jng1226

This came up in another thread and I wanted to start a new topic on it.

Usually when people talk about aftermarket exhausts, one selling point they mention is how much lighter it is than stock. Ok, so Borla is somthing around 11-pounds less than stock, which is a saving a of (wait for it) 0.3%! (11 lbs / 3250 lbs curb weight).

Some people say that every bit helps, and specifically that 100lbs equals about .1 a second in the 1/4 mile. So where else have you taken weight out of your street-driven Z? Most people I see are adding way more in stereo equipment, aftermarket bodywork and larger wheels.

I understand reciprocating mass such as crank pulleys and flywheels, and [B]unsprung rotating weight[B] of lighter wheels is going to make significant differences in performance, but do you really think 11 lbs (again 0.3%) is going to make a difference?

Just my ****-retentive rant because so many people are hung up on weight here and there. Our car is no S2000...

DruDragzOn

I took out my spare tire and that heavy mat at the back. That's the only weight reduction I've done.

mcclaskz

Not much you can do to make it matter. I upgraded wheels and tires and dropped 45lbs. I believe the 350Z race cars running in Grand Am Cup still weigh ~2900.

John

iTrader: (17)

I'm actually probably a few pounds over stock with solid sway bars and a roll bar. Take out the spare with tools, and that's about 40lbs. I saved about 20lbs with test pipes, and I'll be doing a lightweight battery soon and scraping away some of the sound deadening material in the back.

jng1226

oops - mistake post.

Thanks for replies guys, so far this confirms what I was thinking. That's a great point about the Grand Am race 350Z, I also read about that it had a target weight of 2800 pounds but actually came in at around 2900 pounds after suspension upgrades, roll cage, etc.

Ricky

Dry Carbon Fiber hood, Remove Spare, run on 1/4 tank gas, titanium coilovers, carbon fiber hatch, carbon fiber doors.. with all that, over 10,000, you'd save around 125-150lbs - my guess..

Not really worth it IMO.

tremayne

The maths;

StockZ weight @ 3250lb (for example)
StockZ power @ 287hp (again for the example)
Pop power increase @ 5hp
Spare Wheel/jack @ 40lb


Stock Z power/weight = 0.088 hp/lb
Z with Pop = 0.089 hp/lb
Stock Z without spare/jack = 0.089 hp/lb


Conclusion? If you can feel the difference by fitting a popcharger, you should be able to feel the difference by junking the spare and jack.

boyze

There have been some other threads on this topic with some interesting numbers. Getting 200-300 lbs wouldn't be all that difficult or expensive: Some approximate #

- spare wheel - 60#
- "true" CF hood - 20#
- wheels - 50# - (most folks "upgrade" to larger diameter, but smaller wheels is where the weight savings are at)
- full Ti exhaust - 35#
- remove front Al bumper - some intercooler folks are already doing this - 20#, of course, this is risky.
- ......

200# from 3250 = 6.2% higher acceleration. For 0-60 thats close to .3 sec improvement assuming a great launch and flawless 1st shift. For the 1/4 it wouldn't translate directly to 6.2% because of aero drag but you'd probably see over .5 sec improvement.

have fun

was wesman

iTrader: (7)

Wow...I've been thinking of adding some, my Z rattles like a 89' camaro sometimes.

--wes

was wesman

iTrader: (7)

Have you actually weighed any of this stuff?

My spare wheel was closer to 40#

aftermarket wheels, while smaller should = lighter, that's not always the case. It depends on if it's forged, 1-2-3 piece, materials etc. I know of quite a few 18" wheels that are lighter that the stock 17's

Bet you that you don't find 20# of weight savings with any hood without stripping metal off of it. The stock hood is pretty light.

Stock exhaust is 70#, to put on a Ti exhaust (which I sincerely doubt will save you half of the weight) would force you to go with the same design as stock (ie. no dual) and would most likely make you lose HP.....in other words, a lot of wasted money for no gains at all, but hey, you lost 20#

Is the front bumper really 20# ? Seems a bit heavy to me, especially if it really is Al.

--wes

rouxeny

I lost 30 lbs on the Atkins diet.

was wesman

iTrader: (7)

lol...there you go


People always crack me up with the weight savings talk and then throw 2 12's in the back and stop at burger king for an extra value meal on the way home.

--wes

hugo1669

This thread has inspired me to go on a diet. No more french fries for me.

ares

iTrader: (2)

also there is the battery, you can save like 20lbs with a light weight battery(bonus points if you relocate it to the rear to help with weight distrobution)

beyond that, you could drop 100lbs easy if you strip the interior, take out all the plastic, mats, hell if your going to the track screw the passenger seat. even more if you take out the power windows(bonus points if you take out the windows too and replace it with mesh.

obviously Im heading straight into race car not street car territory and then may as well tear out the AC, air bags, and whatever else you can find.

I dont see why you couldnt lose plenty of weight, just depends how far your willing to go.

was wesman

iTrader: (7)

Very confusing reply...

On the hood.....ain't no damn way in hell you're going to get a hood anywhere even in the ballpark of 20 ounces....you do realize that is less than 2 lbs right ? The shear size of the hood makes it impossible to get it near that light. The stock hood is Alum, it's possible to get it lighter, but not much.

I guess I got ripped, I don't have a full size spare, don't see why a different model would have one ??? Mine's a 16 I do believe.

I know there are plenty of rims out there that are lighter, especially the forged.

On the exhaust, pretty much every exhaust that has come out for the Z that wasn't a dual has lost HP. Sure you cna save weight, but what good does it do if it doesn't perform as well as the stock one ?

There are tons and tons of things you can take off, but like you said, why buy the Z in the first place if you're taking everythign out of it ? May as well buy a miata.

--wes

350Z 2+2 ???

If you want to see the advantage of removing weight from your car, just check out how the G35 compares to a Z. The weight difference is about 250lbs. It seems like the G's are running about 3/10ths slower than a Z in stock form.

BTW, the standard formula for calculating 1/4mile times has the following format. (keep in mind that there are way more variables than this formula has, so it's just an estimate).

1/4mi E.T. = C*(weight/hp)^(1/3)

where the constant C is usually in the low 6's somewhere (6.1-6.2).

If you expect a stock Z (3250lbs, 287hp) to run a 13.9, then the value for C is 6.19.

So, with a Z that you'd removed 200lbs of fixed mass, you'd have...

E.T. = 6.19*(3050/287)^(1/3) = 13.61

I would like to iterate again that this is all speculation and is just a general guideline to go by.

One more, less accurate formula deals with trap speeds. If your level of traction remains constant, the product of your ET and trap speed will also remain (relatively) constant.

If you assume that a 350Z, while running a 13.9 in stock form, will trap at 101mph, then...

ET x Trap = 13.9 x 101 = 1404

If you reduce the weight by 200lbs and run the 13.61 calculated above, your trap would be around...

Trap = 1404/13.61 = 103.2mph

Many people may find fault with this last formula, because more often than not, the reason our 1/4mile times are changing is because our 60' times (ie launches) are changing. To see why traction affects this last formula, you can compare two runs (one with good traction, the other with sorry traction). We've all seen something like this before:

Run #1 - good launch:
60ft = 2.050
ET = 13.61
MPH = 103.2

Run #2 - crappy launch:
60ft = 2.200 (spun tires for instance)
ET = 13.86 (much slower)
MPH = 103.2 (about the same)

In this case, the product of the ET and trap does not remain constant. This is why I stated before that this last formula assumes that the level of traction has not changed. Another example showing how traction affects this product is cars running slicks. I've seen cars running low 13's and not even trapping 100mph. That product is in the low 1300's, not 1400's like our stock (street tire) Z's.

Anyhow, this was WAAAAAAAY longer than I expected it to be. Feel free to play around with the formulas to get some rough guidelines, but ultimately, you'll have to confirm them at the track!

ares

iTrader: (2)

not all single outlet pipes lost hp. dynos are horribly inaccurate when measuring things that are within 5hp of one another. people doing 3 runs on the same setup get variations of 8 or more hp. not to say some single pipe setups dont lose. but I beleive the titanium models are atleast breaking even.

Im sorry, I thought we did have a full size spare, I had a brain fart, its that we can FIT the full size flat tire. 40 might be a bit more accurate then.

regaurdless, randomly adding choosing a modification that can gain 10lbs or lose 10lbs is a 20lb variation, and while alone it might not be drastic, but it is there, and shouldnt be ignored.

350Z 2+2 ???

This is a very good statement. If you consider that we're in the 10lb/hp range, a 20lb weight difference is equivalent to about 2hp.

I don't have the exact numbers here but in Sport Z's shootout, the Stillen made more HP than the Borla, but it also weighed more. Once you factor in the weight difference, they may be more even.

This is also the main benefit with Titanium exhausts, especially since exhausts on our Z's & G's aren't making a lot of power. You could get a mediocre performing Ti exhaust making 4hp and be equivalent to a Stillen exhaust, weighing more than stock, that makes 8-9hp.

GY-Z

for ppl who is keeping their car N/A(like me), weight saving is a really big issue.
i'll have to use every thing that is lightest on the market(flywheel, pully, battery, Ti exhaust+Ti y-pipe+ test pipe, and CFRP made racing seat, lightweight 18" rims, racing sterring wheel , and take off those spare stuff in ur car ),this should get off a good 100 kg! and still keep the car streetable!

S12 driver

Didn't someone swapped a SR20DET in their Z, and it weighs only 2700lbs? If you're serious about weight reduction, that may be a good choice.