The whole point was you came into someone's thread about them changing their S.C. for twin turbo's and you took this whole "I don't like F.I, I drove in someone's Z that was FI and it didn't feel fast....etc..." then you turn around and buy an Evo....Here's a perfect example: put up a thread called "I just bought a new car and I am so excited" and I'll come put all kinds of negative remarks in it. End of story, that's what you did to someone else.
I'm just sick of people raining on other parades....
P.s. I'm 5"10" 150lbs but I don't have small man syndrome where I'm as wide as I am tall.
Unsubscribed

 

There are 4,500 Evo IX's in the United States. How many 350z's are there?

Of the 4,500 Evo IX's, I bet there are only around 300-500 Big turbos.

You probably think Supra's are played out too don't you? Since there are only a couple thousand of them around.

Besides all of this, for the price of a Z and then a TT kit, youre going to have an empty pocket and an unreliable car. Sounds like a plan to me! How many 350z's are there in the US. . . 30-40k? Probably more? Hell theres only 23k SRT-4's and I see those 10 times a day.

Im not sure what my point is exactly. . . But I just couldnt believe you thought the 350z was more rare than an evo. . . hahahaha maybe I miss understood you or something. . . I surely do hope I did

 

NA BLOWS BIZZALLS

You are DEAD wrong if you think that NA is a cheaper way of getting power.

 

I never said anything about how many Z vs Evo's there are...doesn't have any interest to me. You need to read this entire post and see Rick's attitude about F.I. The biggest issue I had doesn't even have anything to do with cars. My buddy created this thread because he was selling the S.C. out of his car and purchased TT. Not really a place for your buddy to talk about how slow he felt our F.I. Z's were. Silly you created an account here for your 1 post just for this. I'm sorry I feel the need to step up and defend a friend, same thing you appear to be doing....I guess that's how WE are.
See ya April 25th @ Bandimere?

Attached is SAnyo's P.M. to me:
"Hey man, you put down some big numbers in your 350, I still dont think your car is that fast though. I would LOVE the chance to run you in my stock Evo. All this talk about a 350z keeping up with a properly built gt35r setup is rubbish. A gt35r evo should be running low 10's at this altitude, the boulder nissan Z struggled to get HIGH 10's.

Anyhow, let me know if you want to take the 350z out to play. I'd like the chance to humble you"



AGAIN I have never said a negetive word against EVO's, read the thread, if anything I like them. Someone has gave you some BAD info.
Sean

 

My attitude was simply an attempt to spur some debate/fun talk about different ways to build up a Z. Nothing more. My 'negativity' toward FI was strictly from my personal belief that the Z is not a great/highly suited engine for FI application, at least long-term/safely. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's just my take on it. Maybe it's just too hard to pick up on what people are saying online, because if anything, it seems like you had an attitude back at me, hence all this pointless flaming. Seriously, all I was trying to do was have a fun car talk about different approaches to building up an engine and it just went all personal instantly. Anyway, like I already said, I am sorry i 'highjacked' this thread, just trying to throw some other ideas into the mix. I think it's cool kev went with a big turbo, that's the way to make monster power on the z, but for my money as I've already stated, I wouldn't go that way. And besides, if you are after speed on the track, just look at David - he's running a mostly stock track car with no big turbo or anything like that and he easily put down the fastest laptime when me, him and kevin were at PMI last fall...

And last thing I'll say is - so what if I bought an FI car? When I looked at the cost involved in running up a 350z, which I still own btw, and thought about what MY goals are (track use, fun/thrilling speed), I decided to buy an EvoIX. If the car is designed for FI, then that’s fine, but if it’s not, like the z, which really is a masterful NA engine, then stick with NA. At this altitude though, I realized the only way to make the z run the way I wanted was with a FI upgrade and then the cost and all the other stuff entered into the formula and I decided to speed my money on a FI car. That's all, end of story...

 

Miss information. I've ran my Z @ 500+hp on stock block now for quite a while and I beat the crap out of it (and took great care of it maintenance and supportive mod wise ) and it ran like a champ. I've since sold it to my buddy who is using it now for drifting and runs it HARD and it's still running strong now with almost 100k miles on the engine. Was just as reliable as it was stock, stick to better arguments.

The GT35R setups I've seen on Evo's having been running mid to high 11's at Bandi. I've seen a few AWD cars in the high 10's with bigger turbo's. All depends on what kind of power the cars are pushing to the wheels uncorrected. Performance Nissan you figure is around 600+hp corrected. High 10's IMO is a damn good time for a car that is around 500 at the wheels uncorrected. My buddy with his 500awhp eclipse with nitrous did 12.0 @ ~118mph . Still has more in the car of course but he really needs more power to get him in the 11's. So uncorrected he's around 400ish awhp. Saying a GT35R should be an easy 10 is a pretty questionable statement at altitude.

 

Really? My stock evo kept up with (Read: Lost to) a 996TT with the X50 power package, exhaust and Tune. Only lost by 1.5 cars 60-110

And he figures his porsche is putting about 100 more to the wheels than the base 996tt

But you claim you an evo needs a gt35 to make it a race with you? Sure thing.

Also if you car is having a fuel problem and wont rev over 2500 or 3000 or whatever you said it was, thats not really as reliable as stock. . . unless they have that problem stock.

About the big turbos you see running mid to high 11's. . . . someone get them a driver? Clay is damn near 11's on STOCK TURBO.

 

I will jump in and state my opinion. To each their own. supercharging a 360 modena from novitec may not be the best bang for the buck, but it sure is different. I also think people need to realize how difficult it is to get almost any car to run 10's. I get a little tired of statements like sayno's. And in reference to his statement that we struggled to run high tens. I think that is because Z's are a new car. We fabricated alot of pieces on our Z that didn't exist at the time. Technology is coming on quick and should produce many more high performing Z's. By the way how many Evo's ran high tens last year at Bandimere??? I can't recall any. Jason

 

I just re-read my post and didn't want sayno to misinterpret what I was saying. I have alot of respect for Evo's as well as many other cars import and domestic, but I think people many forget what an advantage a forced induction car has over a N/A car at this altitude. If you look in the drag section you will see some very quick na Z's at lower elevations. And although low to mid 12's, such as Clays car, is very respectable for a street car I think most would agree that it begins to get very expensive for any car to break into the mid 11's much less 10's. To get back on topic I think people will be very impressed with Kevin's Z at the track once he gets comfortable with it. That car is going to flat haul. Jason

 

You must not know a lot about your new car. The Evo by NO MEANS is reliable beyond stock. The 4g63 engine has been plagued with all sort of nasty issues since it first came around. I should know ive had two of them and a buddy of mine with a 1000hp version so ive seen it all. Ive seen a version one eclipse shooting fuel out the top of the hood (he had taken it off for testing) because of issues. (Not to say to expect that). The lesson is, no matter what sort of car you have, doing anything to a stock car is risky and makes the car unreliable to some degree. Adding a bigger turbo on an already F/I car is safer yes, but its still not what the engine is designed for. Stock is stock for a reason. For effective safe big power on an evo you have to spend money and do things much like you would a Z. Its just easier to do thats all. You want the easier way out, fine by me. I love the old eclipse, i think the evo is sort of a brick but im still partial because of my heritage. I however drive a Z and love it and am considering a turbo kit, not for big numbers but to get back to what power i had when i bought the damn thing at sea level. Dont bash one or the other, there are methods to get anything done and they all are complex and expensive to some degree. Congrats on your purchase, i do invite you to take that out to a track sometime and see just how well it does. Sadly i think your going to have a tough time with a lot of the Zs on this board and in this forum, i know personally i would not be scared to get in line at PMI for some fun. Loosing or winning its the best way to see what a car can really do. My point? Lay off bashing one ideal or the other and stop pretending to be the definitve resource on how the evo is quicker. Everyone has their own opinion on what fast is, yours just dont match with some other people. Glad to hear your thoughts, but dont put down other people for theirs. (By the way, supras are played out, and its only because of FF1. And now the Z's are going the same way because of FF3.)

 

Oh, and by the way, the Porsche was being nice to you....

 

Raced him about 5 times, same result each time. He is on CRN, SupraDuc, pm him, he will tell you I suprised the **** out of him.

Granted after 110, he would have pulled pretty damn hard. But my car is trapping a good bit under 110, so that really doesn't bother me :P

 

[QUOTE=myspivey]The Evo by NO MEANS is reliable beyond stock. The 4g63 engine has been plagued with all sort of nasty issues since it first came around.[QUOTE]

Thats very true, but heres two points for you to consider.

At this altitude, a 350z NEEDS a turbo to perform on par with an Evo that is stock. Which is more reliable, stock evo, or turbo z?

Also, the 4g63 in the Evo 9 has little to nothing in common with the 4g63 in a DSM. Most 4g63 problems you hear of are because of the 6 bolt bottom end. Evo 9 has a 7 bolt, the evo 9 engine also has larger oil and cooling passages in addition to MIVEC.

I do know that an Evo wont be the most reliable thing on earth with a big turbo. But why would I need a big turbo when I can make close to 400whp on the stocker, and run 12's at bandi? Thats the whole reason I got rid of the srt-4, I need something reliable AND fast. The srt-4 fit the bill, but had very very little potential at this altitude without a big turbo, and once you go big turbo the reliability aspect greatly decreases. Hell guys were struggling to break into 12's with a 75 shot of NOS and all the bolt on's on srt-4's.

Now im not trying to say "OMGWTFBBQ my evo PWNS your 350 noob machine"

Not at all, there is a reason the 350z has won so many awards and I believe was voted by motortrend as the BEST car for under 30k.

But for my wants, and needs, the evo was a better car. Works great in winter, and I can stuff a pair of mountain bikes IN it, without a stupid rack strapped to my roof :P

 

To counter, the Evo on a track stock, has nothing against a stock Z, what so ever. I spanked two of them with drivers that were decent. It just cant do it, yes you have the pull of AWD, but in the same vein, that hurts you and slows you down and i have the torque right there to help me through that corner and if i go at it hot, im sliding the back end around not nose diving into the dirt. You think drag, i think track, thats the differance since i see no point in going in a straight line, it proves nothing and is a waste of gas (not to say i havent done it, we all get stupid sometimes).

As for the engine, i can take that engine apart in an hour if i was so inclined so trust me, i get the diffs, but its still a 4G63 engine with the same cast parts. Yes as you noted they upped the anty and fixed a lot of problems from the 1st and 2nd generation models, however much of it still stays the same. You still run the same risks we did when we were putting down the power your gunning for, i think your thoughts on what you can achieve might be a tad bit skewed since your trusting your engine more than most will and your likely to tax it to the level most wouldnt. If thats your goal i say go for it! The turbo is a fun turbo, i had that and the 14b. However your goal of running 12's off that turbo and engine, well, lets just say, i wish your turbo luck and pray you down throw the bearings out or in worst case shred the drive wheel and throw it into your engine as ive seen done several times when pushing the turbo up to its very limits. Boost is boost and the more of it you have the more dangers you run. Also i pray your fuel system will be up to par since ive yet to have seen one that worked well (but its ok because on that front, your still better off than a Z, we have the most *** backwards fuel system known to man as im coming to learn...). Im getting back to my first point, you have ideas on what you think fast is and how to get it. Thats good for you, however, others on this forum including myself see it in other ways and you need to respect that and not think that by any means the evo is the better option, its another option, not the better. Frankly i could buy a used arial atom for 30k (Ask joel about racing one of these) and spank you in any fashion i desired, but that doesnt meet my goal of having an adult car with heated leather seats and all that jazz. Frankly if you want the battle of whats better, currently my car doesnt have the image that its driven by 14-15 year olds who just got their license and a trust fund to burn. The Z by a slim margin still holds the fold for being an adult owned mature car, thats fading fast since FF3, but it holds it. The Evo, well, not so much, although your better off than Subi/Honda will ever be in this state (or most states for that matter)... The sum of all this nonsense is be open minded to others thoughts and try to avoid coming into a topic bashing on something you dont know. You dont know what it takes to turbo the Z really since you never did it, you dont know what each kit feels like since youve never ridden in them all, there is a lot you dont know (and it seems like a fair amount you do) so try to be open that maybe someone has found a way to reach their goal in a fashion that you might not have thought of. Or for that matter might not fully understand. I respect your Evo, i cant wait to hear the race stories, and i wish you luck against someone like Kevin who by all means will beat the holy crap out of you (And anything else that gets in his way, damn crazy man). Also i pray you and sean can find some even ground, work it out, and put it down on a track in the civil way and see what happens. And i also still urge you to come out to some place like PMI, get comfy with the track, and then race some different cars to get a real feel for it, highway rolling starts dont count for **** in my book.

 

Not bad, I ran a 06 when I was at 450hp and pulled it easily. But the part I hang up on is stock Evo. Granted I've read a couple of them running low 12's on drag setup on stock turbo which is pretty darn impressive. But I've raced 8's and 9's with stock to GT35R's and have only been taken by one (highway pulls was never a fan of stoplight drags). That was one that actually used his GT35R and was pumping out ~570awhp. I dont have any problem admitting that guy handed me my ***, he definitely had a hella fast car.

That's interesting though that a 480hp Porsche only beat a stock ~300awhp Evo 9 by ~1.5 cars from 60-110mph.
I didnt claim that. I was saying that I definitely dont think a stock Evo 8/9 will hold up to a TN Z with stock boost. They were no competition to my car even when it was barely at 6psi and pushing 399/381. A GT35R is a different story and very subjective. What kinda boost, mods? I ran a STi rotated mount GT35R at 6psi and he coudnt pull me, granted I could pull him either but I also think his setup could of used more boost to begin with. With the exception of the moderate boost GT35R (which handed me my ***) the rest of the GT35R Evo's couldn't hang with me at 10psi @ the MAP at all. I still pulled them even at 9psi and 450hp. I dont think all Evo GT35R setups are slow, just the ones that lost to me lol.

Car runs fine, it did act up 4 times in 2 months after going to 11.6psi wastegate springs but didnt act up after that. We went over the lines and fixed a leak by the rear tank. For as much flogging I gave the car and all that it went thru with my right foot it impressed the heck out of me that I only had that one issue which was easily amendable and not even related to the part breaking from repeated abuse.

Has Clay ran at Bandimere? But for the most part I agree, a GT35R on an Evo is no joke, I'm sure with a pro they could rip up some great times. Just like a Z that has it's suspension and tire setup dialed in for the strip. And I'm talking about a boosted Z, not N/A, because the fastest I've seen from a N/A Z from a great driver was 14.7 at Bandimere granted which is definitely fast for a Z up here.

 

Interestingly enough when I was N/A with cams, exhaust, no cats, pullies I pulled a stock Evo 8 pretty good (2-3 cars) everytime we got our fun runs in. I later raced a blue Evo about a year ago on 470 and he barely pulled me from our highway run from about 60 to 120. Granted at that time I was just happy to even put up a fight against an Evo seeing how being NA really sucked.

 

Anything can happen on a track, but I can tell you, stock for stock, the Evo IX outperforms a 350z. On a road course, Nordchleife to be specific. The Evo made it around the track about 15 seconds quicker ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordsch...test_lap_times ), now obviously there were different drivers in each car so that may not be 100% accurate.

If you are implying that the Evo will understeer at the limit you couldn't be more wrong. The evo, while not as tail happy as a RWD 350z, is more than happy to swing the back end around with proper provaction.

Also for what its worth, the Evo handles a TINY bit better than a Z, .92g on a skidpad to the 350's .90g. The 350 even has the advantage in this category with the much wider stock tires.

What I am getting at I suppose is that at sea level, the 350z will lose (just barely) in straight line acceleration, that is not from a stop, and might handle as well.

The drivers of the Evo's you say youve beaten were obviously quite poor as the evo has a tiny handling advantage, HUGE power advantage (at this altitude) AND better brakes!

350z quoted 60-0 is anywhere from 110ft-118ft
Evo IX ranges from 104ft-111ft


There are a few BONE STOCK evo's running 12's, obviously not at bandi, but they are out there, and boost is boost, sure, but after my tuning session I'm still boosting below stock, but am making 240whp uncorrected instead of 220.

Also, as far as I know, clay hasn't had any major problems with his setup and hes running the EXACT same turbo I am, but on 26psi instead of 19.

I know all about the atom, and could care less if one beat my Evo, I have 4 doors, a heater, and AC They are some AMAZING little machines though, I've considered buying one off and on for the last few months.

For one, the last thing I think about when buying a car is "What will other people think of me" and two; I bought it all by my self

I have HUGE respect for turbo Z's, and am not bashing them, hr2burn posted that PM WITHOUT my permission (on some forums thats an instant ban, im sure its not here). PM stands for PRIVATE message, I suppose he doesn't understand that. For what its worth, the boulder z is faster than any car I ever plan on owning, so to say im bashing it is well. . . not true.

I know what is involved in turbo'ing an NA motor, I was about a week from putting one onto my 1990 prelude before deciding to buy an srt-4 instead. It's one of the hardest mods you can do, and in the same token its a B$%#& to keep them running perfectly. So if you can make passes down the track and then drive your turbo Z home, youve obvisouly worked hard.

 

Back on topic - Kevin!!! Where's your fuel system!? Spill the beans bud!

 

I wont deny you beat a stock evo 8. But I will tell you this much, my car could EASILY put down over 300whp at mac with thier easy dyno and ULTRA generous correction. You were putting down a high estimate of 260 lets say.

You weigh about 50 pounds more than an evo, are 40hp short of an evo, and the evo has shorter gearing which is a HUGE advantage. Obviously they were HORRID drivers.

There are some BAD BAD drivers out there, and for that matter some VERY poorly modded cars. When I went to bandi in my srt-4, there was a guy there with 100, yes ONE HUNDRED ft lbs more tq than me, and 40 more hp in his srt-4, and his fastest time was a tenth slower than my stocker.

Now as for me keeping up with that porsche, think gearing, at 110mph Im ready to shift to 5th, hes ALMOST topping out 3rd. It makes a HUGE difference

 

Am I the only one who doesn't give a $hit here about this guys fukin Evo?

Another thread down the tubes........sorry Kev, I guess you will need to start a new one.