hey guys, i smoked a m3
05-12-2003, 09:03 PM
#21
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LonghornE46M3:
I suppose you are refering to laps times posted here on the 'Ring
http://www.nordschleife.no/
or
http://www.m3supercar.com/v8nurburgring.html
I wouldn't even really consider these laptimes comparable. The 'Ring is 14 miles long. You have different drivers, on different days posting these laps times....conditions and the driver's knowledge of the circuit have a lot to play into them.
Look at the Testarossa down in the 9:01 times. And there is actually a Skyline listed at 7:59 with a ? for horsepower mod. The first M3 (modified) is listed at 8:11. Then there is the stock GTR at 8:28 with only 278hp. Then a 350hp GTR at 8:37...what the hell happened to this guy.
Again....to hard to judge on the 'Ring with so many variables. Put someone who knows the track, knows each car he/she is testing and then do the comparisons.
FYI: I don't even own a 350 so I'm not trying to defend it.
Your point about the Japanese test being on a short track means nothing really. If the M3 had more HP it should have been able to get out of the corners sooner. From the video it looks like the M3 was having some trouble in the corners.....even long tracks have corners. And as I mentioned before....the S2000 looks like it could have taken the M3 and the 350 with more time and if the GTR camera car would have stayed out of the way.
I suppose you are refering to laps times posted here on the 'Ring
http://www.nordschleife.no/
or
http://www.m3supercar.com/v8nurburgring.html
I wouldn't even really consider these laptimes comparable. The 'Ring is 14 miles long. You have different drivers, on different days posting these laps times....conditions and the driver's knowledge of the circuit have a lot to play into them.
Look at the Testarossa down in the 9:01 times. And there is actually a Skyline listed at 7:59 with a ? for horsepower mod. The first M3 (modified) is listed at 8:11. Then there is the stock GTR at 8:28 with only 278hp. Then a 350hp GTR at 8:37...what the hell happened to this guy.
Again....to hard to judge on the 'Ring with so many variables. Put someone who knows the track, knows each car he/she is testing and then do the comparisons.
FYI: I don't even own a 350 so I'm not trying to defend it.
Your point about the Japanese test being on a short track means nothing really. If the M3 had more HP it should have been able to get out of the corners sooner. From the video it looks like the M3 was having some trouble in the corners.....even long tracks have corners. And as I mentioned before....the S2000 looks like it could have taken the M3 and the 350 with more time and if the GTR camera car would have stayed out of the way.
05-14-2003, 02:03 PM
#22
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hmmm.
I am not sure what I am responding to but.... yeah, I did get some times from those sites..... It was a way to prove my point actually.
The point being, drivers are everything and that both cars are close enough that the driver not the car will probably determine the race..... ON A ROADCOURSE......
A short track means everything when racing 2 cars...... especially when one car has a decided power advantage (M3) OR when one driver knows a particular car or its limits better than another driver, obviously that is an advantage..... especially exploitable on a short (6 laps) race.
Using a gross exaggeration, compare an auto cross circuit to the Nurbrugring.... both tracks have turns
but an S2000 would shine on the autocross while it would fall behind other more powerful cars on the long straights of the Nur. and probably not be able to make up all the ground lost on the corners.
So, yes in fact it does matter how long and how many corners a track has for a given set of cars. If you have track experience, surely you have encountered this?? What tracks have you run? Autocross??
Some will have advantages in shorter tracks (miatas, S2000s) while longer tracks will help out cars that may be heavier with more horsepower (M5, M3).
Your statement that "even long tracks have corners".... well, yes of course they do. But, what you failed to grasp (or I failed to point out clearly) is that with a longer track, a car with more power will be able to make up more of the ground lost on corners.
My point is that Japanese Motoring was showing a video trying to point out the 350Z and S2000 handling prowess (which I don't debate at all!) and that their video shouldn't be taken as proof that 350Zs will always out handle M3s on the track because tracks are different and the driver is the key ingredient......
WHEW!!!
I am not sure what I am responding to but.... yeah, I did get some times from those sites..... It was a way to prove my point actually.
The point being, drivers are everything and that both cars are close enough that the driver not the car will probably determine the race..... ON A ROADCOURSE......
A short track means everything when racing 2 cars...... especially when one car has a decided power advantage (M3) OR when one driver knows a particular car or its limits better than another driver, obviously that is an advantage..... especially exploitable on a short (6 laps) race.
Using a gross exaggeration, compare an auto cross circuit to the Nurbrugring.... both tracks have turns
but an S2000 would shine on the autocross while it would fall behind other more powerful cars on the long straights of the Nur. and probably not be able to make up all the ground lost on the corners.
So, yes in fact it does matter how long and how many corners a track has for a given set of cars. If you have track experience, surely you have encountered this?? What tracks have you run? Autocross??
Some will have advantages in shorter tracks (miatas, S2000s) while longer tracks will help out cars that may be heavier with more horsepower (M5, M3).
Your statement that "even long tracks have corners".... well, yes of course they do. But, what you failed to grasp (or I failed to point out clearly) is that with a longer track, a car with more power will be able to make up more of the ground lost on corners.
My point is that Japanese Motoring was showing a video trying to point out the 350Z and S2000 handling prowess (which I don't debate at all!) and that their video shouldn't be taken as proof that 350Zs will always out handle M3s on the track because tracks are different and the driver is the key ingredient......
WHEW!!!
05-14-2003, 09:17 PM
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LonghornE46M3:
I agree with you on the point that lighter cars will do better on shorter tracks in the corners....and by no means was the Motoring test a definitive answer as the test was flawed to begin with the camera car in the way. I would have liked to have seen the lap times of each car individually on the track instead.
But again...to put my case to rest finally...as I stated in my early posts....I think it is useless to compare straight line speeds of different cars unless they are all made to the same specifications such as a standard race class. That does not tell us anything about which car is "better" or "faster"....just that maybe it has more horsepower, torque or, gearing....not overall which car is the best.
So, that's that...drive what makes you feel good and peace out.
I agree with you on the point that lighter cars will do better on shorter tracks in the corners....and by no means was the Motoring test a definitive answer as the test was flawed to begin with the camera car in the way. I would have liked to have seen the lap times of each car individually on the track instead.
But again...to put my case to rest finally...as I stated in my early posts....I think it is useless to compare straight line speeds of different cars unless they are all made to the same specifications such as a standard race class. That does not tell us anything about which car is "better" or "faster"....just that maybe it has more horsepower, torque or, gearing....not overall which car is the best.
So, that's that...drive what makes you feel good and peace out.
05-16-2003, 06:22 AM
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Originally posted by LonghornE46M3
This thread is a joke.
Unless you aren't telling the truth....a $63K M3 could only be a convertible with SMG, NAV and all the options. It would weigh about 3700 lbs+ and I still don't think a 350Z would pull him in gear. You said SMG... that means there are no "bad drivers" as you dont' even have to shift. It acts as an automatic without a clutch and all you have to do is hold the gas down. Even a convertible can trap at 105 which is significantly faster than ANY (stock) 350Z I have seen.
This thread is a joke.
Unless you aren't telling the truth....a $63K M3 could only be a convertible with SMG, NAV and all the options. It would weigh about 3700 lbs+ and I still don't think a 350Z would pull him in gear. You said SMG... that means there are no "bad drivers" as you dont' even have to shift. It acts as an automatic without a clutch and all you have to do is hold the gas down. Even a convertible can trap at 105 which is significantly faster than ANY (stock) 350Z I have seen.
05-16-2003, 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by Cabby
SMG M3's do have a clutch, the internal workings of the car are EXACTLY the same as a 6 speed. You simply control the clutch with your hands, rather than your feet.
SMG M3's do have a clutch, the internal workings of the car are EXACTLY the same as a 6 speed. You simply control the clutch with your hands, rather than your feet.
I dunno, as has been said before, anything can happen on the streets, but for you to say that your 350Z beat an M3 from a roll is as believable as me saying that a stock WRX wil take out a 350Z from a roll...
05-16-2003, 10:03 AM
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Originally posted by jigga
To add to this post, it is also my understanding that the SMG-equipped cars have a launch control function which unleashes perfect launches from a stop....
To add to this post, it is also my understanding that the SMG-equipped cars have a launch control function which unleashes perfect launches from a stop....
05-17-2003, 04:50 PM
#28
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When you guys start writing 1000 word essays on a racing forum to try and prove a point...you're taking it a bit far. Who gives a ****. Keep this up and you'll lose your hair and get an ulcer. Damn, chill out.
05-17-2003, 07:36 PM
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Cabby,
yeah, I know the SMG has a clutch .... I should have said clutch pedal..... The benefit is that it doesn't have a torque converter....
Jigga,
The launch control that the US cars has limits the starts to 1800 rpm or so... the Euro version brings the revs to 4500 or so rpm before it launches but after 30 starts I think it voids the tranny wtty. The decided not to put that version on the US bound cars.
xzlr8,
If you don't want to read the posts... don't. As you can see others had opinions and voiced them. The bigger question would be .... If you are going to read those 1000 word essays and then gripe.... why read them in the first place??
S
yeah, I know the SMG has a clutch .... I should have said clutch pedal..... The benefit is that it doesn't have a torque converter....
Jigga,
The launch control that the US cars has limits the starts to 1800 rpm or so... the Euro version brings the revs to 4500 or so rpm before it launches but after 30 starts I think it voids the tranny wtty. The decided not to put that version on the US bound cars.
xzlr8,
If you don't want to read the posts... don't. As you can see others had opinions and voiced them. The bigger question would be .... If you are going to read those 1000 word essays and then gripe.... why read them in the first place??
S
05-17-2003, 08:18 PM
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yeah...why waste your time writing a 43 word reply to our posts? Its a waste of time for us to read things like that. If we didn't enjoy trying to prove a point we would't read, write or even come to these forums xZlr8.
05-17-2003, 08:26 PM
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To whoever it was that said to watch the Best Motoring DVD
I have that DVD, and yes the Z wins the RACE.
BUT!!!!!
when u look at the laps times after the race, u will find that the M3 posted a fastest lap 0.8secs quicker than the Z, and the S2000 0.3secs quicker than the Z.
The fact the M3 wasnt able to catch the Z despite this quicker lap time, is because of other cars on the track (Getting stuck behind the S2000). Watch when the lights go green, and u clearly c the M3 pins the Z off the line and easily gets up along side it, with the M3 driver easing off and settling back behind all cars going into first corner.
Im all hyped over the Z too, but to say its quicker than the e46 M3 is just stupid. The car is better engineered and has more hp! I cant stand these Z owners (or ne other car owner) who thinks their car is the best thing on the road. Give credit where credit is due. BMW have simply built a quicker and better 6cylinder
I have that DVD, and yes the Z wins the RACE.
BUT!!!!!
when u look at the laps times after the race, u will find that the M3 posted a fastest lap 0.8secs quicker than the Z, and the S2000 0.3secs quicker than the Z.
The fact the M3 wasnt able to catch the Z despite this quicker lap time, is because of other cars on the track (Getting stuck behind the S2000). Watch when the lights go green, and u clearly c the M3 pins the Z off the line and easily gets up along side it, with the M3 driver easing off and settling back behind all cars going into first corner.
Im all hyped over the Z too, but to say its quicker than the e46 M3 is just stupid. The car is better engineered and has more hp! I cant stand these Z owners (or ne other car owner) who thinks their car is the best thing on the road. Give credit where credit is due. BMW have simply built a quicker and better 6cylinder
05-17-2003, 10:01 PM
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I dont have to prove anything to anybody but I beat 3 M3's already. I don't think that I have the best car on the road but I know what I gat and I know what my car can do. I also believe that the M3 is better than the Z in some ways. the point is that I beat them in the streets, "where anything can happen". 
Peace!
Peace!
05-17-2003, 10:25 PM
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First you are saying that is stupid to say that the Z is faster than the M3 and now you are admiting that I beat them....Hmmm (Sarcasm) "You have to drive it to believe it".
05-17-2003, 10:42 PM
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ROFL!!! ummmmm how am i admitting that u beat them???? 
My remark to u, "U GO GIRL", is pure sarcasm and is only ridiculing ur current position as a self proclaimed HOT SHOT street racer
My remark to u, "U GO GIRL", is pure sarcasm and is only ridiculing ur current position as a self proclaimed HOT SHOT street racer
05-18-2003, 06:22 PM
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Originally posted by SHIFTZ
ROFL!!! ummmmm how am i admitting that u beat them????
My remark to u, "U GO GIRL", is pure sarcasm and is only ridiculing ur current position as a self proclaimed HOT SHOT street racer
ROFL!!! ummmmm how am i admitting that u beat them????
My remark to u, "U GO GIRL", is pure sarcasm and is only ridiculing ur current position as a self proclaimed HOT SHOT street racer
05-19-2003, 12:43 AM
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hahaha im guessing ur about 13 right webcarconnection....living in ur parents basement with nothing to do but surf the net and act like a big man behind a computer screen. Such is the mindset of those who feel insecure when someone doubts their bull$hit story.
Bet u cant wait to get ur license and join the mob of losers who race around public streets u TOOL!
Bet u cant wait to get ur license and join the mob of losers who race around public streets u TOOL!
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