Gman2004

iTrader: (8)

[QUOTE=AdamDC]when I am on the highway doing 65 in 6th gear and I want to pass, I don't need to shift gears.[/QOUTE]

Let me give my opion.....Spending $5000 so you don't have to down shift when you want to pass is pretty rediculous. I got the Vortech because it is putting out pretty high number and reliable. Also, if I am not racing anyone and just going around town, the low end means nothing. What? When you are getting on the on ramp, you want to get up to 60 quicker so you can idle down and maintain????? Makes no sense to me. I only use the power when I am flogging the sheits out of the car. Other wise it feels like stock for normal driving. Not trying to flame you just my $.02.

Gman2004

iTrader: (8)

Drilling the oil pan is not a big deal. If you take the vortech off you just plug it.

xxlbeerZ

iTrader: (8)

Enthuziast, you seem to want exactly what I do... more power w/ as little chance of blowing the motor as possible and without spending too much $$$. I narrowed it to two choices.

Vortech SC
APS Single Turbo

These two kits are the most complete, safest, and cost effective IMO. I know the Stillen is safer, but it doesn't add enough power for the money so I don't even consider it.

With the Vortech you only need to add for maybe an oil spacer, a $30 belt, guages, and install/tuning. Total cost $6000

The APS isn't out, but you'll probably need a turbo timer, boost controller, guages and that's it. They seem to include most everything needed with their kit. Total cost $7000

I'm leaning towards the APS because turbo is so much better than SC, and they include a fuel return system & plug and play ecu solution for only a little more money than the Vortech.


Honorable mention:
Turbonetics (too many drawbacks though)
HKS

Avoid like the plague:
Greddy TT
ATI Procharger

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

Stillen (Stg. 1+2 are, not 3) and HKS(pending) and Vortech(awaiting a test car for about 2 years now) are all looking to be CARB EO exemptor in Stillen's case are ....

Smog ... well that is all in the tune.

ATI is way too loud to be honest ... I am a mustang guy .. I like blowers, but on this car ... the ever present "Hoovering" is not what I like.

Gas mileage will decrease to probably 20mpg when out of the throttle ... and 0 when you're on it jk ... its a decrease, but nothing major

If you install it right, tune it right and don't mess with anything after that, I don't think you really have any chance of blowing the motor, pending you don't do anything crazy like over-rev it or forget to change the oil for 100000000 miles or something.

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

how does Vortech compare to ATI as far as gains ?
I have noticed the loud Jet sound of the ATI too. I'd like to hear the Vortech. How does it sound ?

Hoping there will be a Vortech at the next meet.

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

The Vortech will have 95% of the power gains at ATI.

Where the ATI sounds like a ShopVac under your hood at Idle ... the Vortech sounds like a DustBuster in the other room. As the revs increase, Vortech gets louder ... but around town it is quiet enough (pending you get the bypass valve setup nicely, otherwise it can be a huge pain)

AdamDC

GMan, for someone who is not trying to flame, you are a very angry person. You have the vortech, great, I am very happy for you. I have the stillen, wonderful, I'm happy for me.

This is an individual choice, the fact that I don't have to shift does not indicate me to be lazy or a crappy driver, you need to read into things, the fact that I don't have to downshift means I have a lot of torque.

And yes, one of the things I love is blasting down the onramp. I am not being sarcastic, I love acceleration.

Numbers mean nothing, it's all about how you use it. I am glad that you like your car and chose to spend your money that way. I chose to spend mine differently.


From a much earlier post:
Here is some quick calculations of torque (Stillen vs. Pro and Stillen vs. Vortec):

RPM...ProCharger...Vortec
6500... 17... 8
6000... 16... 7
5500... 2... -9
5000... -4.. .-21
4500... -12... -15
4000... -20... -23
3500... -29... -30
3000... -37... -41
2500... -46... -48
2000... -48... -48

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

it may have been stated already but what is included with the Vortech kit and what else is needed?

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

Vortech includes
SC
FMIC
Piggyback ECU
-- all necessary things to connect, run and tune the system.

Good add-ons include a set of gauges and the gates belt upgrade

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

Thanks. Was not sure if an FMIC was included. I hope its as good as the ATI FMIC.
I am very interested in the Vortech kit. I am assuming it can be installed pretty quickly too.

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

The Vortech IC is good, but not great. It is sized correctly for our cars and it potential output (max of the Vortech is about 475-500whp). The ATI is larger and can be used for higher boost while providing adequate cooling.

If you plan on sticking with a non-built motor, none of this will ever matter to you

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

Thanks for the help. Non-built today but tomorrow ?
Actually, I'm still very much undecided as to what to do to this car at this point. The SC seems like a quick way to bolt on some power and might be the answer for me.

Gman2004

iTrader: (8)

AdamDC,

If I came across angry those were not my intentions. The point I was trying to make is when I race, I don't do it in a low RPMS. I go WOT where I make my power.

Yes I have a vortech, but after only 3 weeks of it being on my car I am selling it and going TT.....Enthuziast asked which kit would produce the most hp and be reliable, so I am just giving my opion so he does not end up in the same situation as me because he craves more power after the install. It will cost him money if he does not make the right choice the first time. I am losing about $2500 between resale price of the kit and the install/tune costs.

We all know that Stillen does not put out the highest number, although reliable, but how many blown vortechs are there? It is safe to say that vortech is very safe as well.

Enjoy your car!

weslutes

iTrader: (7)

What boost were those # for?
APS single turbo is a good affordable kit but a little more $$ and you can get the TT.
Hey, I get a cool 17.5 mpg most of the time(except when I use the n2o)

EnthuZiast

iTrader: (4)

The reason ATI is out of the question for me is because I feel it is not as safe as the Stillen and Vortec setups.

I honestly feel like my stock Z has very good power and I am just about positive 80WHP across the rev range will cure my need for some more power.

So if it came down to SAFETY ONLY...would you guys put your money on Stillen Stage II or a Vortec?

AdamDC

Gman,

OK, sorry I misread your tone and I agree with you. If I was going to be racing I would want something that ran more power in the higher RPM's, the TT setups are great and if I wanted to spend more money I would be debating between the Greddy with add ons and the APS.

The Vortech is a safe application. When I ordered my Stillen they were back ordered on the pulleys and not being patient I was ready to go with the Vortech. That is where the guys at the install shop were great, they knew me and they knew what I wanted. They calmed me down and told me I would not be as happy with the Vortech with my style of driving. I also plan on going to a custom 8-9 pound pulley eventually.

Enthuziast, both kits are safe and both will get you plenty of power at stock boost for a pretty cheap price. How do you drive? Are you looking to enhance the nature of the car or do you run hard at high RPM's? Are you happier with the engine performance of a corvette or a race bike?

As for big power, I will be looking for a 65-67 corvette in about 2 years that will probably get a 454 fast burn fuel injected crate motor with a richmond 6 speed transmission and side pipes. There is no replacement for displacement. I've been waiting on something like this since I was 12.

EnthuZiast

iTrader: (4)

I would say more of an EXOTIC Vette
I would hope that my FI Z would be faster than a stock C5?

As far as what Im looking for. Something that will give me morer power:
Enough to take (in stock form):
E46 M3
C5
GTO
etc....

But more importantly something safe that can last for 60K of driving.
I like the idea of having power throughout teh rev range (Stillen) but I dont think I would mind the way power is delivered w/Vortec.

I wish there was a Z member who would take me out for a drive around here!
Can the Stillen use a BOV?

AdamDC

Stillen has no BOV, it is a vacuum return line. Thus when not hitting the gas you get pretty much the same gas mileage. However, I don't do that often.

EnthuZiast

iTrader: (4)

Adam-

How many miles do you get to the Gallon/Tank?
What Stage are you?
Doe syour milieage computer still function.

Stillen is starting to look like a very solid daily driver option for me.

2003z

iTrader: (7)

I get 19-21 in town and 27 on the highway.

My .02.
I'm probably the only member on here who has personally installed both a Vortech and a Stillen kit. Both are good kits, but the Stillen has better instructions and seems to be better engineered imho. Stillen requires no cutting or drilling of anything, and has much simpler wiring. The Stillen is wired in directly at the cam and crank sensors, so the autosport wiring harness is not needed. With the Vortech, that harness is almost essential, considering the cost and benefits of it.

The Stillen doesn't take well to mods, other than exhaust. With test pipes, I lost 20 hp and ran a little lean. There is a long explanation I got from Stillen's R&D, but we'll just say it doesn't like mods and is also untunable, that can be an advantage or disadvantage. The Vortech makes more power out of the box and is tunable. I run the 1/4 in 12.8 with my stillen, which is good enough for me.

Some people with Vortechs have belt slippage problems, some people with stillen have belt alignment issues. I think it was mentioned that a different belt cures the Vortech problem, but the one I installed on my friends car seems to need constant tightening. I never had alignment issues until after having engine replaced for oil consumption (was burning pre-supercharger, so the stillen didnt cause it). My alignment issue was due to dealership stripping threads in the intake manifold and redrilling, slightly off. A new manifold solved that problem.

Drivablity/Noise. The stillen is MUCH quieter under daily operation. It is silent until you are on the boost, than has a light jet engine type whine. The vortech seems to be loud all the time and real loud under boost, but that is just my opinion, and I'm 39 y.o. now. I may have preferred the vortech sounds 10 years ago or so.

Hood, Stillen has a new hood coming out that I have seen a picture of somewhere recently, but personally, I like the original version better.

Either way you would be happy, but you should try to get a ride in both first.