That's true...just knowin adam for little years. I think he is the guy that will go look for tear it down and finding " how/why" first, than "worry/stress about doing all over again".....It's just far from "money", that's just him...

 

This thread is about cam timing. Not how much you people think it should be DIY'ed.

 

LOL my shop won't close down its paid for and its for my own cars, and to keep my tools in. I have tuned FI cars also. I didn't even start this thread to flame anyone and it gets derailed just like the other one that I posted.

As far as hexidecimal equations I have no idea why someone would need to that with Osiris. Hexi can also be converted to simplify it. I never had to any of that.

 

another update.



after advancing intake cam timing further, I was able to gain even more power in the mid range, but lost power up top. obviously it has gone past its optimum area in the top end and is going backwards.

you can see the new green lines added in the chart for MAF voltage and cam angles.

still more to go. im gonna keep this going so at least people using tomei 268deg cam out there can benefit something from this.

 

this is not zero sum

It's not that all people with 268's will be able to benefit from it - it's that your car may benefit from it. How much cam timing the car will stand is a function of many things - the specific cams are only 1 small part of the equation

 

Whats your full mod list bleun

 

Z1 - thats true, but cam duration and lift are the factors that will impact power output depending on cam timing the most. I just remembered that you got the same cams, perhaps you should share your cam angles if you dont mind? not sure but about now but you were using utec before which cannot adjust cam angles, if you are still using it then you will probably gain a lot of more power with your built engine if you play with cam timing.

jiggy - nothing major, for power related mods are tomei 268 cams, jwt valve springs, stillen intake, AAM plenum spacer and full exhaust. light weight pulley and flywheel as well but dont think these will change power output.

 

Cam lift and duration are a factor. They are far from the only factor and they aren't even necessarily the most important factor.

My cam angles are exactly as they were when my car left the factory in Japan. I have not changed them at all to date. I have sold the UTEC and the car now runs on a Haltech, but to date, I have not adjusted cam timing at all, nor really tuned the car for it's newest mods except for 30 minutes worth of street tuning. That was done in September and I haven't touched it since. That is something I'll deal with in the future when the whether is nicer and the other things I'm doing are completed

 

z1- no offense but dont try to be so smart, like I said i admit that cam angles is not the only factor but it is a factor that will impact the most when changing cam shafts, changing cam shaft is all about duration/lift and center lobe, not sure about your back ground but if you've played with cam pulleys in older engines you should well know about this. cam duration and pulley angle(changing lobe center) bring the most significant change to engine's power band characteristics, ie, moving peak power band area. stop firing at me, i know you're pretty reputable in this forum and i dont want to start an unnecessray argument or see you do the same thing, so lets not do that.

btw, you probably will gain a lot in the mid range with cam timing adjustment, thats what those variable cam timing advance tech is there for anyway my previous dyno curve looked very similar to your power curve in your original post of your build (power pattern i mean, obviously much less number in overall due to less compression and all the goodies you've got!). i've gain a nice amount of mid range power few years ago when I first dyno tune my Z with osiris (main reason why I moved on from UTEC), and now I am searching for more. Weather here in New Zealand is pretty good nowdays for road tune

if i knew what cipher log showing was x2 of actual cam angle value, i could've finished this long time ago when I first dyno tuned for cam timing adjustment. thanks again to rocks for the information

 

Hey Bro, Geez. Us Aussie's always new you Kiwi's were a bit slow. I gave you all this info in this thread (http://www.my350z.com/forum/tuning/3...ing-chart.html) 18 months ago.

Seriously now, set the inlet cam angle from 5500rm on to what you set it to
to get the maf voltage expressed in the thick black line & I reckon you will be close to optimum for your cams.
Modify the VTC pullys for another 5 deg rotation (remember this will be 10 deg @ crank & cipher log) & there's more to be had in the mid range.

Now don't go trying it out on the road with all the cops that are out on these summer holidays, of cause if you live in the South Island thats different.
Some of the best driving roads in the world with bugger all people on them.

Last of all, don't let Adam Z1 get under your skin. I've locked horns with him over some facts a few times over the years, but by and large most of his postings IMO are close to the mark

 

I wasn't trying to be smart at all. This stuff gets very complex, and I don't think anyone here is an expert. Trial and error, as you're doing, will be the best ally you have. None of the stuff works in an isolated way though, and the only way to know your best settings are to try it on your car. Those settings will not automatically be a cure all for everyones car (even if they have the same cams), they will be the best settings for a given set of mods, which involves some level of compromise at certain rpm/load points. As you change your intake setup, plenum volume, head cc's, and headers, the cam angles might require a change. This is another reason I was never in a big rush to play with mine or ditch the utec - because I knew some of this stuff might end up changing on my car. So, I simply took the easy way out from the get go. This is another reason why I don't like the tuning side of things, I just find it really tedious and time consuming. The Utec had served me well and I was very happy with the performance of the car even on stock angles. I only got into the Haltech because we needed something MAP based for the now-abandoned ITB's. Since that didn't work out, I was left 'stuck' with a number of things I had then changed. But, I am glad I now have the Haltech as it does open more doors.

Now that I've got an ecu where I can play with the cam timing, that will be part of what I do in the future. I don't expect any major changes in overall power or area under the curve, as these cams just don't lend themselves tremendously to such gains. But, it will be neat to see where it ends up nevertheless. I'll gladly take more power in the midrange, so long as it doesn't affect the power in the top end. Another reason I wish I had at least a revup, but oh well! Once my final tune is done I'll then need to evaluate whether or not I want to try it again with new cams (and maybe headers), or just leave things as they are. This will all depend on what #'s I end up with after the tuning. If I get what I hope, I might just say enough's enough and finally sit back and not touch it further for awhile. Who knows - I change my mind all the time on this stuff!

Good luck on your tune, and hopefully you'll get good results from further tweaks! At least you guys have the weather on your side. All I can do right now is sit in the car and make vroom vroom noises, as it's snowing once again this morning!

 

Good info here, I'll try to contribute some HR specific info when I get Osiris for myself.

 

Bumping this thread. I was trying to adjust my cam timing via osiris last night and its under a table called static values and its all grey and wont let me edit the values. I see you guys can adjust them. Why cant I? Is it not available for the HR model yet?

 

Ron - you need the Race Beta software to manipulate cam angles on the AP as I recall. You can download it here

http://cobbtuning.com/products/?id=4590

 

No i did it on the Cobb. I sold that a few weeks ago. Sorry I should have been more specific I'm running uprev now.

 

Well it has been a year on my custom cam tune, and my um engine is still runs great. Shift at 8000. No knocking or anything, no more oil consumption, uh yea to all you people who said it would blow up what ever. Nothing like the sound of a vq at 8000 rpms through ebay long tube headers and a fast intentions exhaust with no resonator haha. BTW the ebay long tubes have been on the car for around 2 years now and they have not broke.

 

The idiot that made the blow up comments has long been banned. Im waiting for uprev to unlock cam timing on my ecu, along with a few other features. Kind of annoying waiting for **** that should be working. And now jared is on vacation.

 

Not sure if it is working on the hr. One reason i picked the revup is because of the ability to adjust both cams. Once someone told me it would make no more power and my pistons would hit the valves. Still has not happend. One day ill dyno it again.

 

A bit off topic but about how much does upRev software cost?

 

depends on the version

one version you mail the ecu to them, they flash and mail back (1 time) - and costs $300.00

the second is done by the end user, or his tuner, but with the email aid of Uprev (basically you're logging, emailing, etc) - you get 3 tunes with it and costs $500

the third is fully end user tunable, by the user or his tuner, unlimited tuning use and is $700