The Emission Control systems that E.P.A use in P.R. to check our cars is very simple... I guess?... we can pass it w/o the cats but w the rest of the system that come with the car. The cats is not the only thing that the car have to clean the air... but is the most important to do that job!

P.S. We have Trucks and other vehicules that put a lot more crap in the air that a new car would do!

 

HMMMM. In Cali, you could do some time for selling and/or fabricating the cat pipes, ever think of that, slick? Does the word BUSTED mean anything to you? And you are offending me and a lot of other people in this country by supplying this so-called product to people who seem to lack a social concience by buying it. ARE YOU A REGISTERED VENDOR OF AN APPROVED PRODUCT?

Boomer--take a hike, before you are thrown out. This an independently owned site and you are violating its rules, stupid.

 

Why? Do you think its OK then to pollute because somebody else does more? I'm old enough to remember the BROWN AIR in California, gentlemen, and the most effective deterrent was smog control on automobiles. We now have more cars registered in the U.S. than we have people, hey, its OK to **** over everyone else because other people do it. Pretty muddy thinking in my mind, folks.

Webcar, you have a visual inspection probably, just to note the equipment is on the car. Useless as hell, and basically flawed, as this MOD is. You want more HP, pay for it with legal products or go to some other forum where nobody cares, you won't see me there and if this continues, I won't be here either. This used to be a class site and can be again, if the pukes/trolls are excised, its up to the Administration to take appropriate action.

 

While I agree with your convictions, we should use this opprtunity to educate and debate on this issue. I think there is a valid discussion occuring, so I wouldn't get so upset. Simply make your points, and see what the rebuttal is. Perhaps as a result of thesse posts, we can get some HiFlo cats made and on a car to see that they can gain about as much HP as the open pipe. Our HiFlo cats flow 96% of what the same size open pipe would flow, so I know it can be done. Perhaps if I can get a set on our project car and dyno it, this thread could be used as a tool to educate others of the viability of the cats, and also teach global responsibility as well. I lived out in the brown air for a while as well...

 

Hey, go ahead, its a valid enterprise. I have made my statements from a position of moral indignation. The long-time members on this site are used to me exploding sometimes and beat on me for it, justifiably so. This subject is not one I will compromise on and it wouldn't be a good idea to try, so I'l leave you to it. The smog laws did what they were supposed to do and cars now make more clean, usable power than the '60s muscle cars ever did. The Z does, bone stock.

 

Remember that I have said in several posts now that I agree with you. Actually, I think I was the first one to raise the issue of compliance with smog laws as a social obligation in this thread. Again, I just think that this is a good discussion which could wind up having a positive effect on some people in the end...

 

communication is key,

I have been seriously considering offering some high flow cat options, also high flow cat options with the headers we are producing right now.

I have seen a lot of interest in keeping cats but upgrading them and I am not one to ignore a lot of interest.

 

It's not illegal to sell cat replacement pipes. They have to be offered with the caveat that they are for off road use only as I understand it.

And on another note, I know some people are testy about emissions issues, but I am prepared to guarantee that my 350 without the cats (operated off road only, ofcourse) runs cleaner than half of the unmaintained crap-boxes that populate the road in New Jersey, not to mention all the industrial vehicles that travel through our fine state. But I don't run my vehicle on the road so that point is mute. I tow mine around with an 89 Honda CRX that burns 2 quarts of oil per week.

 

First of all, nobody knows for sure if the 350Z pollutes without the cats, my 1995 Formula passed emissions test without them.

Second, in PR the emissions test, is done by a machine that registers the rpms, and the ppms of gases expelled from the engine (or what ever it is called).

Third, the last time I checked, everybody has the right to its own opinion, and you are free to do what ever you want as long as you don’t violate the law or other person’s rights. Maybe you don’t find this thread/mod helpful by your standards, but that is only you, other members can judge for themselves and decide if they want to go with it or not.

Fourth, you CAN use cat pipes in the drag strip, so selling them is NOT illegal; the person who BUYS them is the responsible for not using them at public roads, which is illegal. The last time I checked there is NO pro-stock car using cats, so if you feel so insulted, you should go to your state representative and ask him/her to pass a law to prohibit drag racing along with ALL the sports involved with gasoline engines, because they pollute.

Fifth, if you are insulted by this thread, then move along and don’t read it, because you can choose not to, that’s the beauty of freedom.

Sixth, I don’t know how you can relate class with this thread, this is a simple thread to share impressions of a mod that has been effective. If you relate class with this thread, I can read between the lines, and I’m pretty sure that you sir are implying something else. So I would be careful in what you say because, that is stated in the forum rules.

 

boomer is on his lefty extremist tree hugging campaign again....

 

I mean what I say, sir, and I've been on this site a lot longer than you and I don't need to be reminded of the rules, I helped write some of them before the present owner took possession. OFF road is allowed, removing your cats for street driving violates the law and don't pretend to threaten me. Some of the posters on this thread need education and others , like Max, kept trying to warn people off this mod because of the laws it violates. If you are violating the law with intent, I wouldn't give you the time of day and that is my right.

Whether the Z pollutes w/o cats is moot and all I have is your word your 95 Formula doesn't and I don't know you, so your word is meaningless to me. Also, with your use of this mod, if it does pollute, you are violating my rights by knowingly using a product which is banned, by law, from the public roads and you ARE NOT FREE to do that. Find yourself an attorney to tell you what you obviously don't know, because your knowledge is seriously in need of updating. Yes, this thread offends me and that is my opinion, I won't be back.

Finally, your opinion is noted and ignored. That is the only part of your argument that has merit.

 

You sure like to whine about things when you don't like them.

Ever think of taking a less violent/arguementative approach? All you are doing is winning enemies and wasting space in this thread that it is quite obvious no one cares about -- if they did, similar opinions would have already been posted.

I suggest you go the route danny suggests, and do things in an educational/friendly manner instead of being such a jerk.

 

Yep, its a curse. Kinda like Tourette's Syndrome.

 

Suggestion noted.

 

Sorry, apparently I posted out of sequence for your post. Mine was not in response to yours. Sounds like you're doing fine. I've already said I won't be posting in the thread again.

 

I told the maker that I wouldn't be able to use them because they were not CARB certified and that any Car Shop that removes your cats that are less than 50k miles old or removes cats and doesn't replace them they can be fined 10k bucks!

He was very cool abd refunded my money the very same day.
So I am ok with that. It's true they are not 50 state legal but you can use them for off road racing.

Caveat Emptor is all here folks, good thread. The hardest part would be finding a shop willing to risk a 10k fine or do it yourself.

What the best mod would be is cut our car down from 5 cats to two high flows with a billit muffler to reduce drone.

True dual of course, lots os ways to stay legal and lots of ideas in my head right now but the guy won't rip you off so he is ok in my book, he gave me my money back and that is more than a bad person would do.

 

Max,

Even if he didn't give you your money back, he wouldn't be a bad person for making a race part. I'm not sure if that's where YOU were going with it, but I kinda got the impression some other people were identifying this part with illegal and illegal with criminal and therefore this guy making them is a criminal.

I don't think NJ has a fine for removing the cats, at least for the shop, as I haven't found one. That's a grey area in the law anyway.

The bottom line of this entire thread is that people can make choices and those choices might offend other people. That's just the way things are here. I think we should get off the ethical debate and back to the mechanical discussion and learn a little bit more.

Maybe we can now work on the assumption that everyone here KNOWS FOR A FACT that 1) Cat pipes are illegal in all 50 states for road use. 2) Cat pipes are LEGAL to produce and distribute, and 3) Max has made it abundantly clear that California is not the place to break this law.

Now on to the relevant mechanical debate...

Dan

 

OK, so I guess it is worth me asking the question: Who on this forum would be seriously interested in purchasing bolt on HF cats for the Z?

 

I’m sorry, but I think that it is you that need to go to an attorney; because the simple act of removing the cats DOES NOT violate your rights. That is a poor excuse to whine about something.

42 USCA § 7522 is where is stated the alteration of a device for eliminating pollutants, and such elimination is not illegal until proven it is harmful for the environment, meaning that if you remove it and pass emissions, it is not illegal running without them. The purpose of the law is to reduce pollutants, not to ban the removal of devices in new cars. You are violating the law if you are polluting the air on public roads with or without the cats. And ever since nobody has tried to pass emissions without them, you are wasting time whining about something you don’t know.

My remark about the forum rules was referred to your statement about “class”. It had an element of racism, and that is offensive and not approved in this forum or anywhere. Because you helped write the rules, that doesn’t mean they don’t apply to you.

Since when YOUR opinion has merit here? Clearly it doesn’t because, I don’t see many members backing every single argument you have stated.

And for the record, I am an attorney…

 

Dan,
I have the trailer ready anytime you want to take your car to the track to test the pipes.


And LSD unique, Danny is very happy with the pipes and they went on with no problems!. Dan, talk to you soon.