jadenz350

iTrader: (2)

This thread is only a continuation of the off topic comments going back and forth. The purpose of starting a new thread is to first make sure I don't get banned (i appreciate I was pushing the envelope) and to enable the discussion to continue in a more appropriate use of the forum. I don't want to get banned because I think i'm more important to this community as an active voice providing a real story with a terrible ending that others would prefer to sweep under the carpet as opposed to explain why something happened. The story is less about me trying to act like I didn't take ANY risks...but more about a me hiring a so called trusted, experienced, expert...to install a turbo kit he was one of few people authorized to do....that did something that he and I both agreed was not correct and arguably had alot to do with my motor blowing up 3 weeks later.

You can follow the story in the attached - as a start:

https://my350z.com/forum/forced-induction/354805-488-whp-vinny-ten-racing.html

Again - the objective here is to simply provide information on my experience to balance against other's extraordinary claims...not to pick a fight with a shop etc....i think we both wish it never went this way. In the end good businessmen will do more to act responsibly with your money.....especially if they feel they have to explain their actions afterward....which in this case still has not happened...only responses to date have been suspected part owners chiming in....I'll continue to respond to posts that I think are productive...but will lose patience after that...I have a day job and really don't care much about VTR's business....only interest is in accurate history.

350 Rookie

iTrader: (29)

pppfffft. VTR FTL. Dude has the worst attitude. lol

athenG

iTrader: (2)

I don't blame the 700bb coz he still should've been able to tune your car to stay below 400whp. You had 465 whp/414TQ and it is already proven that once you go past 400whp then you are in greater danger of blowing up your car. My question is how was the tune and what EMS did he use? I know he's a big fan of the Reflash on TN kits.

350 Rookie

iTrader: (29)

they reflashed my z and i only had about 340 whp and my car still blew. maybe it was because i redlined when i shifted.

RedBullRR

iTrader: (7)

Shouldn't blow unless it was not tuned correctly. 340WHP is not a lot to ask for.

350 Rookie

iTrader: (29)

well i had 6 bent rods. maybe not "blown" blown but still, undrivable.

zmedic16

iTrader: (6)

sounds like no fun....
a couple of people stoped working there because of their "ethics".
but as a personal experience when i got my pulleys done there i was a
happy customer. 1800$turbonetics install made me go buy some tools read instructions and install it with a fellow member here.

AlwaysNBoost

iTrader: (10)

wow,never knew so many people had issues with there car after leaving the shop-can you guys let me know how the situations where addressed after the issues happened

cc1012

jaden can you tell us how long ago this happened??? What i dont understand is how an avid reader whos prob done his research can come on here and say my stock block 450whp z/g blew up and point fingers. People have been turboing and supercharging them for a few years now. And everyone knows stock block wont handle more then 400whp. Hell its even stickied at the top of the FI section. No trying to be a dick here at all. But the shop is def at fault but you should have done your research. Now after doing mine and considering my G is my DD id never even consider FI. Not inless i had the money for a built block. Even then so there could be some problems. My rule is, If it didnt come FI from the factory then its not met to have boost ran through it. WRX's and EVOs those motors are built for boost. Not VQs wit rods the size of my pinky and a compression ratio or 10.5 to 1.

athenG

iTrader: (2)

I redline my car a lot and even bounce the limiter couple times and still fine.. (Crossing my fingers) my last dyno was 373whp/393TQ. VTR think Utec is garbage and they wouldn't touch it, then I ask was what is the alternative and they said a Reflash is better

350 Rookie

iTrader: (29)

LOL. One time i went to VTR to pick up a new uppipe cuz my weld cracked near my wastegate and when i got there, he had the worst attitude ever. He was so disrespectful/rude. I told him i was gonna do the install myself and i think he got offended or upset and with the most hatred told me, "go ahead install it, you'll have leaks and come back here". and then he was like "if you ever talk trash about me on the forums, you will get owned by a WHOLE BUNCH of members". I was like ya, the forums is my life and i really care what they think. You are a grown man, threatening me with ownage on a forum???? If he is ever nice with you, he could care less about you, he just wants your business and money, hence the OP blowing his motor. 450 on stock block? ya, real reliable shop.

They are a joke.

SlideFox

I think one thing that needs to be clarified is the term "Stock Block". The "Stock Blocck" i.e. stock sleeves w/ NO machine work has already been proven to handle 600+WHP. The connecting rods are the weak link in the "Stock Motor".

There are plenty of people running a "Stock Block", but with aftermarket pistons and rods that are running strong with no issues.

Ruthless18x

iTrader: (59)

In VTR's defense, I have had great luck with them in the past. And they actually answer their phone and pms unlike some other vendors on here. They have always helped me out, even from across the country.

OT though, good luck with your motor.

jadenz350

iTrader: (2)

no ems...just the jwt split second box.

athenG

iTrader: (2)

Did you upgrade your fuel? I haven't been to their shop except a few phone calls. My only problem is that they don't offer their clients much option but what ever came with the kit. If you were opting for bigger turbo and planning to build down the road then a better EMS, bigger injector are nice to have since you'll need them anyways. There are many people who are running the Greddy TT and we all know those kit are also capable of big power. The 700bb is the same as long as you have a good supporting mods, great tune and run low boost then you should be fine.

It's like me going to Julian and asking him I want a Greddy TT and I'm planning to build down the road, what do you think he'll tell me? He'll most likely tell me to get a good ems, big enough injector, fuel pump to handle my power since I'll need them anyways down the road and a conservative tune. I don't think he'll tell me no don't get that coz that kit is only for the big boys..lol

good luck with your jorney...

jadenz350

iTrader: (2)

Appreciate your candid remarks and agree that had i spent more time being the avid reader you're assuming I was....perhaps I would've challenged the final product a bit more....to go even further. When I first went to the shop and was introduced to Alex, he test drove me in a T/N car (his redline), and another black rev-up TT car with the JWT 530 kit to give me a demonstration of the different power levels for each kit. He even mentioned early on that they never push the envelope with more than 420 whp....So why didn't I challenge after even Alex from the shop had that to say? Good question, the reality is that at some point I just stopped listening/talking to Alex about the project because whatever he said never really counted for anything...if he told me 1300 for the GReddy suspension..by the time I talked to Vinny it turned into 1700....if i called to ask when the car would be ready it quickly turned into "speak to Vinny"....the guy had no power in that shop...so i just listened to Vinny...plus after spending 2 of the 3 weeks arguing/screaming and just being frustrated with the lack of service after committing to 12k in total of mods....you kind of just want to get the job over with. When I picked the car up he dynoed it in front of me and it produced the numbers mentioned...I just wanted to get my car out of there so dealt with small talk...paid my final money until they unhooked it from the dyno....and bolted without even taking them up on the offer to wash the car....the only instructions received from Vinny was to not rev the car above 6k until the engine was built....which was intended to be done this spring/now.

After the engine blew I didn't go back pointing fingers...i just thought it didn't work out - every engine is different...i get that. I asked Vinny to give me an estimate on a built motor and he handed me 2 estimates...one for a stg 2 built engine plus other labor, other bs work (for example washing out my intercooler since i blew a connecting rod...) totalling $20k and another one for $15k for a stg 1. These numbers were far off the high level numbers he quoted before the problem.....i got pretty upset at the dramatic increase all of a sudden and decided to double check his recommendations directly with JWT...i emailed JWT directly and what they told me was completely opposite to what VTR did...VTR's logic was its cheaper to upgrade to the 700 kit from the start ($500 more) rather than doing it after i bought the 530bb kit (i think $2k may have been quoted) - there was no mention from VTR of other mandatory items JWT stated in their email. The logic for having authorized installers for the JWT kit is for the manufacturer to be sure that customers will have a working produt once finished...JWT would not be such a popular kit if engines kept blowing up after 3 weeks. So for VTR to knowingly exceed the limits that you mention begs the question i asked before....is Vinny a really a genius or just simply unethical?? can't think of a third option.

With regard to timing, to be precise...deposit was paid on August 4th 2007...car was dropped off August 13th and the kit was finally installed by Sept. 1st. Actually was pissed off the weekend right before AlwaysNboost's car went to the track and apparently clained to run high 11's. I was so pissed off the turbo install was taking three weeks (apparently 1 mechanic was sick) and that they spent a whole Saturday bleeding his brakes when they could of been trying to finish my car which was sidelined for a total of three weeks when they promised 5 days max...to do the install.

Armando

iTrader: (19)

ahaha

jadenz350

iTrader: (2)

thanks....no fuel system...just the JWT kit with the bigger turbos, the spl sec. box and that's it...I'm learning this stuff in reverse...like many others have...you don't seem to take info serious until you've suffered you're first catastrophe...high price of admission...and i'm sure its not over yet! there will be something else. I've spoken to a few other shops and all have no problem giving the same advice that JWT siad in their email to me...fuel mgmt, ems, injectors, etc....before using the 700 kit. that's the reason i just can't take the commercials anymore about how knowledgable VTR are and how amazing their work is...

SlideFox

I seems like you got the run-around. Previously I had only heard good things out of VTR. I glad you shared your honest opinion about your build.

Good Luck! I hope your Z gets put back together correctly, and you enjoy the boost!

athenG

iTrader: (2)

those are hight prices.. the question is did he actually did a custom tune on your car ? I hope he just didn't slap the SS box and ran that with your upgraded 700bb turbo. the stock JWT kit still uses the stock injector right? Do you have gauges? What A/F did you see when WOT?

Edited: didnt see your response... VTR should've given you all the list that you need before the car was even worked at.