flynnibus

No worries

I found dwnshift's posts you were talking about.. unfortunatly he doesn't say what their 3 stock engines really put out.. however in another thread he eludes to their team is 'missing' 17hp.

I'd be really interested in hearing what his calculated drivetrain loss is if they've done engine dynos followed by chassis dynos.

Given our CF driveshaft.. one would hope we would be doing well in the efficency of the tranny.. but given the 'average' chassis dyno of 240rwhp that's nearly 17% if you go by Nissan's claim.

2FST4U

Most manufacturers of any emissions sensitive (or deleting) products were issued letters from the EPA recently. The letter basically stated that if you [STILLEN, BORLA, HKS, GREDDY, Crane, Holley, etc] manufacture and/or distribute these types of products, you must post that these items are to be used OFF-ROAD...Not to be used upon a public road, for race-use and so on. We have always had the plates [you refer to] on OFF-ROAD / Race-Only parts as federal law dictates.

failsafe

Just curious- why do you weld it onto the headers rather than include just a piece of paper (stating the above) with the headers? It seems that a piece of paper would be less expensive and cause less headaches for those that don't want a disclaimer physically attached to the equipment. Is it the law?

Road Warrior

iTrader: (16)

so they can charge more

FLY BY Z

2FST4U

There has been some question with regards to installation times for our New Shorty Equal Length Headers. With reluctance, a reasonable time for installation is 6 hours. That would be OUR installation time in our Work Shop. The reason I hesitate to give such estimates is that each shop is different, each mechanic is different, and different shops have proficiencies in different areas (vehicles & product range). So, while we will quote 6 hours for installation, other shops may have higher or lower quotes. Also, some tuners and/or shops quote using different methods for giving estimates, such as package pricing with the purchase of the product.

But 6 hours is a good gauge for customers to use.

Hope this helps.

Jeff@Performance

We just installed our first set of these. No worse than the Nismo's and took 4 1/2 hours to do. Of course weve replaced a lot of sets so they know what to expect. I have one Tech that's down to 4 hours to R&R Headers now!!! Have to admit the Stillen ones look very nice..... from under the car anyway....

KISS

How do they fit?

2FST4U

Thanks for the kind words. Great job on cutting the install time down. So, our time estimate is a bit high compared to your shop, Jeff. That's good to know. We'll use a range, which will help. The customers also will be pleased when the actual time is less than the quoted time!

Thanks again.

AC

Jeff@Performance

Perfect!! Lot's of clearance all the way around. Customer wasn't interested in letting me dyno the car though.

Mr Twisted

That sucked. You mean I might have to ginea Pig this one again. Alex ,I'm still waiting to hear about my exhaust tips now. It's been a long time for Kenny to get back to me. Can you look into it. SM has approved it. I just need the quote.

failsafe

Yes, I read that the first time it was posted I'm asking because there are plenty of headers on the market that are for off road/race use only. Most will include documentation in the box that notes the parts are not legal for street use. Stillen is the only one I know that actually welds a disclaimer to the headers. I'm curious because many headers will pass visual and emissions no problem- if there is a disclaimer welded to the headers they will likely not pass visual. I understand that Stillen needs to inform their customers (according to the law) and the customers will make their own choices. Just wondering why this couldn't be done on a piece of paper that is included with the headers. If it's federal law that a plate be physically attached to the headers then how come other manufacturers don't do it?

Jeff@Performance

We have another Stillen Header, RT Cat, Nismo exhaust install set up for early next week. I asked if they were a my350Z forum member and the response was.... "a what?"... How can anyone who owns a Z not be a my350z Forum member!! Some people!! We talked about dynoing the car but he said he heard that it's hard on a new car... Damn, your hot roding your car dude!!! I'll still work him..

2FST4U

Failsafe - I understand exactly what you mean with regards to other exhaust suppliers not having this on their components and believe me - it is risky. I say this because technically, if that person 'wearing' their exhaust system was ever 'nicked' and had to pay either removal costs or fines, they could turn to the manufacturer and claim that they never received the piece of paper, weren't informed that the component was not to be used upon public roadways - or it must have fallen out of the box during shipping. Paper does get lost and then who is to blame? Here's how that works:

Per STATE OF CALIFORNIA MOTOR VEHICLE CODE

Section 27150.5 Sale of noncomplying Exhaust Systems
"Any person holding a retail seller's permit who sells or installs an exhaust system, or part thereof, in violation of Section 27150.1 or 27150.2 shall thereafter be required to install an exhaust system, or part thereof, which is in compliance with such regulations upon demand of the purchaser or to reimburse the purchaser for the expense of replacement and installation of an exhaust system, or part thereof, which is in compliance, at the election of such purchaser."

The removal or fine costs are pennies compared to the fines said manufacturer/supplier would pay for the "APPARENT" violation. Other manufacturers are taking a gamble (trying not to hurt sales). The EPA has tightened down on the use of these items - just in the past few months! This is what I stated many pages ago (that you've already seen). The fines for not informing and keeping on the straight and narrow are staggering. They want it on everything! It is too large of a risk as a manufacturer [for us] to have a red flag next to our name with the EPA, C.A.R.B. or any agency of the sort. Other companies obviously make their own decisions on these matter and perform their own risk assessments. We have never been short-sighted on things and plan on being here for [at least] another 17 years.

It is unfortunate.

Thanks again for the inquiry.

AC

pimp1911

Jeff. This guy is putting on headers,cats and exhaust and says a dyno is hard on a car. He is driving a Z not a cadillac. Club him over the head dyno the car and then wake him up using smelling salt. Tell him he was out for only 1 minute but in reality he will be out long enough for you to dyno the car.

Jeff@Performance

failsafe

2FST4U- Thanks for the response. That's what I was looking for. And you made a great point that I'd never thought about (customers saying they were never informed). I was curious because I had to make a trip to visit the BAR referee a few months ago. Before I did so I spent numerous hours reseaching smog laws and how they pertain to manufacturers and ultimately their customers. I surprisingly found very few clear cut answers in regards to exhaust components. And I'm always curious as to how smog laws pertain to the community in general. Thanks again for the informative post.

2FST4U

No worries! I'm happy to help.

Cheers!

AC

Z PHAT Z

iTrader: (46)

2FST4U
Can you clear out something here please? Stillen website posted that the HP # is at the flywheel. Is it a mistake or the numbers you posted here also at the flywheel, not RWHP?


http://stillen.com/Sportscars_detail...d=37282&page=1

Here is the write up:The long awaited STILLEN 350Z and G35 Coupe and Sedan Headers are now available. After months of development work, these headers produce big increases in streetable power and torque on both Naturally Aspirated and Forced induction vehicles. The equal length design of the headers allows better and more efficient exhaust scavenging which contributes to the performance gains tested on the dyno, 11.5 hp at @ 6200 RPM and 18.5 ft-lb @ 3800 RPM at the flywheel. With STILLEN's 17 years of experience in designing and manufacturing Nissan performance parts, you should have complete confidence that every STILLEN product is of the highest quality and has under gone extensive research and design before production. These hand crafted shorty headers do not require the removal of the catalytic convertors and are available in two versions; 100% Stainless Steel or Ceramic Coated Mild Steel both are Manufactured by STILLEN. This part # is the Ceramic Coated Mild Steel Headers. Stay tuned for STILLEN's soon to be released Race Pipe for the 350Z and G35 that mates up to the header to make a perfect combo of fit and performance. Installation should be done by a qualified mechanic with proper tools and a lift. This is not a backyard bolt on. For the Stainless Steel Headers see part # 508350S. These headers do not remove the cats, but are not 50 state legal, check your area's regulations.

2FST4U

I must thank you for bringing that to my attention. Yes, dynomometers measure wheel horsepower and torque - not flywheel. We have mistakingly stated in our product description (what we call catalog text) that those numbers are flywheel results. That's a very important clarification to make. The silver lining is that the error doesn't make us appear to be boasting or claiming higher numbers than is correct. But it's still an error and we'll correct that today.

Again - thanks.

AC