SG Longtubes are back.
01-25-2013, 02:37 PM
#22
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
gain has been proven on non-rev and rev-up engine..
there is no reason why an HR wouldnt gain from these.
HR headers arent much better than the previous DE headers.
so right there, those SGM are a BIG improvement over what you might have (oem header or stillen crap shorty header....)
the basic of airflow is the same in any engine.
I understand you have a hard time to be willing to drop the $$ on those..
the HR heads has been much improved from the DE.
twin Throttle body in the mix .
all you need is a proper headers setup then ofcourse a good flowing exhaust.
anyway im not here to push you at buying those headers.
it is just because people tend to forget the basic of how NA power is gained.
there is no reason why an HR wouldnt gain from these.
HR headers arent much better than the previous DE headers.
so right there, those SGM are a BIG improvement over what you might have (oem header or stillen crap shorty header....)
the basic of airflow is the same in any engine.
I understand you have a hard time to be willing to drop the $$ on those..
the HR heads has been much improved from the DE.
twin Throttle body in the mix .
all you need is a proper headers setup then ofcourse a good flowing exhaust.
anyway im not here to push you at buying those headers.
it is just because people tend to forget the basic of how NA power is gained.
While the DE has lousy headers, the HR has completaly different & very good headers.
When you dyno test a DE with stock headers vs a DE with long tube headers the H.P. increase is significant. That is because of 2 reasons. You're replacing a lousy set of headers & you're eliminating the biggest H.P. robber, THE CATS.
As nice as long tube look, & they look like they should increase the h.p.. I won't bother doing them until I see legit dyno results.
An HR with test pipes vs Longtube headers. A good performing HR with long tube at the track would also be helpful.
So, a few guys here are installing them. I can wait & see.
Makes sense?
That test can be made without ANY exhaust past the headers & test pipes.
Last edited by andre12031948; 01-25-2013 at 02:40 PM.
01-25-2013, 02:45 PM
#23
I wasn't going to say this(so not to hurt anyone) but since you contacted me I will.
While the DE has lousy headers, the HR has completaly different & very good headers.
When you dyno test a DE with stock headers vs a DE with long tube headers the H.P. increase is significant. That is because of 2 reasons. You're replacing a lousy set of headers & you're eliminating the biggest H.P. robber, THE CATS.
As nice as long tube look, & they look like they should increase the h.p.. I won't bother doing them until I see legit dyno results.
An HR with test pipes vs Longtube headers. A good performing HR with long tube at the track would also be helpful.
So, a few guys here are installing them. I can wait & see.
Makes sense?
That test can be made without ANY exhaust past the headers or test pipes.
While the DE has lousy headers, the HR has completaly different & very good headers.
When you dyno test a DE with stock headers vs a DE with long tube headers the H.P. increase is significant. That is because of 2 reasons. You're replacing a lousy set of headers & you're eliminating the biggest H.P. robber, THE CATS.
As nice as long tube look, & they look like they should increase the h.p.. I won't bother doing them until I see legit dyno results.
An HR with test pipes vs Longtube headers. A good performing HR with long tube at the track would also be helpful.
So, a few guys here are installing them. I can wait & see.
Makes sense?
That test can be made without ANY exhaust past the headers or test pipes.
Yes, but again, they still suck quite hard for what they are.
have you ever look into their collector, how badly welded the primary are ?
01-25-2013, 02:46 PM
#24
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Midwest
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
11.4whp on non-rev DE with stock cam
http://www.tune2win.com/index.php/pe..._power_adders/
We were anxious to see the results as the SG headers on the same U2NDyno have produced over 30whp on the Revup version of the VQ35 however on our non revup engine we only saw 11.4whp. Some research revealed that the Revups feature a more aggressive cam profile which seems to be able to better use the increased flow that the headers provide. If installing the headers on a non-revup something like a Nismo performance camshaft set would go a long way to realize their true potential. On the road we found the longtubes add a raspyness to the exhaust note at around 3500RPM but when approaching redline sound truly fantastic.
SG Motorsport Longtube Prototype headers +11.4whp
http://www.tune2win.com/index.php/pe..._power_adders/
We were anxious to see the results as the SG headers on the same U2NDyno have produced over 30whp on the Revup version of the VQ35 however on our non revup engine we only saw 11.4whp. Some research revealed that the Revups feature a more aggressive cam profile which seems to be able to better use the increased flow that the headers provide. If installing the headers on a non-revup something like a Nismo performance camshaft set would go a long way to realize their true potential. On the road we found the longtubes add a raspyness to the exhaust note at around 3500RPM but when approaching redline sound truly fantastic.
SG Motorsport Longtube Prototype headers +11.4whp
01-25-2013, 02:54 PM
#25
11.4whp on non-rev DE with stock cam
http://www.tune2win.com/index.php/pe..._power_adders/
We were anxious to see the results as the SG headers on the same U2NDyno have produced over 30whp on the Revup version of the VQ35 however on our non revup engine we only saw 11.4whp. Some research revealed that the Revups feature a more aggressive cam profile which seems to be able to better use the increased flow that the headers provide. If installing the headers on a non-revup something like a Nismo performance camshaft set would go a long way to realize their true potential. On the road we found the longtubes add a raspyness to the exhaust note at around 3500RPM but when approaching redline sound truly fantastic.
SG Motorsport Longtube Prototype headers +11.4whp
http://www.tune2win.com/index.php/pe..._power_adders/
We were anxious to see the results as the SG headers on the same U2NDyno have produced over 30whp on the Revup version of the VQ35 however on our non revup engine we only saw 11.4whp. Some research revealed that the Revups feature a more aggressive cam profile which seems to be able to better use the increased flow that the headers provide. If installing the headers on a non-revup something like a Nismo performance camshaft set would go a long way to realize their true potential. On the road we found the longtubes add a raspyness to the exhaust note at around 3500RPM but when approaching redline sound truly fantastic.
SG Motorsport Longtube Prototype headers +11.4whp
the more agressive the cam will be , the better those headers will prove a higher gain as they have been tuned for the JWT C8 or around it. (I cant remember)
even the rev-up showed a bigger gain than non-rev..
so yeah the gain has been proved many times.
01-25-2013, 02:58 PM
#26
Registered User
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: san diego
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
http://www.fastintentions.com/produc...E%20copy_2.pdf
Here is a link to the fast intentions Lth with Hi flow cats on a 370z. I know it's not apples to apples but it gives you an idea that if the exhaust manifold design on the vq37hr can be with holding power, the ones on a hr can be improved as well.
Here is a link to the fast intentions Lth with Hi flow cats on a 370z. I know it's not apples to apples but it gives you an idea that if the exhaust manifold design on the vq37hr can be with holding power, the ones on a hr can be improved as well.
Last edited by jwttz; 01-25-2013 at 03:03 PM.
01-25-2013, 02:58 PM
#27
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've worked for nissan for 20+ years. I know all the improvements that Nissan made to the H.R. From the design & beefynest of the bottom end, the thicker rods, better heads, cams, throttal bodies, & THE BEST fresh air intakes on the market.
01-25-2013, 03:14 PM
#28
I don't see any HR's having a header leak. You saying that they still suck hard means O to me. They are excellent. I don't know any after market headers that are better. When Nissan spends a million dollars to develope them, I'm sure they can do as good of a job/better than any joe blow...
I've worked for nissan for 20+ years. I know all the improvements that Nissan made to the H.R. From the design & beefynest of the bottom end, the thicker rods, better heads, cams, throttal bodies, & THE BEST fresh air intakes on the market.
I've worked for nissan for 20+ years. I know all the improvements that Nissan made to the H.R. From the design & beefynest of the bottom end, the thicker rods, better heads, cams, throttal bodies, & THE BEST fresh air intakes on the market.
you really think their HR oem header as the best on the market..
wow ,, ok
stay in your world then, since it seem like nothing can make you see the true.
again working for Nissan for 20 years does not mean anything if you cant understand the flow dynamic into those headers.
also go tell every Nissan race team to go back to the HR headers since they are perfect.
01-25-2013, 03:18 PM
#29
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
http://www.fastintentions.com/produc...E%20copy_2.pdf
Here is a link to the fast intentions Lth with Hi flow cats on a 370z. I know it's not apples to apples but it gives you an idea that if the exhaust manifold design on the vq37hr can be with holding power, the ones on a hr can be improved as well.
Here is a link to the fast intentions Lth with Hi flow cats on a 370z. I know it's not apples to apples but it gives you an idea that if the exhaust manifold design on the vq37hr can be with holding power, the ones on a hr can be improved as well.
The stock headers were tested with CATS. I don't care what kind of cats, they are NOT test pipes. I'm also sure that there's a chance that a good run with headers & not such a good run with stock headers might have been used. Anyway, CATS VS TEST PIPES is a no contest. Any reason why no T.P comparison was done? I can give you one
01-25-2013, 03:22 PM
#30
NO! You're chart proves my point. First if you take 3 dyno runs there's always a best run, a worst run & a run in between. Let's put that aside for now.
The stock headers were tested with CATS. I don't care what kind of cats, they are NOT test pipes. I'm also sure that there's a chance that a good run with headers & not such a good run with stock headers might have been used. Anyway, CATS VS TEST PIPES is a no contest. Any reason why no T.P comparison was done? I can give you one
The stock headers were tested with CATS. I don't care what kind of cats, they are NOT test pipes. I'm also sure that there's a chance that a good run with headers & not such a good run with stock headers might have been used. Anyway, CATS VS TEST PIPES is a no contest. Any reason why no T.P comparison was done? I can give you one
dont worry andre,
im with you when I would love to see a proper test with different combo
since Im swaping the HR engine in my 370z.
I would love to do the test
OEM HR header + testpipe
PPE step long tube header
Momentum + test pipe.
if 2TH PWR will sell me his momentun once he gets his SGM header.
I will surely do the test
im glad I never sold my TP afterall
anyway I always go on the dyno after every mods in the past,
I will continu doing so and share the result.
Last edited by XChacalX; 01-25-2013 at 03:25 PM.
01-25-2013, 03:22 PM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ok im gonna stop here and start
you really think their HR oem header as the best on the market..
wow ,, ok
stay in your world then, since it seem like nothing can make you see the true.
again working for Nissan for 20 years does not mean anything if you cant understand the flow dynamic into those headers.
also go tell every Nissan race team to go back to the HR headers since they are perfect.
you really think their HR oem header as the best on the market..
wow ,, ok
stay in your world then, since it seem like nothing can make you see the true.
again working for Nissan for 20 years does not mean anything if you cant understand the flow dynamic into those headers.
also go tell every Nissan race team to go back to the HR headers since they are perfect.
You still provide no proof what so ever. Can you even show me ONE HR car that is quick with after market headers, long tube perhaps. THat's what I'm looking & waiting for. Show me ONE car....
01-25-2013, 03:26 PM
#32
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
dont worry andre,
im with you when I would love to see a proper test with different combo
since Im swaping the HR engine in my 370z.
I would love to do the test
OEM HR header + testpipe
PPE step long tube header
Momentum + test pipe.
if 2TH PWR will sell me his momentun once he gets his SGM header.
I will surely do the test
im glad I never sold my TP afterall
im with you when I would love to see a proper test with different combo
since Im swaping the HR engine in my 370z.
I would love to do the test
OEM HR header + testpipe
PPE step long tube header
Momentum + test pipe.
if 2TH PWR will sell me his momentun once he gets his SGM header.
I will surely do the test
im glad I never sold my TP afterall
HR 370z? 3.5 or 3.7 ?
01-25-2013, 03:34 PM
#33
to answer your previous post.
all I know for a fact is that Ive seen people gain power from going to an aftermarket header with stock cats on the HR
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
I had a spare HR engine that I had from my 350z old days.
I swaped the VHR crank/connecting rod and modified the HR piston to clear the oil jet and crank,
VQ37HR
all I know for a fact is that Ive seen people gain power from going to an aftermarket header with stock cats on the HR
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
I had a spare HR engine that I had from my 350z old days.
I swaped the VHR crank/connecting rod and modified the HR piston to clear the oil jet and crank,
VQ37HR
01-25-2013, 03:35 PM
#34
Registered User
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: san diego
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, modern emissions and hi performance emission systems don't really rob that much hp in the first place. I don't really get the point you are arguing. We all know long tubes don't have cats. Just like we all understand that from a mass production and performance stand point, Nissan did a great job with the stock exhaust manifolds for the price, performance, and emissions that they have to meet. However you are not understanding that chacal is simply stating that the design is not optimised for performance and that it can be improved oppon in a track or race application where emissions and price are not an issue. I think there is that saying in F1 where a 1/10 of a second costs $1,000,000. Or something to that effect.
Last edited by jwttz; 01-25-2013 at 03:46 PM.
01-25-2013, 03:41 PM
#35
Well, modern emissions and hi performance emission systems don't really rob that much hp in the first place. I don't really get the point you are arguing. We all know long tubes don't have cats. Just like we all understand that from a mass production and performance stand point, Nissan did a grea job with the stock exhaust manifolds for the price, performance ,and emissions that they have to meet. However you are not understanding that chacal is simply stating that the design is not optimised for performance and that it can be improved oppon in a track or race application where emissions and price are not an issue. I think there's that saying in F1 where a 1/10 of a second costs $1,000,000. Or something to that effect.
explained better than what I tried to. ! hehe
01-25-2013, 03:42 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
to answer your previous post.
all I know for a fact is that Ive seen people gain power from going to an aftermarket header with stock cats on the HR
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
I had a spare HR engine that I had from my 350z old days.
I swaped the VHR crank/connecting rod and modified the HR piston to clear the oil jet and crank,
VQ37HR
all I know for a fact is that Ive seen people gain power from going to an aftermarket header with stock cats on the HR
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
I had a spare HR engine that I had from my 350z old days.
I swaped the VHR crank/connecting rod and modified the HR piston to clear the oil jet and crank,
VQ37HR
I don't have a comment about your spare engine thing
01-25-2013, 03:47 PM
#37
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, modern emissions and hi performance emission systems don't really rob that much hp in the first place. I don't really get the point you are arguing. We all know long tubes don't have cats. Just like we all understand that from a mass production and performance stand point, Nissan did a grea job with the stock exhaust manifolds for the price, performance ,and emissions that they have to meet. However you are not understanding that chacal is simply stating that the design is not optimised for performance and that it can be improved oppon in a track or race application where emissions and price are not an issue. I think there's that saying in F1 where a 1/10 of a second costs $1,000,000. Or something to that effect.
Second I'm not interested in race cars with engines that cost more than 100K. Neither is anybody else in this forum.
01-25-2013, 03:48 PM
#38
already answered your question that you didnt read I guess.
as far as getting dynosheet for what I said I knew for a fact .
then no because that was a long time ago and im kind of tired trying to make you see the light than doing more research for YOU.
all I know for a fact is that Ive seen people gain power from going to an aftermarket header with stock cats on the HR
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
so yeah their oem headers does suck when you compare them to a true well made shorty headers , such as those Momentum header that I have seen in the pass. and even proven a great deal of gain on the 370z platform over OUR SAME HEADER (HR & VHR) use the same one.
then no because that was a long time ago and im kind of tired trying to make you see the light than doing more research for YOU.
01-25-2013, 03:52 PM
#40
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monticello new york 12701
Posts: 3,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts