i'm probably just one of the few who had issues however they sold plenty kit's out there yielding great results and running without issues. plus now their kit is CARB legal which is a very very good thing for us CA guys. if this is the route you wanna take i'd say go for it!

Originally Posted by weiboy718

first off, the car was dropped off perfectly fine with no DETONATION whatsoever!
the detonation is noticed right after the kit got installed. yes, my dealer did perform a warranty work right after the kit is installed because they've noticed that the vvel wasn't functioning properly. after they tear down the front timing cover and i was told by the tech only the timing cover gasket was torn and everything else is perfectly fine but they did replaced a lot of stuff in there. so what if they warrantied the parts inside there are you guys saying that my dealer is incompetent in working on the vvel. it could've very well been your crappy tunes that broked it in the first place.

okay, so after everything got fixed and i was sent home. the car pulls like crazy especially on the higher rpm's and i thought i was happy but i was wrong. for some unknown reasons after a 30-40min drive the car will lose some power and you can hear this hammering sound coming from the engine when i accelerate and of course i knew that was detonation. even tho i told them that i'm having these symptoms they didn't do anything at the time. then a week or 2 flies by they had found out that this pulley was making too much boost and needed to revise the pulley to an actual 8psi pulley and they'll have to detune the car till they get the new pulley in. i go in and get detuned, after that my car isn't driveable at all. there were hesitation when you gas, everything was getting super hot under the engine bay, it was all bad. i then called up Josh@Stillen and told them what was the problem and why it isn't driveable? he's unsure of the problem and all the tech's are gone home already so he wasn't able to help. that's when i told him that i'll bring the car down to their facility and fix whatever they need to and get me running. that was the first time i went down there. okay, we went down there and got tuned finally but even then i still had that clicking noise upon driving off and the only way to get that noise gone is to rev up the rpm to about 1.8k-2k. the head tech even tried and bump up the rpm just to get that noise away. little did i know that noise is detonation, an VQ expert told me that. plus i never had that before the kit. (i hardly have any now since the special weiboy tune)drove home and the first time me and my friend noticed is the rpm is all over the place and sometimes stall out upon coming to a stop sign, i didn't complain much about that since it's really not a big of a deal that's y you haven't heard much about it but Josh should know since i've been talking to him only. he may forget, doesn't matter! i did tell him and not making this ish up like you're saying that i am.

whatever! i'll skip it to part where you said you guys were so nice to have fly down just to pick up my car.

that time i received a new tune from you guys. (R6) flashed it, car had lot's of power down low but sucked up top. i took it out to Z Car Garage and got it dyno'ed. car only made this much power with lot's of detonation.
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/55532013@N03/5147353335/" title="stillen2 by weiboy718, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1386/5147353335_0ed3f4ce06.jpg" width="500" height="398" alt="stillen2" /></a>
at that time you guys were suppose to be bringing in another car from another member but somehow that didn't happened so that's when you guys wanted my car and i agreed to it and that you would fly down here to pick it up and drive back to my door which did not happened. i did not request you guys to do this. you had asked and i agreed so of course you gotta pay for everything. at that time i was not using R8! i was on R6 which gave out detonation even on the high end. i still have that datalog if anybody is interested in looking at lol. so the trip went fine and my power bumped from 377whp back to 410! wow! really! just a simple trip back down there got me 30whp more lol. the dyno sheet i got from them isn't even on the date that my car was there lol. got home, the tune still got some tip in detonation especially on hot days! the car will get heat soaked after being stucked in traffic and can get completely undriveable at all. this one time i almost got stuck on a hill when the car kept on jerking and even on 1st gear it had a hard time climbing it like the engine was choking on something. the morning drives is perfect tho. got good power and everything with no detonation. so how do you explain that? detonation is much more noticeable when it's hot but not when it's cold.

in the beginning your customer service is so good that i was praising you guys like god even tho there is problems with the kit or tunes. i chose to ignore that and had even defended you guys from other people. that was dumb! i'm pretty sure there are other people who is having the same symptom as me. let me dig it up on the370!

[Well here goes; The first thing I noticed was that the tip-in knock that I was] [experiencing was gone. The power is down a bit below 3K rpm and I presume it's] [because they removed timing down low to eliminate the tip-in knock.]

see! i'm not the only one here with tip in detonation. my tip in detonation is gone also but there's just no power then what's the point of having this kit? it's crap and i can't wait to get it off my car which is schedule to be removed this month by ***. till then Stillen can say that my car is the main source for all the problems. i can't wait to get it all done just so you guys can shut up and accept the fact that your kit and tunes is the problem and stop blaming it on other people's car's.

Originally Posted by biggersNISMO

After reading the entire thread and what was said (in the quoted posts and in the ones following), i was alarmed at first. But im glad to hear your still happy with Stillen. Maybe its just me over reacting over your experience, sorry.

Car looks sickkkk by the way. Nice!

Originally Posted by weiboy718

Awww dam! You really went around to dig that up.

All good, I moved on and thanks.

Originally Posted by ronn1

You now seem a little reluctant to discuss the details of your experience with Stillen SC and even somewhat *apologetic* in your tone. I find this a bit strange. Do you now think you were a bit premature in your condemnation of their kit? It was an early application with *teething* problems...maybe that was it? I do appreciate your feedback on this issue. BTW..off topic but how is the GTM treating you? How do you feel about having to eventually having to smog cert your car now?

Originally Posted by dikspiel

^you can easily pay someone to pass you for smog