WODDERYERTHINKABOUT COTY award?
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From: Oz
Makes sense though. 1st ever for suicide doors and a 'so called' sedan that looks sporty. Engine that spins to 9000rpm (and not a conventional piston engine). Beutifull gearchange and very nice interior and on top of that RWD. Not only that but priced at around $55k, I can see why it would win.
What has the 350Z to offer when you look at it that way? It's a RWD drive car with a reasonably big engine. There's not much 'unique' (or special) about the car when looking at the specs alone. The fact that it's fast and drives real well is not as much a priority as (let's say) '1st ever suicide doors' when voting for COTY.
COTY is for the masses, not for a nitch market (ie. enthusiasts) ... you'll never see Boxster S, M3 CSL, 911 GT3 or F355 win COTY. What do they have to offer to the masses?
ps. RX8 is a much better winner then the last couple years (ie. Falcon, Commodore Magna, etc).
What has the 350Z to offer when you look at it that way? It's a RWD drive car with a reasonably big engine. There's not much 'unique' (or special) about the car when looking at the specs alone. The fact that it's fast and drives real well is not as much a priority as (let's say) '1st ever suicide doors' when voting for COTY.
COTY is for the masses, not for a nitch market (ie. enthusiasts) ... you'll never see Boxster S, M3 CSL, 911 GT3 or F355 win COTY. What do they have to offer to the masses?
ps. RX8 is a much better winner then the last couple years (ie. Falcon, Commodore Magna, etc).
Last edited by DavidM; Jan 20, 2004 at 03:56 AM.
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From: Oz
RX-8 for the masses?
Well it's got a back seat, has 4 doors, luggage space and on top of that it is pretty sporty. Anyone who is looking at a WRX or STi (or even Monaro) will probably look at this as well. So, I'd say that it is a lot more of a car for the 'masses' then something like a Lotus Elise.
How many have they sold?
First couple of months are always hard to judge as there's always a backlog of pre-orders and the numbers are not indicative of where the sales will 6 months down the track. Noneless, around 250 units were sold in the last month (in Oz). To put that into perspective they sell about that many Holden Astras Convertibles (ie. best selling 'sports car' at the moment)and WRXs can't get close to it these days. They sell around 200 Monaros per month, 90 911s, 80 MX5s, 60 Boxsters, 15 S2000s, and about 2 Elises. In the other scale, how does 7000 Commodres sound?
And uneconomical ****** engines?
I did not say that is was better than a 'conventional' engine, but that it was unique/different and that is always a high priority with something like COTY.
As far as PCOTY goes, I'd say that the 350Z has a pretty good shot, but there's a fair bit of competition.
Well it's got a back seat, has 4 doors, luggage space and on top of that it is pretty sporty. Anyone who is looking at a WRX or STi (or even Monaro) will probably look at this as well. So, I'd say that it is a lot more of a car for the 'masses' then something like a Lotus Elise.
How many have they sold?
First couple of months are always hard to judge as there's always a backlog of pre-orders and the numbers are not indicative of where the sales will 6 months down the track. Noneless, around 250 units were sold in the last month (in Oz). To put that into perspective they sell about that many Holden Astras Convertibles (ie. best selling 'sports car' at the moment)and WRXs can't get close to it these days. They sell around 200 Monaros per month, 90 911s, 80 MX5s, 60 Boxsters, 15 S2000s, and about 2 Elises. In the other scale, how does 7000 Commodres sound?
And uneconomical ****** engines?
I did not say that is was better than a 'conventional' engine, but that it was unique/different and that is always a high priority with something like COTY.
As far as PCOTY goes, I'd say that the 350Z has a pretty good shot, but there's a fair bit of competition.
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From: NEWCASTLE - NSW - AUS
Davidm - the 350Z wasn't in the shortlist. How many Z's sold v rx8's?
Are you saying that they outsold wrx's? That would really surprisr me.
Where do you get the info re sale nos? I'd be interested to follow sales of a number of vehicles over time.
FROZZLED
Are you saying that they outsold wrx's? That would really surprisr me.
Where do you get the info re sale nos? I'd be interested to follow sales of a number of vehicles over time.
FROZZLED
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From: Oz
Davidm - the 350Z wasn't in the shortlist.
It's a shame, but I'm not surprised at all. As I said before, I've never seen a 911, Ferrari, Elise, Boxster (etc) on the 'shortlist' before .... and that is a pretty good company to be in. When the MX5 and NSX won I was very shocked/surprised (and plesantly so). I'd rather be doing well in PCOTY (or even BFYB) though.
How many Z's sold v rx8's?
In the first few months of sales there were around 100 units per month. I am not sure what the numbers are now, but considering that the 'pre order' rush is well and over, I'm sure it's a lot lower. I don't have the exact numbers for the Zed, but 3 months ago I was reading how the RX8 is 'clobbering' the Zed in terms of sales and how Nissan is making more 'incentives' to up the sales.
Are you saying that they outsold wrx's? That would really surprisr me.
No, not 350Zs .... not even in the 1st couple of months of sales. Thouigh, the RX8s are outselling the WRXs at this very moment, but I'm sure it'll be shortlived (just like the 'new car' sales always are). Astra Convertible and Monaro outsell the WRX consistently.
ps. I already see a lot more RX8s on the road than 350Zs. Something like 10 to 1 around here.
Where do you get the info re sale nos? I'd be interested to follow sales of a number of vehicles over time.
Car magazines (like Wheels) often have a mention at the end, but mostly there was a local monthly car newspaper that listed the sales for every month. I was folliwning it for the last couple of years, but I have not seen the mag/newspaper anywhere in the last 6 (or so) months.
It's a shame, but I'm not surprised at all. As I said before, I've never seen a 911, Ferrari, Elise, Boxster (etc) on the 'shortlist' before .... and that is a pretty good company to be in. When the MX5 and NSX won I was very shocked/surprised (and plesantly so). I'd rather be doing well in PCOTY (or even BFYB) though.
How many Z's sold v rx8's?
In the first few months of sales there were around 100 units per month. I am not sure what the numbers are now, but considering that the 'pre order' rush is well and over, I'm sure it's a lot lower. I don't have the exact numbers for the Zed, but 3 months ago I was reading how the RX8 is 'clobbering' the Zed in terms of sales and how Nissan is making more 'incentives' to up the sales.
Are you saying that they outsold wrx's? That would really surprisr me.
No, not 350Zs .... not even in the 1st couple of months of sales. Thouigh, the RX8s are outselling the WRXs at this very moment, but I'm sure it'll be shortlived (just like the 'new car' sales always are). Astra Convertible and Monaro outsell the WRX consistently.
ps. I already see a lot more RX8s on the road than 350Zs. Something like 10 to 1 around here.
Where do you get the info re sale nos? I'd be interested to follow sales of a number of vehicles over time.
Car magazines (like Wheels) often have a mention at the end, but mostly there was a local monthly car newspaper that listed the sales for every month. I was folliwning it for the last couple of years, but I have not seen the mag/newspaper anywhere in the last 6 (or so) months.
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From: Perth Western Australia
I've written for motoring mags in my dark distant past. Lets just say that there are other factors that dictate who gets awards or not. Nudge Nudge. And they don't always rely on the merits of the cars in question. The mere fact that a Magna won in the past should put it in perspective.
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From: Sydney, Australia
Just found this site http://www.autoindustries.com.au/index.php
Still doesn't breakdown models though? Will keep looking.
MF
Still doesn't breakdown models though? Will keep looking.
MF
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From: Sydney Australia
I never take it too serious in the COTY or the like, I only buy those mag for reading at leasure.
To me those COTY thing is for car manufacturer to promote their cars, its barely advertising. whoever "treat" the reviewer or car mag well gets the reward
To me those COTY thing is for car manufacturer to promote their cars, its barely advertising. whoever "treat" the reviewer or car mag well gets the reward
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From: Sydney, Australia
DavidM - 350Z for PCOTY is a long shot IMO.
The judges will critisize the bumpy ride, despite the fact that on a track, it handles very well. I also expect that they will also critise the "rough engine" at higher revs. Finally, it's also about 40kW underpowered to mount a serious arguement in the performace stakes.
Personally, I think the 300kW HSV GTS is a strong contender. It does everything well and can lap the twisty Wakefield Park raceway faster than the Z, so the arguement that an 1800kg car cannot handle well is baseless. But it will not win. A german marque will take the gong - probably Porche 911 GT3 - and I wouldn't argue with that choice.
The judges will critisize the bumpy ride, despite the fact that on a track, it handles very well. I also expect that they will also critise the "rough engine" at higher revs. Finally, it's also about 40kW underpowered to mount a serious arguement in the performace stakes.
Personally, I think the 300kW HSV GTS is a strong contender. It does everything well and can lap the twisty Wakefield Park raceway faster than the Z, so the arguement that an 1800kg car cannot handle well is baseless. But it will not win. A german marque will take the gong - probably Porche 911 GT3 - and I wouldn't argue with that choice.
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From: Oz
KY350, I don't disagree with your assesment. Though, if they have the M3 CSL there then that is my pick for a winner as it will have the performance, feel and all at a measly $210k. Though, I'm not sure if they can get their hands on one.
HSV GTS will not be there, but they'll have the new HSV R8 there ... that one has 285kW and it costs only around $75k. That has a good shot.
My short list of the 'potential' PCOTY winners is (probably in the order of chances):
1) M3 CSL
2) 911 GT3
3) 350Z Track
4) HSV R8
5) Z4 3.0
6) RX8
The 'harsh ride' and practicality should not be of as much of an issue in PCOTY as outright perofomance numbers, feel and lap-times.
HSV GTS will not be there, but they'll have the new HSV R8 there ... that one has 285kW and it costs only around $75k. That has a good shot.
My short list of the 'potential' PCOTY winners is (probably in the order of chances):
1) M3 CSL
2) 911 GT3
3) 350Z Track
4) HSV R8
5) Z4 3.0
6) RX8
The 'harsh ride' and practicality should not be of as much of an issue in PCOTY as outright perofomance numbers, feel and lap-times.
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