dmoffitt

iTrader: (4)

I'm _STILL_ trying to figure out wtf to do about wheels/tires. I'm happy with my square setup on street tires with the 350evo sways set to mid front and soft in the back - the car is neutral, can be steered with the throttle easily, doesn't like to push even on slightly hot corner entry but isn't twitchy or loose either - all told I couldn't be happier.

Question is - for someone who's not used race tires before (other than AutoX in my girlfriend's boxster) will I get "more of the same" if I stay with a square setup or would a slightly more understeer-prone staggered setup be wiser?

Billhyco

iTrader: (14)

typically if your going to have more grip in the rear then in the front b/c of a staggered setup what do you think is going to happen?? its gonna push. typically the huge HP cars run a staggered setup b/c they have trouble getting the power to the ground IE: Z06.

Nothing here to back any of that up, but to me just makes sense. I run 245 on all four corners, road racing.

betamotorsports

iTrader: (1)

Increasing tire grip sometimes brings out aspects of chassis balance that are not apparant with less grippy tires. The differences won't be great and you should be able to tune it with shocks, sways, and alignment. You might want to increase overall spring rate.

And if you're car is balanced now, don't go with a staggered setup for the reasons mentioned above.

dmoffitt

iTrader: (4)

thanks for clarifying!

first350

iTrader: (24)

I'm currently running square on the street and R-comps for AutoX...car handles the same, just tons less grip (I've autoX'd w/ both my street tires and R-comps).

dkmura

iTrader: (64)

In my experience running Goodyear bias-ply slicks on Nissan GT cars, they offer another dimension in traction (when hot). They typically need less camber (1.0-1.5) than R-compounds, but also offer fewer heat cycles and overall tire life. If you feel your handling setup is neutral, I'd suggest sticking with it vs. going to a staggered setup.

Dave 90TT

iTrader: (4)

I run 245's front, 265's rear for my race tires; however, I have a TT G35, which does tend to kick the tail out on throttle. For a stock, or semi stock VQ, I would recommend sqare all around.

Tires are BF Goodrich G-force R1's, which I highly recommend. Very sticky, and cery talkative. They tell you when you are getting close to losing traction.

Dave

dmoffitt

iTrader: (4)

To clarify things a bit myself, I used to have a TT car with a staggered wheel/tire setup and felt that yes, it pushed but I could just use more power to get it to oversteer... however, now with the nearly-stock VQ and a good suspension / setup, it's very VERY neutral. Been debating NT01s, RA1s, or maybe going up to the R6 but I'm still hung up on what wheels to use - my 18x9.5 LMGT4s fit a 275 street tire fine (ran PS2s and RE050 PPs) but I'm worried about inside clearance at ET30 with a dot-R since that's like 10.6 vs 10.94-11.x depending on the brand of the trackday tire. I was thinking of keeping the NISMO wheels for streets (to be used at colder end-of- or early-season DEs or in the rain) and getting something else like an ET22-25 for the slicks...

So frustrating / confusing trying to fit this much tire up front.

Billhyco

iTrader: (14)

I think there are a few guys running 275 on all corners. Not sure of drop or offest on the wheels, however. Mount one up and try it, see what happens. Ultimately that is what I would like to be running. I use the stocker 17's with Kuhmo V710's - 245 all around. Would love to bump to 275 all around with stickies. I can induce oversteer pretty easily with the 245's but for me seems to help me learn to be more smooth with throttle input and so forth.

joeygill

iTrader: (4)

FWIW I run 275's RA-1 all around on a 9" wheel with +35 offset. This is on a G35 coupe. I had minor rub on the front against the upper A arms, solved with a 5mm spacer.

I've seen others at the track with Z's run 275's all around with no issues at all, I understand that the Z has more clearance up front than the G. A wheel with +30 or +25 offset should be fine.

I like the 275 all around setup, very neutral. The steering does get a little sluggish though. I run 350EVO sways at med all around. Hope this helps!

first350

iTrader: (24)

I've run:
- 275 RA-1s on the OE 17s
-275 Hankook R-comps on 17X8.5 +22 rims

no rubbing. (-2 camber all around, 2-2.5" drop)

z-u-later

iTrader: (43)

I am currently running both staggered and square setup so I'll give you my opinion on both:

STAGGERED SETUP (STREET)
Rims: Stock 18x8 (F) / 18x8.5 (R)
Tires: Bridgestones RE040 225/40 (F) / 245/40 (R)
Comment: Okay for street. I used this setup for autocross (26 runs) and it is slow (heavy rims & POS tires).

SQUARE SETUP (TRACK 1)
Rims: Track 18x8 (F) / 18.5 (R)
Tires: Toyo RA-1 245/40 (F/R)
Comment: This is a fast setup -- combination of light rims & light tires. I bought the tires used and so far, I've had 34 runs on them. I like this setup but wider tires would even be better.

SQUARE SETUP (TRACK 2)
Rims: Stock 17x8 (F/R)
Tires: Hankook Z211 275/40 (F/R)
Comment: I'm still in the early stages of this setup. I bought two used sets of the 17" rims to get this square setup (17x8 on all four corners). The tires were bought new and I'm still breaking them in (only 19 runs). Based on my experience so far, my Track 1 setup is faster but this Track 2 setup has more grip. This setup also feels more neutral. However, the 17" rims are heavy (over 20lbs) and this setup would definitely benefit if I had lighter & slightly wider rims (9" would be ideal).

Recommendation: Like most track enthusiasts, we only get better by learning from experience. I figured the best way for me to learn was to experiment with various setups (different size rims, different size tires, etc.). Based on my experience with my setup, and my experience alone, here is what I would recommend:

1. Go with a "square/square" setup -- same size rims, same size tires. The benefits are obvious -- neutral handling, best rotational options, etc.

2. For autocross, go with 17" light rims (17x9). For road course, go with 18" light rims (18x9).

3. Wider tires are definitely better but make sure they are light also. For some reason, the Toyo RA-1s are very light compared to other brands. Also, remember that with 17" rims, the tires are cheaper and you have a wider selection. The 275/40 is a good setup but an even faster setup is 265/35, 275/35 or 285/30 -- wider but shorter tires, hence lighter and higher RPMs. Lastly, make sure the tires are "unidirectional" - this is important when you want to rotate them.

I hope the information I have provided is helpful.

dmoffitt

iTrader: (4)

I also was considering Michelin Pilot Sport Cups @ 265/35/18 on all 4, same width evidently as my 275 Bridgestone street tires. Main thing I was hoping was to avoid the cost (and often long wait) of another set of the NISMOs

1cockyZ

iTrader: (46)

wouldn't you want assymetrical tires so you can cross rotate.

dmoffitt

iTrader: (4)

That WOULD be ideal... btw I think you meant symetric. RA1 and R6 is, both the NT01 and V710 (along with the MPSC) are not. The NT01 or MPSC seems like the logical "next step up" from street tires while providing some longevity. I will have done 11 DEs and 3 lapping days this year so expensive but short lived tires are not high on my list.

halfrice

iTrader: (30)

Tried searching but couldnt find anything, noticed most track/autox guys run square wheel setups instead of staggered. Just wanted to know what your guys opinion on the 2 setups for track use.

mistico

iTrader: (5)

The Z has some understeer with the staggered setup.

Most of us go square and then dial it in with sway bar settings. FI guys usually go wider in the rear for added traction when getting on the gas.

You can run either. If you haven't run a square setup, try it and see how it compares to the staggered setup.

pchio

iTrader: (11)

Square setup gives you a much more neutral and balance feeling, eliminates oversteer and quick transition throughout turns. The car will most likely oversteer at times, and harder to control (vs understeer), but you can also use that as your advantage for quicker turn-in.

Staggered setup actually slower(just what I feel) and as mistico said, mainly use for high power F/I car. However, it does give you a more confident feeling in corners (understeer instead of oversteer), it is better for the drivers who are still learning the lines, braking point, throttle input e.t.c.

It just my experience with both setups on the track, I am no expert on these. I have seen a Z with staggered setup drives faster than I do, so it all depends on the driver. Different drivers have different inputs. However, I noticed on those Z time-attacks in Japan, almost 95% of them used square setup on N/A motor with the most popular size 265/35 18. There must be a reason.

P.S. I just finished a set of tires 255 40r18 (square setup), so i am going back to staggered setup on the next track day since I got a set of free tires. Then I will see if it makes a big difference.

1cockyZ

iTrader: (46)

Square so you can rotate the tires it just ends up being cost effective. I like the car more neutral so the square is nice there as well.

QuicksilverZ33

iTrader: (34)

I went from a 245/275 to a 275 square and still getting used to it...