View Poll Results: Should I explain how the DPS system works?
Yes, I wanna know if this is worth it.
104
73.24%
No, Don't risk it man, it's not worth getting sued over.
6
4.23%
Who gives a crap, I wasn't gonna buy it anyways.
32
22.54%
Voters: 142. You may not vote on this poll
Final report on my testing of the Direct Power System
11-22-2003, 12:16 PM
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Final report on my testing of the Direct Power System
OK, so I believe I have completed testing of the Direct Power System (DPS) manufactured by K&G of Japan.
I'm sure you're all eagerly awaiting the results.
Thursday I installed the DPS on my Nissan 350Z. My engine mods are:
Procharger Supercharger @ 7PSI
Grounding Kit
Wideband O2 Sensor
Borla True Dual Exhaust
Today I installed the DPS on Zand02Max's car. His engine mods are as follows:
K&N Air filter
Pyle 3 Farad Capacitor
Optima Yellow Top Battery
1) Voltage measurements at the + post on the battery with the engine running with and without the DPS.
Voltages remained constant with no discernable change.
2) Next I tested with a Fluke brand portable Oscilloscope to measure frequency variations with the engine running with and without the DPS.
There was no noticeable difference noted on oscilloscope
3) Test drove the car 5 minutes without and approx 45 minutes total with the DPS.
No noticeable change in acceleration, idle or smoothness during the test drive.
4) I repeated these tests on my car without the supercharger belt connected.
Results were the same.
5) Next, I completed the same tests on zand02max's car.
Results were the same.
The next thing I did was hook up my 13.8V 20W variable voltage power supply. I took measurements at 10V 12V 13V and 13.5V with an oscilloscope and a multimeter.
6) Measured 10V with and without DPS unit.
No load was put on the power supply, no voltage change, no frequncy changes noted.
6) Same test @ 12V
Same results
7) Same test @ 13V
Same results
8) Same test @ 13.5V
Same results
So as you can see my results were inconclusive. I was not able to detect the DPS doing much of anything.
At this point I was frustrated. WTH is going on!?! Surely this box must do something, I mean it costs $250 plus shipping. I wanted to open the box up so I could trace out the circuit so I could know what I should be testing for.
Screw it, I opened the box up.
First barrier: The lid was securely epoxied in place. So I took a small drill and drilled holes at strategic points and was careful not to damage any circuitry inside by pushing the drill in to far. Finally pried the lid off and I saw my next barrier. 5 minutes work
Second barrier: When I opened the box, I found the box was filled with what looked like an opaque beige fiberglass resin. I chipped through that to come to my next barrier. 10 minutes work
Third barrier: Obviously they don't want me looking in this thing. Next barrier was easier, but I couldn't figure out why it was there. I'll come back to that later. Beneath the resin there was what looked like a mass of metal tape. Sure enough I found the electronics were double wrapped in metal foil tape. I removed that. 1 minute work.
I don't know if I should give away the secret to the DPS system and what it actually does.
So, here is my poll. Should I post pictures and a circuit description of the DPS system electronics and potentially open myself up to lawsuits because of their "International Patent"
Yes, I wanna know if this is worth it.
No, Don't risk it man, it's not worth getting sued over.
Who gives a crap, I wasn't gonna buy it anyways.
I'll let the poll run for a while and when I see there is a measurable response to this poll, I will decide whether I should do it or not.
Edit: BTW, I can tell you conclusively what this thing does thanks to a years worth of electronics training courtesy of the US Army.
I'm sure you're all eagerly awaiting the results.
Thursday I installed the DPS on my Nissan 350Z. My engine mods are:
Procharger Supercharger @ 7PSI
Grounding Kit
Wideband O2 Sensor
Borla True Dual Exhaust
Today I installed the DPS on Zand02Max's car. His engine mods are as follows:
K&N Air filter
Pyle 3 Farad Capacitor
Optima Yellow Top Battery
1) Voltage measurements at the + post on the battery with the engine running with and without the DPS.
Voltages remained constant with no discernable change.
2) Next I tested with a Fluke brand portable Oscilloscope to measure frequency variations with the engine running with and without the DPS.
There was no noticeable difference noted on oscilloscope
3) Test drove the car 5 minutes without and approx 45 minutes total with the DPS.
No noticeable change in acceleration, idle or smoothness during the test drive.
4) I repeated these tests on my car without the supercharger belt connected.
Results were the same.
5) Next, I completed the same tests on zand02max's car.
Results were the same.
The next thing I did was hook up my 13.8V 20W variable voltage power supply. I took measurements at 10V 12V 13V and 13.5V with an oscilloscope and a multimeter.
6) Measured 10V with and without DPS unit.
No load was put on the power supply, no voltage change, no frequncy changes noted.
6) Same test @ 12V
Same results
7) Same test @ 13V
Same results
8) Same test @ 13.5V
Same results
So as you can see my results were inconclusive. I was not able to detect the DPS doing much of anything.
At this point I was frustrated. WTH is going on!?! Surely this box must do something, I mean it costs $250 plus shipping. I wanted to open the box up so I could trace out the circuit so I could know what I should be testing for.
Screw it, I opened the box up.
First barrier: The lid was securely epoxied in place. So I took a small drill and drilled holes at strategic points and was careful not to damage any circuitry inside by pushing the drill in to far. Finally pried the lid off and I saw my next barrier. 5 minutes work
Second barrier: When I opened the box, I found the box was filled with what looked like an opaque beige fiberglass resin. I chipped through that to come to my next barrier. 10 minutes work
Third barrier: Obviously they don't want me looking in this thing.
Next barrier was easier, but I couldn't figure out why it was there. I'll come back to that later. Beneath the resin there was what looked like a mass of metal tape. Sure enough I found the electronics were double wrapped in metal foil tape. I removed that. 1 minute work.I don't know if I should give away the secret to the DPS system and what it actually does.
So, here is my poll.
Should I post pictures and a circuit description of the DPS system electronics and potentially open myself up to lawsuits because of their "International Patent"Yes, I wanna know if this is worth it.
No, Don't risk it man, it's not worth getting sued over.
Who gives a crap, I wasn't gonna buy it anyways.
I'll let the poll run for a while and when I see there is a measurable response to this poll, I will decide whether I should do it or not.
Edit: BTW, I can tell you conclusively what this thing does thanks to a years worth of electronics training courtesy of the US Army.
Last edited by jesseenglish; 11-22-2003 at 12:24 PM.
11-22-2003, 12:23 PM
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In case you haven't been paying attention, here is the thread that prompted this test.
https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....128#post542128
https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....128#post542128
11-22-2003, 12:27 PM
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You are not breaking any laws by showing what is inside the box. In fact, you can dig up the patent papers and it should show you the actual schematic, and it's intended purpose.
Just because something is pattented, DOES NOT mean it actually does what it says it does. There is no independent testing invloved in registering a patent.
SHOW US WHAT IS INSIDE!
Just because something is pattented, DOES NOT mean it actually does what it says it does. There is no independent testing invloved in registering a patent.
SHOW US WHAT IS INSIDE!
11-22-2003, 12:31 PM
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I was thinking the same thing, in my opinion this appears to be one big SCAM, however it is up to Jesse if he wants to post pics.
I am thinking we need to move this over to the OWNED thread.
I am thinking we need to move this over to the OWNED thread.
11-22-2003, 01:10 PM
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ZedZed is correct. Once a product is on the open market it becomes fair game to all to poke, prod, dissect and discuss. A patent publishes the purported novelty into the public domain and puts potential copycats on notice that they can not legally copy and sell. Here's a link to the schematic in the patent. If this link doesn't work go to the uspto and do a search on pat #6,052,297 and click on the images.
http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...y=6543C7E9E788
http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...y=6543C7E9E788
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11-22-2003, 01:12 PM
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The link didn't fully copy. This one will get you to the patent search website.
http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/srchnum.htm
http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/srchnum.htm
11-22-2003, 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by boyze
ZedZed is correct. Once a product is on the open market it becomes fair game to all to poke, prod, dissect and discuss. A patent publishes the purported novelty into the public domain and puts potential copycats on notice that they can not legally copy and sell. Here's a link to the schematic in the patent. If this link doesn't work go to the uspto and do a search on pat #6,052,297 and click on the images.
http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...y=6543C7E9E788
ZedZed is correct. Once a product is on the open market it becomes fair game to all to poke, prod, dissect and discuss. A patent publishes the purported novelty into the public domain and puts potential copycats on notice that they can not legally copy and sell. Here's a link to the schematic in the patent. If this link doesn't work go to the uspto and do a search on pat #6,052,297 and click on the images.
http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...y=6543C7E9E788
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/6,052,297
11-22-2003, 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by spazpilot
jesseenglish:
Please tell me you did not pay for this thing? I am will to bet it is a grounding box. which like you proved does nothing..
jesseenglish:
Please tell me you did not pay for this thing?
I am will to bet it is a grounding box. which like you proved does nothing..
Jesse
11-22-2003, 01:36 PM
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The two ground wires are electrically connected to each other.
The positive wire is electrically connected to nothing except to itself and a small automotive fuse.
I found that the DPS or Direct Power System does absolutely nothing.
IT IS A $250 SCAM Save your money, a grounding kit will do more than this will do.
Oh and here's a picture of the high tech electronics.
The positive wire is electrically connected to nothing except to itself and a small automotive fuse.
I found that the DPS or Direct Power System does absolutely nothing.
IT IS A $250 SCAM Save your money, a grounding kit will do more than this will do.
Oh and here's a picture of the high tech electronics.
11-22-2003, 01:44 PM
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They basically were hoping no one would tear this thing apart and if they did they tried to make it difficult to get into
The foil tape was obviously to make it so you couldn't X-ray this device
The epoxy was used to make it difficult to get into the "electronics"
What a joke. Someone needs to let Igor know that K&G is ripping people off. I did my part. Time to get the word out people.
Zand02Max, EnthuZiast, I know that's what you're good at so go sick 'em boyz!!
The foil tape was obviously to make it so you couldn't X-ray this device
The epoxy was used to make it difficult to get into the "electronics"
What a joke. Someone needs to let Igor know that K&G is ripping people off. I did my part. Time to get the word out people.
Zand02Max, EnthuZiast, I know that's what you're good at so go sick 'em boyz!!
11-22-2003, 01:48 PM
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I wonder if we can get an answer from Igor?
"First off, not kissing ***, just stating facts as they are.
Second, that's your opinion that you have built from your expertise and I respect that.
You say "It's good that you offer a moneyback guarantee, but the thing is that most people will notice a difference. Simply because their brain doesn't want to comprehend the fact that they just paid $250 for a shiny silver box that does nothing more than a grounding kit would do."
However, certainly you are not one of these gullible people and you will not be fooled. Why not try it out personally without a financial risk to you before so confidently stating that this is a scam?
igor@af
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Okay, I am done post whoring, I'll give other folks a chance to voice their own opinion. I think this is about as classic to being owned as you can imagine.
"First off, not kissing ***, just stating facts as they are.
Second, that's your opinion that you have built from your expertise and I respect that.
You say "It's good that you offer a moneyback guarantee, but the thing is that most people will notice a difference. Simply because their brain doesn't want to comprehend the fact that they just paid $250 for a shiny silver box that does nothing more than a grounding kit would do."
However, certainly you are not one of these gullible people and you will not be fooled. Why not try it out personally without a financial risk to you before so confidently stating that this is a scam?
igor@af
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Lexington, KY
Posts: 72" End Quote
Okay, I am done post whoring, I'll give other folks a chance to voice their own opinion. I think this is about as classic to being owned as you can imagine.
11-22-2003, 01:51 PM
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I don't think Igor knows that this is a scam to be quite honest. He seemed pretty straightforward on the phone and honestly seemed to want to how it worked. I told him I wouldn't make any promises and that I'd pull no punches if I found out it was fake.