I have a VERY spongy brake on my daily driver, I have always heard that is caused by air in the brake lines. My brake fuild is full, so I figured I need to bleed the brakes. But I read somewhere that you cannot bleed the brakes on a ABS equiped car with out special equipment, is this true?

 

from personal experience, it is easiest to take it somewhere and have it bled. Stealership is good or any brake place. It costs about 30 bucks.

 

HAHA stealership! anyways I was thinking of just taking it to a brake place and having them flush the system.

 

its not too hard to bleed the brakes..

 

I can bleed brakes easy, but I have read its not smart to do it on cars with ABS. I have only done it on non-abs equiped cars.

 

I know what you mean and I am considering buying a bleeder that hooks up to my air compressor. I have always used the old 2 person method. The ABS issue comes in when there are air bubbles trapped in the ABS system. From what I have heard, the dealer will have a computer that can pulsate the ABS system to try and get rid of the air bubbles in that portion of the brake system. Without having that the bubbles could be impossible to get out at home. I've tried to find a nice handheld or PC based OBD diagnostic system that would have a feature like this but have not found one. I have bled brakes on other ABS cars with mixed results and now have wondered if any of the unsuccessful attempts were due to ABS problems. Not sure if I want to do this myself anymore either. But lots of shops don't do it right either from what I have heard. This is one service that can be easy to screw up. If your dealer has a fair price it might be best to go to someone that has the right bleeding and computer equipment.
I was going to go over to the racing section of my350z sometime soon and check out if there was any info for the Z. You might want to try that.

 

This is for one of my other cars that has the spongy brake problem not the Z. In the repair manual I have for the car is says it big bold text "DO NOT ATTEMPT TO BLEED THE REAR BRAKES ON ABS EQUIPED CARS." It says a "scan" tool is required to do it correctly. I did the 2 man method on the front brakes and it did absolutly nothing. The wierd thing is I got ALOT of air out of the front, so I don't know why it didnt do anything.

 

There was probably air still trapped in the ABS. I'm not familiar with the whole ABS system. There is some chamber or something at each wheel that needs to be cycled by the scan tool to pump the air out. You can bleed it all you want but the air won't come out.
Plus if you just did the front brakes you probably did nothing because you need to bleed all 4 corners in the correct order and pump the brake pedal slow enough to gently push all of the air to the wheel cylinders or you will still have air in the system. It's a very easy task to do but difficult to do right.

 

I see, I know on the other cars I have done you had to go in a certain order but I though I would just try the fronts. So it is not "hurting" my brake to bleed on a ABS system? I just will not get the air out where the scan tool is needed? But I still mite be able to get some of the other air out if I do it in the correct order?

 

You should find on any car that opposite corners are on a shared line in case a brake line fails. I guess there are two main lines out of the master cylinder then? That way in an emergency you will have a front and rear brake on opposite sides of the car to stop straight. The service manual will have you start at the corner furthest away from the master cylinder then go to the opposite side and end of the car then do the other "pair". It's done in such a way that once you get the longest line air free, the other shorter lines should never push back into it. I've never heard of anyone damaging anything on an ABS car but I'm no expert. And yes, you could do everything correctly and then possibly have some air trapped in the ABS mechanism and it feels no better.

 

Oh, BTW since you seem to be trying to learn about this you also need to keep in mind most of the different methods used can be unsuccessful if you have problems with air leaking into the system by accidental methods like the threads on the bleeding nipple allowing air in when you open them a turn for the fluid to come out. Also don't EVER let the master cylinder go down below the MIN level or you will have to learn how to prime and bleed a master cylinder! Something you will not want to do.

 

Haha yes, the manual I have also has the big bold letters saying "DO NOT GO BELOW MIN LVL OF BRAKE FLUID." It also says that bleeding the master cylinder on a ABS car is "beyond the abilities of a home mechanic." haha

Thanks for your help, I will just try bleeding all 4 even though it is ABS equipped. If it does nothing I am in the same boat as I am now.

Trying to fix up my "daily driver" (or so insurance thinks) so the gf can use it for a while, and trying to spend as little money as possible to get it in shape. Plus I like to tinker...

 

350Z service manual gives no warning or tips on ABS. It just describes the typical 2 man bleeding where you pump slowly 4 times then open and close the bleeder quickly before the pedal goes to the floor. I recall some advice from long ago about not letting it go all the way to the floor to protect certain things on the master cylinder. Order to do this from the manual is rear left, front right, rear right, front left. Keep the master cylinder above the MIN level, bleed in that order, pump the brake pedal slowly so as not to agitate the air bubbles, etc. and you should be able to get it much better than what you have now. If it doesn't work the first time a second time can help usually. If you understand what you are doing just be thourough and patient

 

This is on my "backup" car, not the Z. I have one of those tear down manuals you get from autozone that is saying all this stuff about the ABS system. I was having my gf do the pumping and I am pretty sure she was not going easy on the brakes even though I told her to.... :/ This week end I will give it another go and have my brother be the 2nd man! hehe

 

I'm interested to see what the outcome is HockeyZ39, I'll be bleeding tonight. but I bought a "Mity Vac". I'll see how it works, then post.

 

Which set did you pick up? and how much did it set you back if you dont mind me asking. Seems like they would be more expensive than paying some one to do it.

Do any of there products have the "scan" tool for abs systems?

 

Hmmm, my service manual for '05 350Z says:
Weird.

 

Hmm. I wonder what has changed? I have '03 manual but an '05 car. I've always wondered if I could run into any differences. Sure would be nice to have an '05 manual. Can you tell me where you got yours? If that is a quote directly from your manual I guess I should do it in that order

I've not done mine yet, I have about 1/4" of brake pad left and will wait to do a fluid flush at that point. I have been talking to a guy at Speedibleed and will be buying a pressure bleeder kit soon from them with adapters for both the brake master reservoir and the clutch one too. They are coming out with a cheaper line later to compete with the kits that are more DIY/cheaper quality but I am going with the stuff they offer currently. For about $130 I get the kit with a blow molded case plus the two adapters I need. The guy gave me a small discount for providing pictures and info on the Z. Very helpful company. I will try and remember to post when I get the kit and do it but that won't be probably until very late this year
I'll know that at least everything seemed to go OK if I do a complete flush and do not end up with a softer pedal feel than stock.

 

bjr, I just sent you a PM. Keep us updated on those speedbleeders.