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Suspension 101

Old 06-11-2010, 12:04 PM
  #121  
GeauxLadyZ
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Refer to "Suspension 101 Thread" and read for answers, here: (Both True and OEM styles advantages/disadvantages are covered)

https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...ion-101-a.html

IBJasonseesthisbiatch
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Old 06-11-2010, 12:09 PM
  #122  
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^^^^hahahaha - good one..

True Coils will always get my vote..
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Old 06-11-2010, 12:18 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by GeauxLadyZ View Post
Refer to "Suspension 101 Thread" and read for answers, here: (Both True and OEM styles advantages/disadvantages are covered)

https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...ion-101-a.html

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Originally Posted by AcidJake75 View Post
^^^^hahahaha - good one..

True Coils will always get my vote..
LOL!!

dude true coilovers or go home dammn it!!!

Read the suspension 101 thread....

True coil overs let you eliminate the need of the shiiet tastic spc toe bolts (eccentric 3 degree washer/bolts) and let you run TOE ARMS ....thus letting you remove the spring bucket and turn it into a flower pot!

Run Toe arms of course installed with lock out washers.



With oem style coilovers.......i wouldn't dare unless i purchased the SPL pro midlink -- but doing so sometimes calls for having to purchase 'specific' springs, as not ALL springs will fit in the SPL pro midlink.



-J
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Old 06-11-2010, 12:38 PM
  #124  
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i have stance LX OEM style and while they are very nice, my car is low as all living sh#t and they are adjusted all the way UP... they lower the car a TON. Fronts seem to have more range in them, but compared to what Ive heard about Tein basic etc... they dont drop much at all in the rear.. stance is def not the case.. .

HEY ! make sure to buy them form Pete at Intensepower.com.. it is THE best deal on them out there period, and IM sure he'd price match if you saw otherwise.
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Old 06-11-2010, 03:40 PM
  #125  
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True Coilover +1

you will get such better consistency in the suspension since you will have a consistent preload.
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Old 06-11-2010, 04:55 PM
  #126  
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<----owns spl midlinks(with lockouts) and does not wish to have "true" coilovers.

reference this thread for all the info you could ever want:

https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...er-or-not.html
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Old 06-12-2010, 06:38 AM
  #127  
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how NOT to install your rear oem style Stance coilovers!

Sadly, this is how a performance shop installed mine....

The ajustable perch is supposed to be on top. The perch and spring are both upside-down...
Attached Thumbnails Suspension 101-0612100905a.jpg  

Last edited by avb3; 06-13-2010 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 06-13-2010, 05:57 AM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by bimmertech View Post
<----owns spl midlinks(with lockouts) and does not wish to have "true" coilovers.

reference this thread for all the info you could ever want:

https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...er-or-not.html
That is a great thread to read for proper suspension geometries, race configurations and learning what best "fits your needs" situations in doing so..

Those that read that thread and are even capable to 'follow' pretty much already know what they want and or need prior to even seeing that thread......

The OP stated:
Originally Posted by ROM350Z View Post
Im buying stance gr+ soon. Im debating on wether to go true type on the rear or OEM style in the rear. i cant decide which will be better for me. im not looking to slam the car but also not have any finger gap in the rear. i want to have the rear low to the point where theres no finger gap without any perch modification or ect... this car is daily driven and will occasionally be autox'd.
to me, holding alignment on a daily driven car and having easy adjustability would suite him more......most of the true coilovers are gonna have the spring rated needed on that set up and killing the upper bushing will take quite a while with his "uses"

Originally Posted by ROM350Z View Post
I just want to know whats better to go with. im running wider wheels and tires too btw.
op, your obviously new and learning suspension...........my first thought for you and your needs is to get a true set up that you can get to hold alignment and not have to fuss with.

adjusting and working on true coil overs is much easier track side and easier to learn and do physically over adjustable oem setups and having TOE ARMS over spring buckets with lockout washers makes toe adjustments EASY and make them hold true with out slipping eccentric washers....

You will end up with a car that doesn't need alignment after ever autoX event or even a few months of spirited street driving due to crappy eccentric washer slip..

NOw that being said - it requires the purchase of toe arms/lock out washer combo......many many people see the low cost alternative of buying the spc eccentric toe bolts as cheaper cost wise and run that due to cost......in the end its all a decision you make.......i know tons of people that do this....cause they don't wanna spend money on toe arms/lockout washer combo...

and you know what, fine.........you can buy true coilovers and use the oem spring bucket with inexpensive spc toe bolts for now and when you do have the money later you can add toe arms and lockout washers.....

reading his 'needs' i feel he would benefit more from a car that had that set up.... in the end its his decision and his money...

TOO ALL:
It seems way to common for an expert to come into a thread and blow away the lil guy weekend warrior..............but the two have completely different needs and whats best is completely different...

Originally Posted by bimmertech View Post
does not wish to have "true" coilovers.
Tell us why??? im sure for your 'needs' its a smart choice completely but doesn't help the OP.... and linking him to a thread thats fillled with race geometry specs/discussion is good but do ya think he will really benefit???



With my suspension 101 thread and helping nature I realize that NOT everyone is a hard core "TRACK GUY" that owns a trailer and hits every race in the series.......

I'm not...i consider myself a weekend warrior, yet im smart enough to know the differences in suspension and reasons why to use..............my life, my time doesn't permit more racing...........sure i can give up some things and make a complete series but I 'choose' not too............I do however choose to help those out there and promote motor sports........we need the grass roots level.....

rounding peeps up and hitting an autoX event and having everyone happy and rejoicing that they came is amazing......most are scared or nervous at the beginning of the day and super excited and happy at the end of the day....

in the end OP, you can read between whats available and make a good choice for yourself.....

im merging this thread.....
-J
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Old 06-13-2010, 06:48 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by JasonZ-YA View Post



Tell us why??? im sure for your 'needs' its a smart choice completely but doesn't help the OP.... and linking him to a thread thats fillled with race geometry specs/discussion is good but do ya think he will really benefit???



With my suspension 101 thread and helping nature I realize that NOT everyone is a hard core "TRACK GUY" that owns a trailer and hits every race in the series.......

-J
i'm far from a hardcore track guy, and will never own a trailer. i'm more in your boat, just a dude that loves to pound on his car.

that being said, the largest downside imo to putting the spring on the damper is the spindle. i'm not totally against the idea in general(i have relocated springs on other cars i have owned with good success) but after looking at the spindle closely you can see that the material that will be now supporting the entire weight of the vehicle is very small and was not designed to withstand the extra load. being a poor guy who buys parts when he can, the cost of having someone design a rear spindle is just too much.

in that thread, adam @z1 summed it up best with his quote:

What is not taking into account is the presumption that a a true rear coilover has no place. Of course it does, and of course it can be done with probably good results. However, what has been said from the beginning, both in this, and all the other discussions we've had about it over the years, is that there are many other changes that must be done in order to correctly implement such a setup. No one in this discussion owns a full out race car, and no one touting the $1000 'true' coilovers have made any such changes either. So like anything else you end up with a bunch of "I use it and it's great" posts, vs "I use it and here is what I changed in order to be able to do so properly, and here is what I have found vs my previous setup". In other words, no one on these boards doing it, is doing it correctly.
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Old 06-13-2010, 06:50 AM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by avb3 View Post
how NOT to install your rear oem style coilovers!

Sadly, this is how a performance shop installed mine....
can you eloborate what is wrong in this pic?
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Old 06-13-2010, 07:44 AM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by bimmertech View Post

that being said, the largest downside imo to putting the spring on the damper is the spindle. i'm not totally against the idea in general(i have relocated springs on other cars i have owned with good success) but after looking at the spindle closely you can see that the material that will be now supporting the entire weight of the vehicle is very small and was not designed to withstand the extra load. being a poor guy who buys parts when he can, the cost of having someone design a rear spindle is just too much.
I see what your saying and I have read that thread before where one member did his own analysis on the spindle, but I have yet to see anyone till this day have a failed rear spindle due to running rear true coil overs.......

"maybe" full out race teams have reinforced spindles like mentioned in that thread (still not shown/verified), but given the OP's uses, mine and even now ROM350z question above on post 129 who's to say with his uses he will have failed spindle issues............I cant see it...

I daily my car, track my car at AutoX events and Drift events...I have spun out, drifted 3rd and 4th gear high speed entries and till this day have seen a crack out of a rear spindle..who knows maybe my time is coming, but its been years and if that happens....hell, i just buy another spindle, repair whats broken....etc....

Now, if i was preping a full out race 350z then sure I would look to reinforce and do the things mentioned in that thread........

Great info.....keep the convo going...anyone else have insight to share??

-J
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Old 06-13-2010, 08:42 AM
  #132  
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Great help from Jason and bimmertech so far. thanks guys! im still tuned in! I think im leaning towards a true setup. Like Jason said, I doubt ill have a problem with the spindle with my kind of driving. I'll be autoxing this car once every 2-3 months...my only last concern with the true setup is: will my 10.5" rear wheel with a 285/35 ever make contact with the rear true coilover?
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Old 06-13-2010, 08:55 AM
  #133  
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i guess then it's just a philosophical difference.

i prefer to be proactive vs being retroactive. the price of a midlink would be far cheaper than replacing all the other damaged parts if a spindle were to fail.

that spindle is not going to fail while driving down the road. it's going to fail at the worst possible time, and when it does it's not going to be a cheap repair if you can repair the car/yourself at all. if i were you, i would replace that spindle every other year and have it sonic checked the year it is not replaced.

i mean really, what are you gaining by putting the spring on the shock? losing 2.1lbs of unsprung weight? a 6" swift spring and midlink is not exactly heavy.

i'm a gambling man, but some gambles just don't pay off enough to make in the first place.
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Old 06-13-2010, 08:55 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by ROM350Z View Post
Great help from Jason and bimmertech so far. thanks guys! im still tuned in! I think im leaning towards a true setup. Like Jason said, I doubt ill have a problem with the spindle with my kind of driving. I'll be autoxing this car once every 2-3 months...my only last concern with the true setup is: will my 10.5" rear wheel with a 285/35 ever make contact with the rear true coilover?
Highly unlikely unless you have some rediculous offset wheel.......if they dont hit your oem shock now, doubt it will hit any true coil overs you purchase...

usually the true coil over body is a slightly bigger diameter but nothing rediculous......and the coil spring is hight up top, so its out of the way..

if you have the wheels mounted on the car now get down under there and get your eyes on the clearances.........i doubt it..

-J
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Old 06-13-2010, 09:02 AM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by bimmertech View Post
i guess then it's just a philosophical difference.

i prefer to be proactive vs being retroactive. the price of a midlink would be far cheaper than replacing all the other damaged parts if a spindle were to fail.

that spindle is not going to fail while driving down the road. it's going to fail at the worst possible time, and when it does it's not going to be a cheap repair if you can repair the car/yourself at all. if i were you, i would replace that spindle every other year and have it sonic checked the year it is not replaced.

i mean really, what are you gaining by putting the spring on the shock? losing 2.1lbs of unsprung weight? a 6" swift spring and midlink is not exactly heavy.

i'm a gambling man, but some gambles just don't pay off enough to make in the first place.
that makes it a good choice for you............I have raced/tracked with many 350z buddies, one drifts with a TT350z on true coil overs and would really seriously beat on the car..........

I have yet to see 'one' rear spindle break........so for me its not about being retroactive.........It's more so that "I have seen" real life testing and it holds up quite well......

I have even seen a N/A 350z with true coilovers drifting......mid drift blow a tire loose control and end up with a camber arm bent, wheel completely destroyed, etc...........spindle wasn't the weak link....analysis of the spindle alone may show that component or the arm where the coilover attaches to, to be weak, but the suspension as a whole its not...

I will say this though..........i dont knock your choice.......not one bit....good suspension parts are good parts.......its what you choose for your ride....


-J

Last edited by JasonZ-YA; 06-13-2010 at 09:41 AM.
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Old 06-13-2010, 01:18 PM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by bimmertech View Post
can you eloborate what is wrong in this pic?
edited, sorry!
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Old 06-13-2010, 04:36 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by avb3 View Post
edited, sorry!
no worries, different brands mount the height adjusters in different places, so it helps to clarify.
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Old 06-15-2010, 04:25 AM
  #138  
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hello peopleZ

i've ordered new wheels today

Work Euroline XS2 (in switzerland still in programm)

19x9 +10 235/35
19x10 +10 255/35

now i have to lower my car...
i dont know which coils let lower my car at most?
i thought i go with BC-Coils...but are there other coils where i can go lower?
the price should be around 1000 and 1500

how low can i go with my wheel/tire size?

thx for your feedback!

Luca

Last edited by donleguano; 06-15-2010 at 04:27 AM.
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Old 06-15-2010, 04:40 AM
  #139  
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I have installed BC before and when i did for one guy the car was pretty low.........and there was more room to adjust.......so i would think you would be fine....

OEM style suspension is gonna lend to lowering really low much more so over true coil over style....

anyone else with "slammed" cars that can chime in on what coilovers they are running....
-J
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Old 06-15-2010, 05:25 AM
  #140  
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I love my BC coilovers. Had them installed for almost 2 years without any issues. As far as lowering the car, you can pretty much slam the front through the fenders if you wanted to. In the rear you can lower it about 1.5". I believe you can buy a shorter spring from BC so you can go lower. I still have about another quarter inch to go in the rear and I'm happy with the ride height. No need for the shorter spring.

A few reviews at...
https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...on-review.html

https://my350z.com/forum/brakes-and-...rs-review.html
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