jran76

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the reply Cheston, I knew you were out there somewhere. As I stated, there will be issues, but a blown motor is not always the end result. But, as both you and I have stated, it is very possible for it to go if things do not go right. Where is MardiGras when you need him.

Anyway, the point being that it can be done (FI that is), but do it right.... By the way, I plan to go FI, but I will wait at least until the end of the year. I do not mind doing some things first, but I will pass on FI.

After driving a Maxima for 3 years it is great that we have so many choices. The Maxima only had one choice for the longest (Stillen, and you can see most of Cheston's probs, along with most Max owners, have been with Stillen, and there lack of engineering).

ijnyu

my .02 cents on ati....

I know this is a different vehicle but might have some useful info. I recently got a procharger on my truck, so far no problems. Mine came with the aeromotive dfmu(that i think is in the 350z kit also) and an inline walbro fuel pump.
For my application, the fuel pressure increases when in boost, ~3000rpm. IMO, you can move the sliders all you want on the dfmu but if you want to avoid problems, you're gonna have to have it wideband dynoed to really tune it. Even the rep at aeromotive told me that. Although I'm not too happy slamming my injectors with that much fuel pressure, I haven't had any problems so far. Not sure what the 350z injectors are flow rated at.

My experience with ATI support has been so so. If you do not even have a serial number for your kit when calling for support, I wouldn't bother calling in.
I was emailing back and forth with one tech there, he was pretty helpful.
But I guess I asked too many questions cuz he stopped responding.

jesseenglish

The FMU thing makes more sense given the description they've given us. I didn't think of that, I'd be curious as to how the Z injectors will stand up to the additional pressure.

Also, anyone know how the Z computers measure MPG and would having a different fuel pump affect it's operation?

jran76

iTrader: (1)

Stock injectors are 300cc/min, good for about 350 crank HP, maybe 300 RWHP. You will see a slew of injectors coming out. The Greedy kit should include new injectors, PE has 2 sizes out, I am sure Nismo will have something, RC can most likely do just about any size, etc. To the best of my knowledge the Z uses the amount of gas removed from the tank (not using the fuel pump)/miles traveled....

I am sure that you will not see a kit with a 7th injector, some will have larger injectors and more robust (or addtional) fuel pumps. The key is still tuning (engine management), in getting the right amount of fuel at the right time. As mentioned, Dyno tuning is the key.

publisher

P,

Tell me you didn't write this.

7 eleven

Here is the "stand alone Fuel Computer" they use.
Basiclly it's a FMU that uses a second fuel pump to raise the fuel pressure under boost. Pretty slick way to get around the returnless fuel systems without having to go all out with a Real stand alone ECU. Should work good for a mild setup like this.

Here is the link: http://216.242.145.16/products/product.phtml?p=32
Billet Digital FMU

For returnless fuel systems.

The new Aeromotive Billet Digital FMU is a fully adjustable, scalable electronic FMU designed specifically for returnless fuel systems. The Aeromotive FMU senses manifold pressure and automatically provides the fuel pressure that you dial in, maintaining proper air fuel levels at all operating conditions.

When used in conjunction with an external fuel pump, the Aeromotive Billet Digital FMU will allow a supplemental pump (sold separately) to provide the proper volume thereby increasing the system pressure.
The Digital FMU is scalable and completely adjustable to provide increased fuel pressure levels at any boost.
The unique capability of the digital FMU, unlike traditional FMUs, is the ability to provide “any” fuel curve throughout the power range.
The FMU features LEDs that are tied to a scalable rotary ****. This allows you to create a fuel pressure curve that corresponds to your boost curve.
The housing of the controller is made out of Billet 6061-T651 aircraft aluminum alloy and is finished with a bright dip red anodize.

little_rod

Well, you guys might be scaring me away from FI, lol. I don't need, want, or can afford any problems right now. I plan on staying NA for a while anyway, cause of money and such. Is staying NA a safer route than FI???? I know it depends a lot on tuning and such.

digmyz

Just a newbie to this post, but....is anyone else bothered by the fact that the Avalon Racing guy can't speak english well? For that matter, that he can't type either? Are you guys comfortable putting your babies in his hands?....ok...ok....having vented a bit, I will say this: I spoke to Paul at Avalon and he seemed like a knoledgable guy..even though he pissed me off by putting me on hold three times in a 8 minute conversation!! I wonder about a shop where the main people (owners etc) overlook things like customer service and respect....
A little sad when so many shops are trying to get our hard earned money! Just my .02


rock on

Avalon Racing

iTrader: (5)

We support and participate in 9 + forums, run our race program and have to keep the shops up and running.

We get over 300 e-mails a day and the phone never stops ringing.

Yes - our typing is off at times and yes we have to put peopl eon hold occasionally. But look behind the surface. An average conversation for us is over 10 minutes per customer. We spend as much time needed with the customer to insure they get their answers etc.

A perfect example is now until Tuesday - We are on the road to a Pro event. I do this stuff on a pocket PC at rest stops.

Hope this clears this up for you.

mcclaskz

Don't listen to that Avalon. I have appreciated several 10+ minute conversations with you and I haven't purchased anything from you yet.

zland

I have spoke with Paul at Avalon several times and all of them were long phone conversations. I used a 30 min phone card on the last call and it ran out so I know Paul allows time to speak to customers. I started the last phone call out telling him I would be out of the country for 2 months and would not buy something until I return or even wait 6 months + before buying. Everytime i talk to him, he is very helpful. Give guys like him a break, he loves Z's too and he is a nice guy.

Jeff

ColecatZ

iTrader: (1)

Please..........you really should concider doing a little research before you start knocking on site supporting vendors or anyone for that matter......you said it yourself....your a noob and this , being your first post...is so far from resembling an accurate depiction of Paul's business that if I wasn't so bothered by it...I probably would have laughed at you for being so far off the mark.

Many of the forum members were and still are active www.twinturbo.net members and have been dealing with Paul and the Avalon Crew for years. They are one of the most active vendors you will meet as far as forum participation. Do you think responding to technical questions on general stuff makes them money? No, but the effort is still made, simply out of a passion for the cars. Take into account also that they have their own driver, techs and they race what they sell.......COMPETITIVELY. It's not some wannabe "Race Shop" that is really one guy trying to fund his "Motech System Exhaust"

I've had several conversations with Paul for anything from new products, to the previous weekends racing, to where we've lived and how we got there. Rarely do I speak with Paul and it's less then 20 minutes. Yeah, they are busy and you do have to contend with that, but I would fear a shop that had no customers. Make sense? ever hear of Sport Z magazine? check out the current cover sometime. You don't get there without effort and more importantly, respect. Something they've earned from the Z community. Just take a little time to feel someone out before you start flipping the script and inadvertantly misrepresenting them. As far as would I trust my car to those guys...? pics to come

and if you mane gripe is ******* him out fer his typing abillatee, that is just gay.

digmyz

I find it a little funny how everyone focused on the length of time I spoke with Paul on the phone. I agree that a busy shoppe is a good shoppe to get in which to get a closer look. I just got through reading all 9 pages of this forum thread and the overall message I got is that there is a lot of confusion about this supercharger and the price is a little high. I personally think that if it is reliable, then I'm one of the first ones signing up! Another overall message I felt was being shared here is the fact that Avalon has some "black marks" on their past. For example: fixing a part that was under warantee and taking over 3 months to do so, being so busy (presumably with customers) that they don't return calls, etc. So I am not slamming Paul in any way here, I felt that he was the real deal, however, I want to know if they are in fact trustworthy with our babies.

I think it's fantastic that they race and have been involved with Nissan for a while. In fact, that is the only reason I'm even considering them! The facts are the facts. 350-z is a new design and FI will take some time to tweak so.......retract the claws girls, this was meant to be a friendly chat to see how other 350z owners feel about a shoppe and its service.
I thank you all for your feedback.

publisher

Paul is very generous with his time and wisdom and yes, I get put on hold several times on every phone conversation. Paul appears to be going a million miles an hour and is still able to help his clients if at all possible. ColecatZ is right, one of Paul's 350Z is on the cover of the summer issue of Sport Z Magazine and the 5 page feature article he and Terry Parkhurst wrote is phenomenal. Oh yeah, this is his second cover and nobody else has earned that spot. Earned being the key word.

Now if I can only get Paul to freebie my 350Z into an Avalon Racing 350Z if I promise a 3rd. cover. Eh, eh, eh...

Dr Bonz

iTrader: (1)

I don't think that this was referring to Avalon Racing. This was referring to the ATI Procharger. It came from a list of customer reviews and on that page there were roughly 10 reviews on the product. It was concerning ATI prochargers on OTHER cars NOT the 350Z.

See the web page with those reviews in my previous post WAAAY back in this thread.

zoasis

I've spoke with Paul numerous times as well. He seems like a class act to me.

You can't ever down a guy for puting you on hold because he has another incoming call.

How would you feel if you were the other guy calling in and Paul didn't answer your call??

If he doesn't answer the other call, thats poor customer service.

So you ask, would we trust Avalon with our babies?

I know I personally would from my experiences.(although I haven't bought anything YET ) I hope this answers your question.

Dr Bonz

iTrader: (1)

OOPS Sorry, I guess it wasn't in this thread.

Here are the Procharger Reviews:


http://www.carreview.com/Forced,Indu...x.aspx#reviews

zland

I highly recommend you read these reviews above at car review . com if you are interested in the Procharger. Some reviews are positive, some are negative. What stands out to me consistantly is:

1. Most people feel ATI has poor to no customer service and does not warranty their product as promised.

2. Prochargers seems to like to eat a lot of belts.

3. Brackets for installation are weak, seems like it has a lot to do with belt problems.

4. Almost all people complain of excessive noise/whine from SC unit.

5. Bearings seem to go out and leaking seems to be a problem as well.

I hope that ATI did a good job getting the brakets correct for the Z set up. I am still very concerned about the poor reviews of customer service.

If you have had a good experience with a procharger, pls post. Lets get both sides of the product.

Has anyone here installed a ATI procharger on your Z yet? One pic of a Z was posted with it on. Please give us a detailed review of all these isssues. We are all interested.

Jeff

digmyz

I thank everyone for their opinion. A shoppe is only as good as it's products, service, and comitment to its client base and, as I'm finding out, Avalon seems to fit the bill. Is alteredatmoshphere another shoppe that is known here? I have spoken with them today and they seem very excited about the Procharger in the 350z.

One other quick question: Does everyone tend to change the stero and the suspension as I've read or am I just seeing part of the picture?

Again, I thank you guys for your posts, I'm learning a lot and I hope to share what I find, the good/bad/ugly, with you guys as well.

TheSVTKid

I have been lurking on this site for a long while since I am debating on buying a Z here in the near future. I think the addition of this blower kit has sealed the deal for me.

Though the main reason for my post was the above quote. I have owned Many diffrent superchargers, from companys such as Vortech, Powerdyne, and ProCharger. They were all on diffferent cars, and even a boat. I can say that so far, ProCharger has been hands down my personal fav. Both in power, durabilty, and service (the little that they have needed)

1. Most people feel ATI has poor to no customer service and does not warranty their product as promised. They have backed there warranty 100% with all my kits, heck one of mine even had a 3 year warranty! I'm sure there are always those people that abuse a product and get upset when it's not covered under warranty. So then they go out and talk bad about a company (even thought they know it was there fault) Typical case of "it's easier to point a finger, then to lend a hand"

2. Prochargers seems to like to eat a lot of belts.
Well ummm due to the fact that every kit is diffrent, I don't understand how that could be a product flaw. Also I saw that the 350Z kits runs off 2 COG belts. (or so the photos seemed to show) If you are tearing up a cog belt. Then you are doing something wrong on the install. The belt issue comes down more on the install of any supercharger. Some time taken during the installation, to verify proper belt alignment will go a long way. I learned this the hard way. Any reputable shop would check that before it left their building.

3. Brackets for installation are weak, seems like it has a lot to do with belt problems.
As stated above, it doens't matter how stiff a bracket is. If it's not on correct it will be out of align and throw belts. Check out the pics, on the first page. Not many companies give you CNC billet brackets. Most are just junky cast stuff, that breaks. So I would think that these units look pretty tough.

4. Almost all people complain of excessive noise/whine from SC unit.
Why would you by a supercharger not expecting noise/whine?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

5. Bearings seem to go out and leaking seems to be a problem as well.
I Have had couple ProChargers over the years... none had this issue... so I guess I'm lucky?!?

I have 2 friends that have already put in their orders. So I hope they get on here, as soon as they are on to get you all some real world feed back. I will be doing the installs on them, so I will have pics up as soon as I can, of every aspect of the install.

EA