ZON

iTrader: (2)

Guys I'm not FI'd but the shop that has done my mods has done a **** load of APS kit's. Not to start another APS vs. whoever thing but my point is the shop has a great dyno and technician and their has been no engine failures to date in any of the FI 350Z's they have done. Every one of them tuned thru a piggy back on the load dyno. One of them is a TT on a stock block putting out 550 whp. Westpack is right and it is also my belief that flashed ECU's are bogus. I think that the stock block 550 whp TT is running on borrowed time but I also think that FI'd Z's with just flashes are going to have failures all too often. Not all of them but FI companies that don't supply real tuning capability and rely on a stupid flash just to keep kit cost down is going to cost many of their customers dearly in the long run.

Trefling, you said it best, "it's the state of tune". I want to say I think the TN kit is pretty sweet and I wish I had one. The great thing is I already have a Unichip intalled. Heck all I need now is a ST kit and I can even still use my Nismo headers. This should not turn into a "the turbo kit sucks" thread because it doesn't suck, but the business plan is lacking some and will cost an unsuspecting few a good motor. But it should be a make sure you tune it right thread. I guess that is where its ending up already though. Sorry for the rant.

Peace guys but TUNE YOUR FCKING FI THE RIGHT WAY for now on, jeez!!!

solidsnake

iTrader: (14)

I just put on a single exhaust on my car with the kit and reflash. Cas has been running fine but now that I read this I will have it dynoed soon. Do I have to get a wideband? Can I just get the emanage ultimate? The emanage isnt cheap one bit so will it improve my performance at all? Sorry about the motor guy. Best of luck with whatever car you get next.

captj3

iTrader: (1)

I said that because it was implied earlier in the thread. We have to see what Tn will do about it something like that. I don't think any company would cover the engine. But I would be real surprized if they did.

blk180sx

iTrader: (2)

Let me first say that it really painful for me to read about your situation. My statement earlier did not imply that Turbonetics would cover an engine. I just ask him to give me a call so we could discuss over the phone what exactly happened.

Now to issue about the reflash. I can honestly tell you that we own one 350 and one g35 with the flash and we haven't had any issues. There is also a great deal of our kits on the road with no issues. To the best of my knowledge all cases of over boosting has been from the result of using a aftermarket exhaust. When the kit was first R&D there was no way that we could test our kit with all of the exhaust on the market for the z/g. With that said I get countless call everyday of people asking me can the use "xyz" exhaust with our kit. My answer is always the same. The kit and tune was designed around using the stock exhaust.

down_shift

iTrader: (12)

Exhaust play a HUGE role. Especially on f/i cars. Turbo cars are react alot more to simple mods such as bolt ons.. Look at the EVO's/STi's... ~3000 worth of bolt ons and they can keep up with the holy APS/Greddy Tune Monsters we have here...

down_shift

iTrader: (12)

I had a speculation after Jet's 3" Topspeed exhaust that something maybe up with running a bigger exhaust..

Jet's going the smart route and picking up EM to correct whatever issues the 3" is going to give him.

After this guy, I think it would be safe for me to say that TN cars should run close to stock diamater on exhausts (if you're relying on the reflash).. Time to pick up a 2.75 diameter exhaust..

Zivman

iTrader: (19)

awesome^^^^

.

350zbiturbo- man this does suck, and maybe by the slim chance, TN will help you out. Any FI is a gamble

Most everything else I would have cared to say has been said.

captj3

iTrader: (1)

Thanks zivman

Gumpdriver

iTrader: (5)

Sorry for being in on this so late, So the guy blew his motor using the T-Netics single turbo with out a piggy back EU or some kind of new EMU. All he was using was the T-netices EMU correct? My question is why, through being on the site why would you just run a stock Reflash without some kinda aftremarket EMU?

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

This is the best response yet..

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

It amazes me that anyone would install FI without at least wideband and boost gauges. Two gauges and a little knowledge could have saved this motor.

I don't understand how you can say that you are so pissed at what TN would say if you called...if you don't call you will never know and can hardly be pissed.

I'd suggest everyone planning on FI get a little education on FI before installing anything.

down_shift

iTrader: (12)

+1 Completely agree Dave

westpak

iTrader: (19)

Yeah great response for TN as it leaves them of the hoom

He did have boost and AF gauges, he has a right to be pissed TN has not made it clear enough what the safe parameters are with the kit and people buy something thinking it has been researched, this is just the same bashing of a kit that will happne like it did with ATI and Greddy because of what they lacked, I don't see anyone losing motors because of mods done with the APS kits, they did their research instead of letting unsuspecting consumers find out for themselves.

Peking

iTrader: (2)

Agreed also with MIA, great post. It seems that to many people expect others to watch out for every little thing they do. I wouldn't have gotten my car boosted or anything else without knowing ahead of time the possible risks... As I remember someone posting here a long time ago, that if you do such a major modification then you should be prepared to buy a new motor


To me I see what you are saying and agree... Sorta to a extent, other than if someone was going to get boosted they need to learn all they can before doing so... And to me from that it is common basic knowledge to be weary of overboosting without proper fuel/etc.

Also there are many of us with aftermarket exhausts and did not encounter the same problems. Just as well folks who can live with the flash and those who could not.

From day one running lean on the flash has been a discussion (with plenum swaps, and what not). Also coming from Honda's were there are set-ups with flash programs along with folks having alot of other modifications (like bigger flowing exhausts), having no serious issues with it so it can and does work.

Anywho there is alot covered by the disclaimers provided with the kit. As most things now a days.

westpak

iTrader: (19)

Yes I agree people should learn about what they are doing but some just don't have the understanding or knowledge to know so they rely on a manufacturer to have designed a kit they can trust.

Peking

iTrader: (2)

Yes, and good point... Not all are aware to better educate themselves before making such choices.

Which is why I do believe there is something covering that in the Turbonetics disclaimers (most likely of course nothing that specific on aftermarket exhaust but something along the lines of other modifications)... To bad I can't go check, since I also trashed them after briefly looking at it

Zexy

iTrader: (55)

From the thread i have read people are detonating because of boost spike? Have i read wrong? I have also seen some threads stating A/F is dead on the sweet spot with the flash. It may also be a timing issue. That's why in MY opinion it's not A/F related. In the end i may be missing out on something or i may be wrong. Damn, you are a man of little/no patience and very stuck up.

BTW: i wouldn't let Japtrix touch my ****. Sorry if this offends you.

westpak

iTrader: (19)

Well it does offend me because your statements are ignorant, the problem is that when the boost spikes the car will run lean because the ECU cannot know it is running higher in boost becuase the ECU doesn have an input for boost plus the MAF is probably maxed out at that point, so it does not add more fuel hence LEAN, learn something while you are reading and comprehend before opening your mouth and spewing ignorance. And based on this situation you wouldn't let Japtrix touch your car?? People are coming from all over Florida to have their cars worked there and many happy customers, even this owner has no problems with Japtrix because he understand they did not do anything wrong.

SO before you go around accusing or putting a shop down know what you are talking about so you don't look stupid.

35ounces

iTrader: (5)

I was not aware that he had gauges...sounded like he did not. But if he did have boost and wideband gauges then maybe watching them after an exhaust install and taking it easy when seeing higher boost and lean conditions would have helped. I am certainly sorry for his blown motor though. That sucks. Again though there was a lot of info on the boards about this.
As I understand it, the ECU flash works fine with 99.9% of the cars. Its a reasonable approach as long as the consumer understands the limits and that major changes will render the flash useless. For some reason with this kit and free flowing exhausts, boost can spike and cause a lean condition.
Has anyone checked his motor out to see if it was caused by a lean condition?

prescience

Surely, it would be reasonable for any aftermarket kit to have a small safety margin (I would expect a known aftermarket exhaust or known plenum etc to be within that category) / engineering tolerance or to state that it was only to be used with stock equipment.

Having said that, any car will be manufactured within an engineering tolerance so relying on a reflash whilst pushing the extreme of that tolerance would be asking for trouble without a 'belt and braces' tune

I feel real sorry for the guy in all of this