Rampant

Audi dropped something like 200# on the TT (to 3218) and kept the price within $1k of the outgoing model. Man, would I be happy with that!

Also, the Z (3400) is heavier than the Mustang GT (3356), so yeah, I would say it is heavy for its size.

VandyZ

iTrader: (2)

On corner scales my enthusiast weighed 3188 in track prep (no spare,mats) and 1/2 tank of gas. After some removal of some other things and my Ti exhaust i am very close to 3100 now. I think that is a great weight to have for the next gen.

Rampant

^ Nice. What year? The Z gained roughly 150# in '06 (3217 to 3370). I just hope it goes the other way in '09. I would be ecstatic if it was 3100#, but doubt it will get that low.

inTgr8r

iTrader: (1)

....I've got a feeling that Nissan has a nice surprise for us (fingers crossed)

VandyZ

iTrader: (2)

2003

BJX

350ZX? 370Z? 370ZX? 400Z? 450/480ZX?

/tinfoil hat

RBull

+1.

RBull

I agree with what you're saying. In particular your last statement makes a lot of sense and one I hope Nissan sees as well.

Lawy'dU

iTrader: (1)

here we go again. Why do people keep bringing up the vette, much less the Z06. It's not even in the same category. Your numbers don't seem to be correct either.

http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtest...z06-page4.html

p.s. they didn't do a standing 0-60 run, but for some reason road and track is giving completely different numbers for this car. There may be some fudging going on here lol

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ecs_price.html

The 7 liter v8 is absolutely not lighter. The funny part about all of this is that no chevy or ford could never make a motor even close to what Nissan has ever made. If Nissan (granted all speculation) was specializing in big V8's I'm sure they wouldn't need 7 liters to get 500 hp lol. The 3.7 liter tt (rumored) will make near 500 and that's with half the internal displacement of the z06 motor, and that's only talking about Nissan lol. Maybe fanboys should stick to the topic at hand rather than going on tangents about completely different things.

Lawy'dU

iTrader: (1)

mine as well. The older GT-R's weren't allowed in the European circuit because frankly, their traction control and AWD systems outclassed everything. The GT-R has always been the flagship of Nissan, so I wouldn't worry about that.

RBull

Perhaps you missed the 0-60's in the mags. 3.6 and 3.5

I think quadcam was referring to the car being lighter and not the engine itself. Z06 is 3147 lbs.

Rampant

First of all, the GT-R motor is expected to make 450hp -- not 500. But, even if it did, it sounds like you are being every bit the fanboy you are claiming others to be.

Saying Chevy needs 7L to get 500 hp is just like saying Nissan needs forced induction to get 500hp, or BMW needs 10 cylinders. Different engines, different power delivery methods, different maintenance issues. Lets compare apples to apples please.

If you want to compare only displacement size, how do you explain the 5.6 Nissan has in the QX56 has only 320hp/393tq, while the smaller, blown 5.4L Ford has in the GT500 puts out 500hp/480tq? By your rationale, the Ford trounces the Nissan with a smaller engine.

The closest I know of to compare an NA V8 from Nissan and a Vette motor is the LS2 (6L, 400hp/400tq) and the 5.6 (320hp, 393tq). That is a considerable hp advantage to the Chevy (125%) with only a 0.4 bump in displacement (107%). Also, Ford's NA 5.4 (in truck form to be fair) puts out 300hp/365tq. Very similar numbers to Nissan's, considering the 0.2L deficit.

Also to the weight issue, it just brings up the point that Chevy can build a lighter (by 200#, mind you) car with a heavier engine (a Vette, in any trim, is lighter than the Z). Heck, Audi can build a lighter AWD V6 (again, by 200#).

Now, I love Nissan as much as the next guy here, but you have to respect what other manufacturers are doing as well. The Z06 is the greatest performing sports car for the money. Period. (Look at what it beat in C&D's lightning lap). I still probably wouldn't buy one, but at least I can appreciate it for what it is.

If the GT-R comes in under the ZO6's price and can beat it, I will gladly be able to change that statement. Until then, the Z06 is the king of the hill (for performance and value).

SnakeBitten

iTrader: (8)

Anyone that thinks teh GTR is deffinately going to beat the Z06 is not dealing in reality...The GTR has something to prove not the Z06.....For the GTR to compete with the Z06 its going to have to come in at a much lower weight then the 3500+ Im seeing being quoted and have more than 500hp...You fanboys will be butthurt when reality hits you in the azz......450hp and 3500lbs+ weight is not going to come close to beating a Z06...The Z06 is that bad....

The GTR was benchmarked on the Porsche 997 911 TT which the Z06 absolutely cremated along with the GT3[which is faster than the 911 tt] in the latest C&D test.....What do you think will happen to any car that was designed to run with this Porsche???Not rocket science...If Im wrong Ill make a thread saying I was wrong.... But physics dont lie......A heavier car with less power cannot beat a lighter car assuming both are well sorted suspension-wise and have competant drivers...

kalima275Z

iTrader: (4)

I'll second that.

VandyZ

iTrader: (2)

Yeah I think the only thing puts the GTR and Z06 in the same category will be their price tag.

I think the LS3 will provide the performance competition for the GTR. Its going to be a hard pill to swallow, but a techy expensive Japanese supercar will still have to answer to cheap American power, just like the Germans and Italians do.

I have said it before, Nissan is not trying to set the bar here. They are merely playing catch up in the grand scheme of things. I am excited Nissan is stepping up to the plate, but i am also realistic as to my expectations.

Rampant

I think it depends on how badly Nissan wants to be known as a performance car contender. Badly enough, the GT-R should be close to these Nurburgring times:

7:40 -Porsche 997 Turbo
7:42.9 - Corvette Z06
7:48 - Porsche 997 GT3
7:52 - Ford GT
7:56 - Porsche 996 Turbo
(source)

If so, that could (should) also mean that Nissan will make the Z more focused and a better performer as well. And, that will be good news for all of us who won't be able to afford the GT-R.

I am looking at the GT-R to see what the next Z could be like. If the GT-R is a real performer, than the Z could/should be a more focused track weapon. If the GT-R is good, but not great, the Z might become another G37 -- huge weight gain to become a luxury cruiser that appeals to a wider audience. And, that would be a big disappointment for me.

However, I still am holding out hope that Nissan wants to distance the Z and G cousins.

SnakeBitten

iTrader: (8)

Thing is I think alot of people on here are setting themselves up for disappointment by thinking the GTR is going to dominate supercars....Its not and I dont think Nissan is concerned with brute power or straightline acceleration....They are more concerned with beating Porsche around a circuit as was stated when the R34 came out.....Its going to be a GT car moreso than an allout sportscar like the Z06.....Nothing wrong with that....Its going to be a great performer even if it cant beat the Vette or Viper or Ford GT or any other top dog American car that EVERY supercar mfg has to worry about......The weight alone should tell you Nissan isnt focused on all out performance......