deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

So ive had this issue for three years. ever since switching from stock ecu to haltech. everything else runs great with the car other than start up. I cant seem to figure out what needs to be changed to get this to not happen. but im still having the cranking issue. crank crank crank tick/stop crank crank start. (see video) though this only happens from time to time. and not every time. most times it starts up just fine.

mods are:
stock block
greddy tt
ID1000cc injectore (used to have dw600's and also had this issue)
walbro 255
fuel return

[y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a48F2Z_oWRk&feature=related[\y]

here are a few pics of my phone of what my settings on haltech are for specific start up cranking ign/fuel timing and prime pulse.

Ive emailed Hal at dynosty and hes told me he has encountered this issue when tuning and he thinks this is a 100% tuning issue. I thought that I have tried everything, but maybe theres something im missing. hopefully you guys and see something that im overlooking.

https://i.imgur.com/fm3nb.jpg



THANKS!

djamps

iTrader: (1)

That doesn't look like a tune issue. Notice how the lights dim out like something is binding. Maybe your starter is going.

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

I thought that could have been an issue as well. but then my starter died three weeks ago. and I replaced it. new starter, same issue.

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

I'm losing power completely when it does it. I also tried changing my negative battery terminal cable. wasnt a bad ground. and also isnt a weak battery.

MR RIZK

iTrader: (7)

If makes u feel better had the same issue in my Z. Since it happened randomly like 1 in every 10 starts and not temp/time dependant it was hard to pin point.

djamps

iTrader: (1)

Whatever it is, it's not tune related. Some kind of mechanical/electrical issue. Check all grounds twice.

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

ok. figured it was worth a shot. because I felt like I had exhausted all attempts to find out if it was tune related like Hal suggested. thats what brought me to making a post about it. i'll take another look over all of my grounding points. but this happened immediately when i switched to haltech. So it led me to believe Hal thinking its tune related. it is completely random. so strange.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

Can you do a datalog while cranking to include AFRs (let sensors get warm first so they read right away)? Is this hot or cold starting? I would add a few msecs to hot start prime pulse timing. Fuel gets vaporized on the hot, dry intake valves the first few cranks.

I think the lights dimming are just a reflection of the current draw while cranking. Might want to check your dead time compensation tables also as your injectors are likely seeing much less than the usual 13v during that period...

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

i will do a data log and see what i get. any specific parameters to data log?

the problem usually happens when the car is cold. but happens when hot on occassion as well. its totally unpredictable.

I think you may be right about the lights dimming due to draw upon cranking. my dead times are correct according to ID's injector latency chart. im getting about 10volts when cranking.
my zeitronix restarts when the crank crank tick/stop happens(like, power cuts out then back in). so im not sure if i'll be able to get an 02 reading.

UMW350Z

iTrader: (18)

this happens to me too...Haltech/Osiris setup on a PL kit. It's not a huge issue for me as I drive the car maybe 5 times a month though, she always starts on the second crank.

DW 600cc/Stage 0 RFS/Haltech/Osiris/walbro/stock block

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

If you draw the power for your wideband controller directly from one of the fuses that powers the stock O2 sensors or the fuel pump, etc, then it should not cut power. I would log all the fuel compensations and AFR. A battery that can put out greater cranking amps may fix the issue. If you get a jump from another car while starting and the data logs change significantly, then that might be a good way to test your battery...

mvp2765

I had a cranking problem too. Car would then start after I pumped the brake. But in the end I think it was just a weak battery. The battery wasnt totally dead, just didn't put out enough amps even if fully charged

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

thanks for the input. my battery is all good tho. not the prob.

b18ccivics

iTrader: (11)

Have not tuned haltech, I have had the software for a month or so and looked it over, just have not installed it on the Z. But I have tuned alot of Aem stuff. If it was AEM I would say the crank exit rpm is set too low and it needs to be bumped up a couple hundred rpm. Explanation: the starter it turning the car over so fast the ecu thinks that the engine is started (faster than crank exit rpm), therefore adding timing causing the motor to want to go in the other direction. This causes the starter to stall for a few and the amp draw go up therefore the lights to dim. Now, looking over the haltech software I do not see where the cranking rpm is changeable so the info I just gave might not do a bit of good. The crank timing is changeable so you could take it down a few and it could help. But please take the info above with a grain of salt because I have not tuned haltech. Hope this helps.

looking at the software more with the crank timing table pulled up go to setup and you can adjust the rpm there. raise it up 200 and see if it helps. Also you can log you crank rpm and see what it is then make sure this is a 100 or so above average cranking speed.

djamps

iTrader: (1)

Interesting theory. if the timing becomes way too advanced it could be pre-ignition trying to stop the motor basically.

deanfootlong

iTrader: (10)

one of my friends who is a tuner at a local shop around town(they do mustangs and ls motors) thought that it sounds like ignition timing firing too soon. i have tried different ignition cranking timing settings but seem to still have the problem no matter what.
b18ccivics, are you saying to try changing the fuel cranking injection to 200 instead of 0?

maXmood

iTrader: (16)

i have and still am facing this issue.. first the battery was a factor, cuz it just keeps cranking, nothing happens, it takes sometimes 20 to 30 cranks till it fires up fine. and sometimes instantly.. i changed the battery, the number of times is less now, which takes about 3 to 4 tries till its running.

the tune looks fine, but will need some timing adjustment.

A mechanic pointed out that it could be the spark plugs, so i'm gonna change that next and see how it goes.

b18ccivics

iTrader: (11)

No change the ignition-crank timing table to a higher value. base map for the 350 has 399 rpm, try 599 and see if that helps. to change it have the ignition crank timing table open then go to setup tab, table setup and change the 399 number, apply etc.

accordfreak

iTrader: (15)

I have the exact same starting issue with the haltech. it's a little annoying. it happens maybe 1 out of 7-8 cold starts. hot starts it never happens

I put the stock ecu and injectors in and it cold starts no problem so it's not a mechanical issue.

binder

iTrader: (8)

that sounds like prime pulse or cranking enrichment needs to be adjusted. It doesn't sound like you have the "click click click" problem like the others.

I've personally never had it stop cranking ever with my haltech. I've had it take forever but i just adjusted prime pulse and cranking enrich and now it starts like butter no matter what temp.