PPE Longtube Headers
09-19-2012, 05:29 AM
#601
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its not a quality control problem lol, its called installation forethought. lets jump ahead to the installation... it looks to me like they didnt weld around where the bolts go through the flange and into the head. those are really big tubes! if you weld a bead right there you are gonna have a really hard time getting a bolt to sit flush right there. how thrilled would you be to have these 360 degree welded tubes that you cant get bolts into the flanges on without grinding either the bolt head or the weld. now THAT is fckd... i think PPE did the right thing not welding in this area, as that is a much bigger (and substantially stupider) problem to have.
edit: id like to add that the problem with the bolts getting tight on the weld and not the flange would cause the headers to not pull tight against the gasket and they would leak. tick tick tick tick as the best possible scenario. ive put headers on over a dozen of my own cars and this bead skipping technique is commonplace on some makes. some cars have heads with the header bolts far enough away from the ports that they can, and typically do, weld all the way around the outside. some cars have heads with the bolts really close to the ports, like ours, and they have to do this bead skipping thing. i just measured 3/16" from the inside of the bolt hole to the flange hole and .25" to the tube... i traced the bead around and measured where that location would be from the bolt hole and thats .125". i assure you that the heads on the bolts are wider than .125" around that hole, regardless of the stud diameter.
edit: id like to add that the problem with the bolts getting tight on the weld and not the flange would cause the headers to not pull tight against the gasket and they would leak. tick tick tick tick as the best possible scenario. ive put headers on over a dozen of my own cars and this bead skipping technique is commonplace on some makes. some cars have heads with the header bolts far enough away from the ports that they can, and typically do, weld all the way around the outside. some cars have heads with the bolts really close to the ports, like ours, and they have to do this bead skipping thing. i just measured 3/16" from the inside of the bolt hole to the flange hole and .25" to the tube... i traced the bead around and measured where that location would be from the bolt hole and thats .125". i assure you that the heads on the bolts are wider than .125" around that hole, regardless of the stud diameter.
Last edited by juicinjake; 09-19-2012 at 07:11 AM.
09-19-2012, 07:26 AM
#603
its not a quality control problem lol, its called installation forethought. lets jump ahead to the installation... it looks to me like they didnt weld around where the bolts go through the flange and into the head. those are really big tubes! if you weld a bead right there you are gonna have a really hard time getting a bolt to sit flush right there. how thrilled would you be to have these 360 degree welded tubes that you cant get bolts into the flanges on without grinding either the bolt head or the weld. now THAT is fckd... i think PPE did the right thing not welding in this area, as that is a much bigger (and substantially stupider) problem to have.
edit: id like to add that the problem with the bolts getting tight on the weld and not the flange would cause the headers to not pull tight against the gasket and they would leak. tick tick tick tick as the best possible scenario. ive put headers on over a dozen of my own cars and this bead skipping technique is commonplace on some makes. some cars have heads with the header bolts far enough away from the ports that they can, and typically do, weld all the way around the outside. some cars have heads with the bolts really close to the ports, like ours, and they have to do this bead skipping thing. i just measured 3/16" from the inside of the bolt hole to the flange hole and .25" to the tube... i traced the bead around and measured where that location would be from the bolt hole and thats .125". i assure you that the heads on the bolts are wider than .125" around that hole, regardless of the stud diameter.
edit: id like to add that the problem with the bolts getting tight on the weld and not the flange would cause the headers to not pull tight against the gasket and they would leak. tick tick tick tick as the best possible scenario. ive put headers on over a dozen of my own cars and this bead skipping technique is commonplace on some makes. some cars have heads with the header bolts far enough away from the ports that they can, and typically do, weld all the way around the outside. some cars have heads with the bolts really close to the ports, like ours, and they have to do this bead skipping thing. i just measured 3/16" from the inside of the bolt hole to the flange hole and .25" to the tube... i traced the bead around and measured where that location would be from the bolt hole and thats .125". i assure you that the heads on the bolts are wider than .125" around that hole, regardless of the stud diameter.
What are your thoughts on the center piping? It's missing the sides welds.
09-19-2012, 09:47 AM
#605
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page 3 post #46... you can clearly see the same breaks in the weld by the bolt holes. when you put a bolt in them put a washer on it too and u will see what im sayin...
edit: i just talked to derek and he said his prototype headers were like that as well. there is nothing to worry about... the external welds are STRUCTURAL welds only.
edit: i just talked to derek and he said his prototype headers were like that as well. there is nothing to worry about... the external welds are STRUCTURAL welds only.
Last edited by juicinjake; 09-19-2012 at 10:19 AM.
09-19-2012, 10:47 AM
#606
page 3 post #46... you can clearly see the same breaks in the weld by the bolt holes. when you put a bolt in them put a washer on it too and u will see what im sayin...
edit: i just talked to derek and he said his prototype headers were like that as well. there is nothing to worry about... the external welds are STRUCTURAL welds only.
edit: i just talked to derek and he said his prototype headers were like that as well. there is nothing to worry about... the external welds are STRUCTURAL welds only.
one of my pipes also wasn't ported clean so that's still a little upseting
Last edited by Voboy; 09-19-2012 at 10:48 AM.
09-19-2012, 11:15 AM
#607
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yes mine is welded like that on the center tube. i think part of it is clearancing for the bolts, while part of it is just neglected because there isnt a clean welding line, perhaps. perhaps its just that they are structural welds and there isnt a lot of thought that goes into it at all... at least in those areas of the center pipe. around the bolt holes im fairly certain they did it for the reasons i already mentioned. now, as for all my ports, id say they look great. i didnt see anything i was unhappy with at all. when i looked back at yours i noticed a few little bee bee's here and there. i guess mine do have some of that going on but its smooth when i feel over them. none of that is going to cost you any power. i have a feeling when you get them installed and tuned you will be very happy. when are you going to put them on?
09-19-2012, 02:15 PM
#609
yes mine is welded like that on the center tube. i think part of it is clearancing for the bolts, while part of it is just neglected because there isnt a clean welding line, perhaps. perhaps its just that they are structural welds and there isnt a lot of thought that goes into it at all... at least in those areas of the center pipe. around the bolt holes im fairly certain they did it for the reasons i already mentioned. now, as for all my ports, id say they look great. i didnt see anything i was unhappy with at all. when i looked back at yours i noticed a few little bee bee's here and there. i guess mine do have some of that going on but its smooth when i feel over them. none of that is going to cost you any power. i have a feeling when you get them installed and tuned you will be very happy. when are you going to put them on?
09-19-2012, 04:56 PM
#610
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Got my O2 bung from PPE today , thank you PPE for that, have to bring the car to my friends fab shop for some other welding soon anyhow, just throwing it in the Y pipe.
Still waiting on gaskets and hardware so I can begin to tear my arms up doing the install.
Still waiting on gaskets and hardware so I can begin to tear my arms up doing the install.
09-19-2012, 05:23 PM
#612
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i would also like to say that mine, too, are not welded completely around each primary. i hate to say it, because i think it is good to have high expectations for products to keep quality up, but i think the ones expressing worry about their headers are being picky and finding things wrong with a really top notch product. i, also, am not new to headers on this car or others as well. i have a couple of examples to show you with pictures below that might make you thing twice about complaining.
Here is my chevy truck, with a cammed 383 stroker, etc, etc, with hedman longtube headers. granted, these are not top of the line headers, but not bottom of the line either. note that there is not any welding on the exterior of the primaries where they meet the flange.
another example are the cheap megan headers for our car. yes, i have megans sitting in my garage, along with 2 sets of stock manifolds and some nismo Rtune headers as well, which will all be for sale soon. anyway, before i get too far off topic. look at the quality of the megans and just think twice about where you want the header manufacturer spending his time when he is building them.
Megans have weld all the way around the primary/flange exterior
but wait....look at the quality of the reverse side.
do you want the manufacturer spending the unnecessary time welding the exterior when the interior and flange look like this abortion? i sure dont.....
you can sleep well at night knowing you have a quality header from PPE here.
Here is my chevy truck, with a cammed 383 stroker, etc, etc, with hedman longtube headers. granted, these are not top of the line headers, but not bottom of the line either. note that there is not any welding on the exterior of the primaries where they meet the flange.
another example are the cheap megan headers for our car. yes, i have megans sitting in my garage, along with 2 sets of stock manifolds and some nismo Rtune headers as well, which will all be for sale soon. anyway, before i get too far off topic. look at the quality of the megans and just think twice about where you want the header manufacturer spending his time when he is building them.
Megans have weld all the way around the primary/flange exterior
but wait....look at the quality of the reverse side.
do you want the manufacturer spending the unnecessary time welding the exterior when the interior and flange look like this abortion? i sure dont.....
you can sleep well at night knowing you have a quality header from PPE here.
09-19-2012, 07:27 PM
#616
I was merely just trying to see if that's how it's supposed to be, in no way of shape and form was I complaining or bashing the quality of it. I've never seen welds like this so that's why I ask the question. It would be a PITA to find out later if it turns out it was in fact a defect AFTER the install, hahahahahaha.
09-19-2012, 07:33 PM
#617
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I was merely just trying to see if that's how it's supposed to be, in no way of shape and form was I complaining or bashing the quality of it. I've never seen welds like this so that's why I ask the question. It would be a PITA to find out later if it turns out it was in fact a defect AFTER the install, hahahahahaha.
09-20-2012, 05:02 AM
#619
