I post so irregularly here anymore that I am beginning to lose touch with the group in general.

It is because of this that I am understanding the issues of owning a highly modified car more clearly now than ever. I stopped really tinkering with the Z because I drive it maybe once a month if that and only when it is nice out. Having a high HP, no frills, no muffler car is fun in short bursts but also highly cost prohibitive to maintain all of the safety devices to keep it running.

Here is the issue, the Z has slowly been developing an oil smoke problem. Let me preface this with saying BP Twin Scroll kit is amazing I would not have gone another route, in fact of the 4 turbo kits I have owned this have performed best, I have a PTE 6766 and an amazing Dynosty motor making all kinds of power, the fact is my shitty street tires are useless above 600 whp, which is WG pressure on my new setup.

The problem isn't the EXA pump which is working within tolerances, I even ordered a new one to test out and sent the old one in to be inspected. I think I could go from -6 return to -10 or -12 and add a larger maybe 1 qt reservoir but these are just bandaids for the issue. I need to return oil from the turbo back. The turbo is brand new, literally has 100 miles on it from PTE.

The answer was simple... Why do I even need oil? What does it do for me except make a damn mess and smoke out my neighbors and the cars around.

Starting this next month, I will be transitioning again out of cars and starting another boat and aircraft built but before I do I need to finish the Z for next season.

Comp Turbochargers are a self contained oilless setup, I have ordered a comparable turbo that is cooled strictly by water lines in positive pressure and the factory water pump. This new turbo is ~1800 and has a billet turbine wheel and due to its ceramic bearing supposedly spools 1000-1500 faster than my current setup. Technically the turbo i am running could be air cooled simplifying the idea even further but this is going to reduce temps and increase longevity. with rebuilds checking in ~300 every 50,000 miles or so this is a significantly cheaper option and isolates oil contamination issues, and more.

I am going to document the change over myself, this is a simple procedure and will keep all of my information on here. My goal with this is not to solve just this problem, but other often common fast car problems in this tread... If this turbo is able to produce the same or more HP on WG with no other changes I will be recommending them to Sasha to sell with his high HP kits. Lets be honest if you can afford a 1000hp car you probably have several other cars as well and limit the driving time in your toy.

http://compturbo.com/products/turbos...llet/ct43-6765

Here is the turbo I ordered, in a 1.32 divided Housing.

I still have yet to think or find a good solution to boiling my clutch fluid during a 5 hour road trip followed by a hot lap of the dragon. Also I will be speaking about this next week with Dynosty and Sasha.
Here are my perceived benefits of going to this setup on a BP Twin Scroll or Remote Kit

*Increased Simplicity for install
*Reduced Weight, 7.8lb for exapump plus lines
*No more return oil issues, ID on lines, sumps, backup, racing
*Turbo failure will not contaminate oil
*Ball Bearing Like Spool
*Allows more options for mounting since it can be mounted parallel or at high angles, allowing for larger turbo under car.

I fully intend on just rebuilding this turbo every other year I own it as a matter of general maintenance. The costs are so marginal and the ease of removal its ridiculous not to.

Thanks,
Don

 

Don...if you had a bad turbo which was leaking oil in to the exhaust, it can take a while for all the oil to burn up, and exit the exhaust completely. So it may be still residual oil that you are seeing.


I have also noticed that the Precision JB turbos may not necessarily be the best option for a car that spends a good amount of time on the track. For some reason the thrust bearings that PTE uses don't seem to stand up as well when pushed to the limit, as they are built out of steel. I have read that there is a not so well known upgraded thrust bearing/washer that is made out of brass which is much more suited for extreme track use. For a street car, the turbos seem to hold up very well, as I have dozens of customers using them without a single issue.

I have one local customer with a TS kit on his 370Z, and he beats the living crap out of that car...at 550whp. The turbo is a JB 6266 1.15 a/r. So far 20,000 miles, and he goes through 2 sets of RE11 tires per season (our driving season is 5 months/year here) no issues at all. So it seems that no matter what you do to the set-up on the street, it does very well.

Lately, for those customers that are using their cars at the track (autocross type events) I have been recommending the upgrade to BB turbos. They have built in oil restrictors on the inlet, and very little oil goes through them.

I also know that the S2K guys have been using oil restrictors on these PTE JB turbos due to the high oil pressure. This is against Precision advice, since they seem to believe a -4AN supply line is adequate. It is hard to get a straight answer on the oil supply system from PTE...and I have tried many times. Al they have been able to tell me is how much oil volume should be coming out of the turbo at idle, with the engine fully warmed up. Of course, this doesn't tell one much about WOT runs for extended periods of time.

Wish I had known about your issue...could have helped with the new turbo selection. I am afraid that the CT43 you have ordered may have fitment issues due to the 3" compressor discharge. The turbine outlet also looks long, and I hope you ordered the 3" discharge since there is very little room to work with on the TS, while trying to keep everything above the sub-frame.

 

Sasha,

I have never had anything but new turbos on this car. In fact this setup has less than 1000 miles on it. The smoking started shortly after ZDAYZ and even then I didn't reach a threshold until a few mos later. Since May I have driven the car maybe 50 miles. It was in those miles that the issue developed.

I removed all of the piping and cleaned it with brake cleaner before installing the new exa pump and relay.

This did not solve the issue with the current setup.

Should I continue to fight against an oil return problem or get rid of the need to return it. I already wasted 400 on a new Exa pump. I would rather modify the mounting and make room over dealing with this issue. Honestly, over the last few months parting it out has also crossed my mind. I have set my sights on building a classic flat bottom cig boat to run in the 90s, so having big turbos laying around isn't the worst idea.

Also if it were residual oil it would not continue to get worse. The smoke was so bad that it backed up through my HVAC while the car was at idle.

 

If I had known about the issues, I would have been more than happy to help. Would have saved you the $400 for sure, because it is never a pump issue.

Out of the thee previous customers that had smoking issues, it was the turbo every time. And, every time the turbo went to Precision for a rebuild, they always say oil contamination, which I think is a load of crap. Coincidentally, all of these were built engines making over 600whp. But then again this is not consistent either, since I have a number of other customers with built engines, also making the same/more power, but no issues.

Either way, if there is anything I can do to help, just let me know.

 

good luck. never seen any dynos of those comps making good horsepower compared to PTE or Garrets.

I assume you have a vent on your oil drain sump? 6AN is a very small return. What size is your feed?

Probably all moot points since you already bought the turbo....

 

i have had a couple issues with my DBB due to the high pressure i run with no oil squirters, one of the reason i relocated the powersteering to the driver side and going to be building a custom front mount. i do know i had one major issue from the air filter above 27 psi if it got even the smallest amount of debris in it(which happened alot in hawaii) and it was actually sucking oil out of the chra from the filter not flowing enough.

still some issues here and there but its cold in ohio so been driving my f350 but a AFE power filter that pretty much outflows everything on the market helped alot of my issues.

 

-3an feed, i agree -6an was small. If the Comp doesn't make similar power I'll cuss about it and switch back to a PTE setup with -10 or -12.

Edit:

Sasha, I will give you a shout on FB. Damn Comp emailed me saying the turbo will be 6-8 weeks out.

 

I think -8AN should be more than enough. I can tell you that from my experimenting with the pump, I was able to pump a whole jug (5qt) of oil in about 35 seconds using a -6AN line. So it will move a lot of volume. This was cold (room temp) oil.

 

I am having a sump setup made similar to one of the track prepped 997 TT cars. This is a stop gap measure until the Comp can be shipped. I am anxious to see if this fixes the serious smoking issue.

5/8" drop in 1 qt cylindrical aluminum sump, -10an exit to ExaPump, -6an line routed on top of sump to oil catch can as breather.
similar to this


Also the EXA pump is connected to a warning light, should it fall below 12 volts and the flow is reduced. I switched out the relay to a super high temp one meant for jet engines.

I also spoke to precision, they recommended nothing smaller than a -10an in a sump back setup. If it pressurizes for even a split second it'll go through the seals and smoke for "hours"

 

ya my sump holds a quart uses the same 3/8th npt sintered breather and runs -12AN lines

i also mounted a voltmeter for my fuel pump and scavenge pump in the dash

If you have any sort or resonator or muffler you will wanna clean all your exhaust with gas as well. otherwise you still will smoke

 

Precision doesn't know how a scavenging pump system works. They suggested that size, because they are basing it on a traditional gravity drain system as if it was a turbo well above the lower oil pan.


As the oil goes through the turbo, it doesn't drain out of it in a liquid form. It drains as a foamy liquid which you can't pull a vacuum on by using a scavenge pump. This is why a smaller line is actually more beneficial, because it will pull vacuum sooner, and keep the actual liquid oil in the reservoir at a minimum.

As for the breather, I would have tried it, and there is no benefit.

I just can't see more than 4.5 litres of oil going through the turbo every minute...which is the volume of oil a -6AN will flow when connected to the Exa pump. A -4AN line alone will restrict the oil pressure/flow down to limit flow to 2.5 litres per minute (free flowing, not through the turbo). So with a -6AN line, you will outflow your -4AN supply line by 2 litres per minute. That is a huge margin.

I trust the math....and I have done a lot of testing with this system on my own car.

I have also had many conversations with Precision on this topic, and it seems like each one of the guys there will have a different answer on the same question...especially when it comes to oil flow through the turbo, and the working oil pressure parameters.

I am not trying to argue the point, I am simply providing what I have found when testing things on my own, due to lack of consistency of information from Precision on this topic.