Are You For Or Against Boost?
12-08-2005 | 04:37 AM
#81
SBTrack,
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post
. I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO. 
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post
. I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO.
Last edited by WA2GOOD; 12-08-2005 at 04:49 AM.
12-08-2005 | 06:11 AM
#82
I dont know why people are falling head over heels over the S54 engine. I personally think the Honda S2000 with 2.0L or even the 2.2L has more performance engineering factor than the US M3 3.2 I6. If you are talking about performance engines, Porsche GT3RS and Ferrari 360CS have great performance numbers.
12-08-2005 | 06:16 AM
#83
Originally Posted by SB Track
Love for the haters. I love how there's always a few haters out there to keep things real.
I AGREE. So I thought with the first few posts after my long, thought out post would be a constistent flaming of me, but I'm glad I found a few of you out there who have grown passed the "Fast and Furious stage" of your lives. I don't consider myself too mature at this point in my life, at 18 and a freshmen at UCLA. But that is my opinion on cars.
I'd rather have an M3 than a F/I Z. And I'd rather have a 997 than a S/C M3. The tuning from the factory is the true engineering factor. You aren't thinking what the engineers were thinking as you are "bolting on" your aftermarket turbos.
True, both do require engineering. But I can say both boost is trendy and the easy way out. If you know anything about trends in fashion and couture, you'd understand that the trends don't necessarily mean new things. For example, vintage styling clothing is VERY trendy right now. Is it new? No. Is it trendy? Yes.
Forced induction is just a trendy thing to do. Everyone oogles at boost. I don't hear many aspirations about "building my VQ to put out 300whp all-motor". Why? It's f*cken HARD. It's just not built for it. That being said, I would never ever add a TT to my car.
I personally think the VQ is a good motor for what is was built for--Nissan's ENTIRE line-up. You won't find the S54 spread around like a *****. It was a normal V6 engine that re-designed (pretty nicely I might add) for performance.
The S54 is definitely on a different level, however I make the comparison to make an example of different levels of performance. I have to disagree with you on comparing the S54 with the Rtune Z in the link. The M3 still appeals to more than the high-performance crowd. So I think a fairer comparison would be to the Nismo S-Tune. (I think it runs at the same price too .. around $60k) It makes a strong 300hp, but it is still weak compared to the M3. I think the new Rtune is more comparable to the M3 CSL (which is not sold here). That Euro version of the M3 is very race oriented (I believed its like carbon fiber roof and interior, no power seats). It puts out like 361bhp or something IIRC and will have no problem outperforming the new Z. If you look back a few years in Car magazine (the British one) there is an article where they compare a 996 Carrera to the M3 CSL. I think that's a more fair comparison. Also, on the costing more than twice as much... My Z's MSRP was $37,600... The M3 (loaded) I wanted was $56,800... The difference in price is justified I believe... Why? Engine, build quality, interior quality, ride quality, performance, overall package.
Oh, and on terms of the realiability of the engine. BMW eventually replaced the failing rods on all the early S54 engines. Nissan... has still not offered a true solution to the problem of tire feathering. I don't think new tires and new alignment specs were the solution, but that's just me.
I AGREE. So I thought with the first few posts after my long, thought out post would be a constistent flaming of me, but I'm glad I found a few of you out there who have grown passed the "Fast and Furious stage" of your lives. I don't consider myself too mature at this point in my life, at 18 and a freshmen at UCLA. But that is my opinion on cars.
I'd rather have an M3 than a F/I Z. And I'd rather have a 997 than a S/C M3. The tuning from the factory is the true engineering factor. You aren't thinking what the engineers were thinking as you are "bolting on" your aftermarket turbos.
True, both do require engineering. But I can say both boost is trendy and the easy way out. If you know anything about trends in fashion and couture, you'd understand that the trends don't necessarily mean new things. For example, vintage styling clothing is VERY trendy right now. Is it new? No. Is it trendy? Yes.
Forced induction is just a trendy thing to do. Everyone oogles at boost. I don't hear many aspirations about "building my VQ to put out 300whp all-motor". Why? It's f*cken HARD. It's just not built for it. That being said, I would never ever add a TT to my car.
I personally think the VQ is a good motor for what is was built for--Nissan's ENTIRE line-up. You won't find the S54 spread around like a *****. It was a normal V6 engine that re-designed (pretty nicely I might add) for performance.
The S54 is definitely on a different level, however I make the comparison to make an example of different levels of performance. I have to disagree with you on comparing the S54 with the Rtune Z in the link. The M3 still appeals to more than the high-performance crowd. So I think a fairer comparison would be to the Nismo S-Tune. (I think it runs at the same price too .. around $60k) It makes a strong 300hp, but it is still weak compared to the M3. I think the new Rtune is more comparable to the M3 CSL (which is not sold here). That Euro version of the M3 is very race oriented (I believed its like carbon fiber roof and interior, no power seats). It puts out like 361bhp or something IIRC and will have no problem outperforming the new Z. If you look back a few years in Car magazine (the British one) there is an article where they compare a 996 Carrera to the M3 CSL. I think that's a more fair comparison. Also, on the costing more than twice as much... My Z's MSRP was $37,600... The M3 (loaded) I wanted was $56,800... The difference in price is justified I believe... Why? Engine, build quality, interior quality, ride quality, performance, overall package.
Oh, and on terms of the realiability of the engine. BMW eventually replaced the failing rods on all the early S54 engines. Nissan... has still not offered a true solution to the problem of tire feathering. I don't think new tires and new alignment specs were the solution, but that's just me.
Last edited by nissansource; 12-08-2005 at 06:18 AM.
12-08-2005 | 09:58 AM
#85
Originally Posted by WA2GOOD
SBTrack,
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post . I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO.
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post
. I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO.
12-08-2005 | 08:34 PM
#86
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 520
Likes: 0
From: UCLA
Originally Posted by WA2GOOD
SBTrack,
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post . I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO.
I like, and agree with what you said in your last post
. I have owned an 2003 E46 M3 SMG (sold). I went through the whole connecting rod recall thing and I was impressed. I was impressed with the service and quality of engineering that went into the M3 as a whole. IMO, I feel that the comparison of a Z to an M3 isn't as close as comparing the creature comforts and all around amenities of a G35 coupe to a M3, the perfect comparison I feel, (dollar-for-dollar) is a F I'ed G coupe with slight suspension mods and a M3 (about equal in price). Coming from someone who has owned both a FI'ed G35 coupe and the M3 at the same time, although I loved my M3, I would rather have (again, dollar-for-dollar) a F I'ed G coupe. The M3 is an awesome car, I just know the potiential in a G (or Z)....JMO. We've actually had both an 04 6MT Gcoupe and my current Z at the same time. While I admit the G was slightly nicer than the Z, I think it was nothing compared to the M3. The interior was just as cheap, the leather wrinkled easily, and the plastic pieces seemed to have more gaps and flaws. It was definitely pseudo-luxury, compared to the M3. However, this is not why I dislike the G. The reason I did not like it was the incredible "bloated" feeling you get while driving it. That car was HUGE. It definitely does not look big because of the curves, but it definitely felt big. I wish Nissan didn't take the same platform of the sedan and make it into a coupe version. That's the main reason I switched to the Z.
Off topic, but back to the dollar for dollar thing. Wouldn't buying an STi or EVO be a better buy than the Z than? For the performance inclined. I wouldn't touch either of those cars because I think they're hideous.
12-08-2005 | 08:42 PM
#87
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 520
Likes: 0
From: UCLA
Originally Posted by spcemn_spiff
I dont know why people are falling head over heels over the S54 engine. I personally think the Honda S2000 with 2.0L or even the 2.2L has more performance engineering factor than the US M3 3.2 I6. If you are talking about performance engines, Porsche GT3RS and Ferrari 360CS have great performance numbers.
1) Rag top only.
2) I can't stand getting on the gas to move, one of the reasons I love my VQ.
3) The dashboard is HIDEOUS, and so is the overall layout of the interior.
4) Brembo brakes on my Track model.
When I test drove an S2000, I felt like I was driving a Civic at under 3-4k RPM. (This was even the newer 2.2L ones.) Why do I consider the S54 better than the S2000 engine? It has the torque, and the high end power. (Although admittedly less torque than the VQ.) Finally, the S2000 even with its lower weight factor barely holds down Z's. The M3 weighs at least 200 lbs more, but easily holds down stock Z's. Can't forget to mention the individual throttle bodies on the S54.
However, I think that best thing about the S2000 is the weight. I personally think our Z's are pigs, especially the newer ones which are weighing outrageous amounts. For the size, I think the Z's should weigh 3000-3100 lbs. I believe the Porsche 997's are weighing in at 3200, yet they offer much more than the Z.
12-08-2005 | 08:46 PM
#88
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
From: San Jose
Originally Posted by spcemn_spiff
I dont know why people are falling head over heels over the S54 engine. I personally think the Honda S2000 with 2.0L or even the 2.2L has more performance engineering factor than the US M3 3.2 I6. If you are talking about performance engines, Porsche GT3RS and Ferrari 360CS have great performance numbers.
12-12-2005 | 02:03 AM
#91
New Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 5,084
Likes: 0
From: Toledo
Originally Posted by SB Track
I'd rather have an M3 than a F/I Z. And I'd rather have a 997 than a S/C M3. The tuning from the factory is the true engineering factor. You aren't thinking what the engineers were thinking as you are "bolting on" your aftermarket turbos.
12-13-2005 | 11:44 AM
#92
Originally Posted by Johnny225
Have you ever driven an S54 M3? The engine screams. Much more so than my 996 4S. That engine is a purebred racing engine. Even the Porsche engines aren't as exotic as that engine.
Originally Posted by shiva
Cars are means to ends - accelerating quickly, showing off, etc. They aren't monuments to your skewed definition of good engineering. People who boosted their VQs don't drive around with hard ons about how much HP/liter they are producing. They're too busy taming 500 vicious horsepower.
You can always produce more power, for all it matters put a jet engine to acclerate quicker. There is always someone who has more HP. Some people are bent on making the Z a dragster which it was not designed to be.
For me higher HP/liter tickles my brain and is a higher sense of pleasure, the engineering achievement triumphs for me, may be not for you, may be brute power is all that is important.
If it were for that attitude, people wouldnt be using Pentium 4 or dual core or 64 bit computing but a cluster of 8086 processors to get things done (I dont know if that is analogous or practical). If it werent for engineering, you would even produce the 500Hp that you get with FI. So any engineering feat is important to me, may be its not everyone's cup of tea.
Last edited by spacemn_spiff; 12-13-2005 at 11:56 AM.
12-13-2005 | 10:23 PM
#94
New Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 5,084
Likes: 0
From: Toledo
Originally Posted by spcemn_spiff
For me higher HP/liter tickles my brain and is a higher sense of pleasure, the engineering achievement triumphs for me, may be not for you, may be brute power is all that is important.
12-13-2005 | 10:36 PM
#95
Originally Posted by SB Track
I personally think the VQ is a good motor for what is was built for--Nissan's ENTIRE line-up. You won't find the S54 spread around like a *****. It was a normal V6 engine that re-designed (pretty nicely I might add) for performance.
The VQ came to life as a purpose built racing motor for a European racing series that never took off. Nissan had a fantastic motor and nothing to do with it. So they started putting it in passenger cars. The pure fact of the matter is that Nissan realized that the VQ was one of the best motors that they had ever built and they could make a buttload of money by putting different interations of it in different Nissan models. And since many people forget that car companies are around to MAKE MONEY...this is why we have minivans with VQs...
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Colombo
Forced Induction
35
11-09-2020 10:27 AM
bcoffee20
Zs & Gs For Sale
5
11-19-2015 06:39 PM
