Questions about main studs for my build...
10-31-2010, 08:00 AM
#43
Not that I'm disagreeing as I admit I don't know, but what makes this statement true? Who has actually done the research? It's the first time EVER that I hear of a TTY bolt that is better than a stud. Trust me when I say, if you're right I'll blindly toss the standard ARP's and go with the other bolts.
FWIW, I know of a local guy down here who has put 750whp in his G35 and he uses the standard ARP bolts. Don't know what gasket he has though.
FWIW, I know of a local guy down here who has put 750whp in his G35 and he uses the standard ARP bolts. Don't know what gasket he has though.
Last edited by rcdash; 10-31-2010 at 08:01 AM.
10-31-2010, 08:44 AM
#44
If the OP is sticking with the vortech... he wont even break 500 unless he upgrades to at least a T trim blower. The AT lost is just too great to not consider as the limiting factor.
Now, if the OP added NOS into the equation then it will be a whole new ball park but then once again the OEM AT still puts him at a disadvantage unless he beefs up the preassure plates, VB, and tq converter.
At this pt, the OP has to decide on how much he is willing to spend. If he's not willing to spend close to 10K then I don't think he should even shoot for +500whp. If he's happy with at most 450whp on AT then I dont see why not going with HR OEM parts and even OEM pistons with aftermarket rods and calling it a day.
Now, if the OP added NOS into the equation then it will be a whole new ball park but then once again the OEM AT still puts him at a disadvantage unless he beefs up the preassure plates, VB, and tq converter.
At this pt, the OP has to decide on how much he is willing to spend. If he's not willing to spend close to 10K then I don't think he should even shoot for +500whp. If he's happy with at most 450whp on AT then I dont see why not going with HR OEM parts and even OEM pistons with aftermarket rods and calling it a day.
10-31-2010, 09:29 AM
#45
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^ Finally someone who is giving the best advice (except for the pistons) . OP like I said above standard ARP studs and HKS head gasket are fine. The reference to to older threads about head lift was back in the early days when the shops didn't know what they are doing. Build your motor to the goals you want and a little more. You don't need to build to 700-800 hp if you are not going anywhere near there. There is a huge difference between 550 and 650+ hp. Think with your head not with the next great thing the shops are selling. There is some good advice here that is being given to you from some of the members here.
10-31-2010, 12:16 PM
#47
GT-ER Who said that?
seems like u rather take chances so why not reuse your stock pistons (if they are still good) and buy some eagle H beam rods. The weakest part of the stock motor is the oem rods so I think this should save u at least 700 if u reuse your stock pistons. Also, this keeps your compression at 10.5:1 which will net u more power with the vortech.
Erdem stock Pistons can hold up to 550whp ?
Well, will the stock pistons hold up to 550WHP ?
10-31-2010, 12:21 PM
#48
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^ Finally someone who is giving the best advice (except for the pistons) . OP like I said above standard ARP studs and HKS head gasket are fine. The reference to to older threads about head lift was back in the early days when the shops didn't know what they are doing. Build your motor to the goals you want and a little more. You don't need to build to 700-800 hp if you are not going anywhere near there. There is a huge difference between 550 and 650+ hp. Think with your head not with the next great thing the shops are selling. There is some good advice here that is being given to you from some of the members here.
I'm not going to build a 600whp car but I do with for 500whp flat and having the 928M impeller, going with some cams and pulleying the Vortech to push out 20psi+, I don't see 500whp being a big problem even with the 5AT. I already got 417whp on an bad tune ( I stopped because I ran out of injectors ) without cams at 16-17psi.
Even if I don't get there I'll just live with it... but I really don't wish to EVER remove this engine again...it's horrid.
Can I use HR bolts with an HKS or Cosworth gasket?
Also, I just finished removing my engine....I can spin the flywheel and hear some pistons moving...but the front doesn't move...lol.
10-31-2010, 02:04 PM
#49
GT-ER - I've seen str8dum1's vortech make 500+ whp on Sharif's dyno and that wasn't with any reworked impeller. I think you're going to want the little added safety. I don't see why a standard TTY HR headbolt cannot be used with an HKS or Cosworth hg. That sounds solid to me. Of course the machining costs of the block may or may not offset the cost difference between HGs if you want the advantages of the HR hg (cheap and better coolant flow).
Last edited by rcdash; 10-31-2010 at 02:07 PM.
10-31-2010, 02:17 PM
#51
The bold part is what always keeps me thinking...
I'm not going to build a 600whp car but I do with for 500whp flat and having the 928M impeller, going with some cams and pulleying the Vortech to push out 20psi+, I don't see 500whp being a big problem even with the 5AT. I already got 417whp on an bad tune ( I stopped because I ran out of injectors ) without cams at 16-17psi.
Even if I don't get there I'll just live with it... but I really don't wish to EVER remove this engine again...it's horrid.
Can I use HR bolts with an HKS or Cosworth gasket?
Also, I just finished removing my engine....I can spin the flywheel and hear some pistons moving...but the front doesn't move...lol.
I'm not going to build a 600whp car but I do with for 500whp flat and having the 928M impeller, going with some cams and pulleying the Vortech to push out 20psi+, I don't see 500whp being a big problem even with the 5AT. I already got 417whp on an bad tune ( I stopped because I ran out of injectors ) without cams at 16-17psi.
Even if I don't get there I'll just live with it... but I really don't wish to EVER remove this engine again...it's horrid.
Can I use HR bolts with an HKS or Cosworth gasket?
Also, I just finished removing my engine....I can spin the flywheel and hear some pistons moving...but the front doesn't move...lol.
"Any Job Worth Doing is a Job Worth Doing Well" Samuel Brooks
10-31-2010, 06:07 PM
#56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
I would suggest an HKS or stock HR headgasket over the Cometic. Regular ARP studs are not suited for the VQ, as their recommended trq values are too low for forced induction use. Use ARP L19 (trq to 93-95 ft/lbs with moly), or stock headbolts.
As shops have built an inventory of knowledge and experioence many common wisdoms about the performance of the 350Z and VQ engine have changed. Remember when enigines were blowing up like fireworks on July 4th!!???
Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
I would suggest an HKS or stock HR headgasket over the Cometic. Regular ARP studs are not suited for the VQ, as their recommended trq values are too low for forced induction use. Use ARP L19 (trq to 93-95 ft/lbs with moly), or stock headbolts.
As shops have built an inventory of knowledge and experioence many common wisdoms about the performance of the 350Z and VQ engine have changed. Remember when enigines were blowing up like fireworks on July 4th!!???
10-31-2010, 06:58 PM
#57
If I were to build my motor again, I would have gone with L19's(just for a peace of mind). However I am very happy that I used the HR gasket, and so far the HR bolts have been great as well. There is a long thread on the maxima forum talking about the differences between TTY HR's and standard ARP's and id go with HR bolts any day. I have read about some issues with Cometics, I would go again with HR gasket even if I were building a 800hp VQ, with the fact that it has improved cooling passages(their location and addition of them), and the fire ring provides the most pressure at the cylinders rather than 3 or 2 layer gaskets providing equal pressure thought the whole block. Plus it dosnt take much science to cut off some material from the coolant entrance to the block (Dremel is your friend).
11-01-2010, 06:45 AM
#59
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[QUOTE=rcdash;8755299]Good thing some folks learn their lessons and move on.
I have personally have seen many builds with standard studs in the 500-550 range with ZERO issues with head lift. They are still running strong. Everything has it's uses, this is not to say that L19's should never be used again it has to do with how the car is being used. I would like to know how many engines have had the issue do to the studs only and not do to something else. Proof from the past has been sketchy. Since most of the f*ck ups from the shops was covered up. I've seen a lot since I've been here.
xzotklr
Quote:
Originally Posted by captj3 View Post
Wow, this coming from a shop that swore by standard arp studs for years.
As shops have built an inventory of knowledge and experioence many common wisdoms about the performance of the 350Z and VQ engine have changed. Remember when enigines were blowing up like fireworks on July 4th!!???
Yes I do remember. But I also remember how things were sold as the greatest then the next thing was better. ARP has been around longer than the 350z. My main point to the OP was for him to build what he needed so he can stay on budget.
I have personally have seen many builds with standard studs in the 500-550 range with ZERO issues with head lift. They are still running strong. Everything has it's uses, this is not to say that L19's should never be used again it has to do with how the car is being used. I would like to know how many engines have had the issue do to the studs only and not do to something else. Proof from the past has been sketchy. Since most of the f*ck ups from the shops was covered up. I've seen a lot since I've been here.
xzotklr
Quote:
Originally Posted by captj3 View Post
Wow, this coming from a shop that swore by standard arp studs for years.
As shops have built an inventory of knowledge and experioence many common wisdoms about the performance of the 350Z and VQ engine have changed. Remember when enigines were blowing up like fireworks on July 4th!!???
Yes I do remember. But I also remember how things were sold as the greatest then the next thing was better. ARP has been around longer than the 350z. My main point to the OP was for him to build what he needed so he can stay on budget.
11-05-2010, 06:54 PM
#60
Me personally if I were going to build a moi would try to slightly overbuild just so could rag the crap out of it without worrying about it going boom. I would say something like 30 percent overbuilt (for what ever your Target whp level may be) is reasonable. But whose to say what is 30 percent overbuilt actually looks like.
Sure I wouldn't build an 800 whp motor if you only intend to run 500 but I wouldn't risk running on the ragged edge either. I guess it all depends on how much (more) risk your willing to tolerate.
But what do I know, my car is still NA.
Sure I wouldn't build an 800 whp motor if you only intend to run 500 but I wouldn't risk running on the ragged edge either. I guess it all depends on how much (more) risk your willing to tolerate.
But what do I know, my car is still NA.
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