Vas_Z33

iTrader: (39)

thats true.. I guess we will never know.. technically we shouldnt " need to know " why they parted ways is there business and none of ours. maybe it was something else and personal that they DONT want to share, who knows.. so let it be..

obviously this thread was meant to just let people know that they dont deal with each other.. the end. You dont think that Sam hasnt seen any of this? im sure he has.. and isnt commenting on anything. He said what was needed to be said in the beginning and left it as is.

the way i see it is that " ok GTM and Forged parted ways... ok cool. moving on. " thats just IMO.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

Well, I guess I'll put in my 2 cents and leave it at that. There are no gory details being hidden - and I'm pretty sure I know most all of what's gone on - though this is all many months old. I wouldn't want my mistakes aired on the public forums in detail for everyone to scrutinize and pass comment on, so I'll leave it at that. I consider both Sharif and Sam to be friends and I talked to both of them yesterday. I know Sharif much better having interacted with him directly on my build over a couple years. I haven't been to FP in over a year or so, but have stayed in touch.

No one is perfect but Sharif's character cannot be questioned. He has proved himself to me personally time and again as well as to many others. He does make mistakes. FP made mistakes on my build. He always owns up and strives to more than make up for it, if given a chance. Repeated issues indicate a process problem and I think this is where Sam's frustration lies. Repeated mistakes can make it difficult for those folks who don't know Sharif to bring ethics into question. The man always comes through in the end though - that's all I can say, from the personal experience of not just myself, but many.

Now you can blame him for making the mistakes in the first place and/or not having the QC policies/processes/personnel in place to prevent recurrences. He has to accept that. My sense is that recent hires have solidified the expertise in his shop so this type of stuff doesn't happen again but I think only time will tell and well, if you don't hear anything on this public forum, then all is well.

Sam, I think you've every right to protect your company's good name if you feel that a few bad builds/mistakes coming out of Forged may end up tarnishing it, but I think this move was a bit extreme. Perhaps it was needed though and it may be just as well. I hope these couple incidents will make Forged Performance a stronger shop as Sharif strives to make sure this doesn't happen again. I think he realizes that it's not just not about hiring good people (always helps!), but having a process in place to catch mistakes regardless of how good the techs are.

You both work very hard to provide this community with products and services that we are looking for as we modify our cars and I hope you both find a way to work this out. It's in everyone's best interest, ours especially!

Entaille

iTrader: (16)

+1

and scooby, not going to go roll through the other thread to try to figure it out. this has zero impact on most of us, just a curiosity thing.

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

Raj with all due respect you are a sheep and are blind.

Either you know and cover it, or you dont and shouldnt be typing. Regardless the fail is strong with you. You are so PC sometimes it makes me cringe.

Dont take that personally, I respect you as a person and helpful forum member, it is best certain people stay out of this. Myself included.

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

You say you should stay out of it and then you post regardless. And who exactly are you to judge me Alberto? Either man up and tell me exactly what you have a problem with or remain silent. PM or public, either way is fine with me. Are you looking to vent or to help the community here?

D350Z10

iTrader: (20)

This is very clear cut, if you don't have the patience and financial ability dont get in the game. No one is perfect, but Forged Performance is a damn good shop and they stand by their word.

Dilsher

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

SO TRUE. WELL SAID.

escobar929

iTrader: (1)

when are you gonna realize that statements like yours are completely worthless since you never provide any actual info

if you know whats going on, post it for all to see

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

I have been in the position 2X with 2 different shops where I have wanted to speak out about my situation-a negative situation. When I somewhat attempted it the first time (not FP fwiw) the shop would complain to mods/IB and because they are paying sponsors, threads would dissapear. It happened in our regional forums numerous times and numerous members saw this crap go down.

At the same time I struggle with myself because both shops that I feel have been bad to me at one point have also been good. And while I share most of my experiences I dont know if Im willing to "burn bridges."

I surely wont jump on the "lets burn XXXX shop down" bandwagon, but I cant help but get p!ssed at people who no matter what (even if others have proof of hack jobs), will defend a shop and act as if because they havent been wronged (or wronged to such an extent), the shop couldnt have screwed up, it p!sses me off.

This forum is a business and along with paying sponsors, and the shop groupies, just will not allow people to post negative stories no matter how true, no matter what the proof. Yet we have a sticky for RA/Scott and because he's gone now, its cool to laugh at him-Im not defending him BTW just pointing out the hypocrasy.

blasian

iTrader: (29)

Well said.

buzzardmountain

iTrader: (17)

You're calling Raj a sheep and blind......

Imply he knows something of the situations but covers it up by not posting.

And yet you admit to doing the same thing?


Mentioning VRT/RA/Scott is a red herring unless you are directly comparing the VRT/RA FAIL with Forged.

go-fast

maybe the gtm kits are being manufactured in china?

It would explain the long wait times and hit or miss fitment.

It would also explain sharif's recommendations to customers and the angry breakup.

maybe thelma could clear it up...........(that's you scooby)

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

I didnt go around talking about how AAM did right by me (at 1 point) when people posted catostrophic fails did I? That is what Im criticizing Raj for, he isnt the only one, there are many who do that.


Perhaps, if others who have had catastrophic failures and have proof of the work done posted it all, along with a story AND the thread didnt dissapear those comparison could be made...imagine that!

buzzardmountain

iTrader: (17)

I think it's human nature to want to share the good and the bad. If Raj had a good experience, I'd want him to share his experience.

I think your attention should be focused at the staff/site if you feel bad experiences/threads are being deleted. I remember kcobean deleting everything AAM related back in the day.

XKR

iTrader: (1)

It's well said... But how could that statement be correct when Juan was allowed to post that about FP?? FP is one of their biggest sponsors!... I think Alberto meant "Usually" gets deleted

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

what bout the huge motor fail (GTM out sources built motors, GTM vs FT from what I remember) from GTM last year. That witch hunt thread was super long and is now deleted.

Its all business.

No one is defending FP for some of the work done on that guys car. But if you think that Intense, GTM, AAM, PFS, Hill garage, Function Tuned, IP, etc dont have similar customers you are really in denial.

blasian

iTrader: (29)

Ah, I was thinking relative to threads being created. I forgot Juan posted his experience in the review thread. My bad...

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

in the end, its the consumers that lose out. the VQ community is pretty small, so none of this benefits any of us as a whole

rcdash

iTrader: (18)

The flip side of the coin is that single failures stand out and are dramatized whereas successful, routine builds are just... boring. It's easy to post and fling accusations about character and performance when you have no vested interest in this business and don't depend on it for survival. Don't get me wrong, I don't support threads being deleted by IB or others at the request of vendors. That's just wrong. Individual deletion of posts that violate the TOU is not the same thing. I know both happen. Sam should be the only one to have the power to delete this thread as the OP.

In regards to supporting FP, there is clearly some room for improvement. This thread has made it clear that neither GTM nor FP is perfect. I pointed out constructive criticism after my build and it's a little disappointing to see repetition of mistakes, but hopefully this will be a wake up call to invest in making things better for all future customers. Both Forged and GTM have strengths and weaknesses.

Anyway, I spoke to only what I felt relatively certain about. If you want to call me blind, so be it, but I talked to both Sam and Sharif before posting, and I can understand both their perspectives - and yes there are all kinds of issues on both ends that go both ways. There is no easy solution, but I firmly believe that discussion on a public forum is not best the way to resolve this. It's not about hiding problems. It's about getting them fixed to the benefit of all involved. That needs to be between Sam and Sharif. I can only hope for the best.

XKR

iTrader: (1)

It's kool..... Just trying to get your thoughts