sentry65

iTrader: (11)

timeslips don't make a car faster than it is

I'll get around to it someday here, but I'm not going to be running drag radials. Just my normal tires. I'm not going to buy some drag radials and wheels just to satisfy 4 or so people online.

besides, it'd be my first time to the drag strip in this car. I already know you don't think I'll approach your best ever time.
https://my350z.com/forum/drag/138139-my-aps-tt-z-s-first-trip-to-the-track-11s-inside.html
your first time out in your TT you ran 12.037@117.28mph then later ran a 11.958@118.52mph. Then after going to the track a few times and going when it's cold you ran your best time of 11.536@120.80 mph on slicks

so now you hold your best time over my head daring me to try to approach it...
I'm not all that great at launching. I obviously don't go to the drag strip very often. It's just not my thing. Lately drifting has been the most fun I've ever had in my car
So do I think I'll approach your time? Probably not, but the trap speed might be reasonably decent despite the 1250 ft elevation here...
what is the elevation at the strip you go to btw? 580ft? At 70 degrees, that's around 5.5% denser air at that elevation vs 1250. Crap there goes my ricer math again. Nevermind, elevation means nothing in drag racing...

I didn't really build the car to be the 1/4 mile god and I didn't build it to get respect from people on the forums.
"I race for respect" is sorta fast n furious isn't it?

doug

iTrader: (5)

someone has been hanging out with too many jamaicans

taurran

iTrader: (18)

Sentry, you may be proud of your setup and all, as you should be. But...

You can't argue that a supercharged Z will be faster than a turbocharged Z of the same peak hp levels. That's just ludicrous. There's nothing like being at full boost by 3500 rpms as opposed to just hitting it as you shift at redline.

Turbochargers and superchargers both have ups and downs. Turbos may have slight lag on a proper setup, but are capable of monstrous midrange and top end power. Roots blowers make instant power, but unfortunately are still inefficient due to being belt driven from the crank shaft.

Unfortunately centrifugal blowers have the downsides of BOTH the other setups, meaning "lag" by not making peak boost until redline, and also suffering from parasitic inefficiencies due to being belt driven. I'm not saying that a centrifugal supercharged setup cannot make great power, but it will never be as "fast" as another setup of equivalent numbers.


Oh, and too bad stillen refuses to sell a larger roots blower with their kit. If the present one wasn't puny and undersized, we'd probably see some very impressive (but ugly) supercharged Z's.


note - I don't know if these points have been previously brought up as I haven't read the whole thread...

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

Sentry just run your car. If you run a 12.4 with a 2.4 60ft we know there is a ton left in that set-up. I wouldnt expect 11's from you, but I do expect traps approaching 120mph for a car of your power and weight, even if it is your first time out. Go out to the drag strip, stop making excuses in your head, like the altitude which isnt that bad, and just do it! Post about the results regardless of how you do. Thats it, no more "if XXX person can do it with less power, I can too..." BS

race4it

iTrader: (1)

I have both an ATI Procharged Z and a Power Enterprise TT Z. Both cars have built motors, return fuel systems, about 14lbs of boost, etc. In my experience though, the TT car has less maintenance, produces more horsepower and torque faster, and just feels like a faster car. It takes torque to turn the blower and you can tell.

The biggest problem I have with the supercharged car is the belt system. Even though we've had custom pulleys and belts made (wider and stronger materials) we still break belts (especially in the summer when things get real hot under the hood).

That being said, I still enjoy the SC car just as much. Even though it may not have the power of the TT, it's still very fast and you can't beat the sound of the blower. It sounds just like a jet plane taking off.

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

You just ruined Sentry's day Nice set-ups you have there, arent you the guy with the 75 shot on the ATI set-up?

maximumsportZ

iTrader: (25)

Good points covered in this thread. I'm also curious in what sentry would trap on his setup.

BTW, I love the sound of my turbo spool up and my HKS SSQV BOV.

Jay'Z

iTrader: (118)

Cmon, what are you trying to do egg me on, this is not 5th Grade..... do a search since you care so much on down playing SC's.. **** Yo Couch!!

https://my350z.com/forum/drag/233840-top-25-1-4-mile-times-for-tt-st-supercharger-nitrous-bolt-ons-stock.html

^This thread shows some posted SC times.. I dont care to search for you..

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

Fastest S/C Ive heard of isnt on that list. Stock autouto. 7psi 1.9 60ft, ran 12.3X @ 112.9mph. Well, on that list it may tie 1st place.

BriGuyMax

iTrader: (4)

Nice play on words...the 12.0 and 11.9 happened on the SAME day. The 12.03 was my first pass EVER in the car with the turbos on it and that was hot off the highway and wasn't even a clean pass (nailed the rev limiter in second). I'd like to see you duplicate that your first time out.

Stop making excuses. Track elevation where I run is around 700ft MSL.

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

thing is I don't believe my car and the other cars have the same peak whp though. I think my peak whp is actually higher now that I'm getting my full 12 psi. That and we're comparing their higher reading dynojet dyno at lower elevation to my lower reading dynodynamics dyno at higher elevation

If I could run on their exact dyno at their locatoin, with my full 12 psi, I actually think I'd run around something more like 470-480whp

as far as Doug's dyno, I've pointed out something is odd about his dyno to read as high as it is when everyone else's TT dyno I've ever seen on a dynodynamics dyno is nowhere near those tq numbers. He hasn't been able to provide any details about that dyno or the correction factor used, but the numbers are suspicious compared to the TT cars that have dynoed at the shop I dyno at

the parasitic losses of a centrifugal are not as high as they are on a roots blower

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

so can we agree that my track is handicapped compared to your track to SOME degree due to elevation??

call it an excuse if you want, but this is something that can't really be argued, there's less oxygen here than where you run

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

we've been over this before, but just to recap
he was running an automatic Z with the ATI procharger @ 7 psi = 359.1 whp on a dynojet at low elevation tuned at AAM

I'm running a manual Z with 12 psi on a vortech at way higher whp at higher elevation on a dynodynamics dyno.


the guys on that 1/4 mile list have nice setups, but I'm fairly sure I'm running a little more power



I agree, I need to get to the track sometime

doug

iTrader: (5)

why bother... you will either add correction to your times or you will use the elevation as an excuse.. and we will just be back to square one.

let me ask you something.. are you a lawyer? because you sure as hell have a 2 page answer for everything.

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

you can't really add correction to a 1/4 mile time and I won't even attempt to

I'd just like people to understand the track here is at a handicap compared to the tracks with lower elevation that generally seem to have faster times - that's all. Drag racers are supposed to be aware of things like that and why every track knows the exact elevation of their location

I have a friend who goes to the 1/4 mile a lot. He thinks I'll trap somewhere around 116-118 on the track here and that's pretty much what I've thought as well, but we'll see.

I'll try to get down to the track sometime in the next few weeks, that's all I can say. I can't offer anything more than that

taurran

iTrader: (18)

Enough with the correction BS here. It has nothing to do with this debate. We're comparing the qualities of the types of setups, not your individual cars. None of this will change the fact that turbocharged setups are more efficient, have a better powerband, and will overall be "faster" at the same boost levels.

I can't believe this is even being argued.

Enron Exec

Wow... uh ok

Ive had an ATI SC on the 7lb pulley and the APS TT on whatever the stock boost was on low compression pistons.

Hands down, the TT is quicker and faster in a straight line with all other things being equal.

Please, for the sake of all the kiddies d/l **** and pirated content, end this thread and save some bandwidth!

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

I agree with you man

if we're comparing 8 psi SC vs 8psi turbo, then yes turbo wins with no contest. The turbo is more efficient and spools up sooner

I don't know how many times I've said that - that the turbo will always win in that comparison

Other people started comparing my car to theirs and this started another debate along the lines of:
"can a SC car EVER go faster than a turbo car in any shape or form, no matter what the whp differences are"


again...I am in agreement with you

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

ok well this is the closest thing to an accurate dyno comparison I can find right now comparing MY CAR @10 psi to a car with a APS ST on the same dyno, though not on the same day.

I don't know much about the APS ST car's setup. I forget who's car this is, but I think I remember them having an exhaust, high flow cats, and plenum, tuned on stock PSI, but could be wrong


again, my vortech dyno being shown here is set up to run 12 psi, but the belt started slipping once it reached 10.2 psi at 5400 rpms, then dropped to 10 psi from 5500 rpms to redline. So 5400 rpms and earlier I consider to 100% represent my car's current state

doug

iTrader: (5)

who's dyno is that? thats not a true 10 PSI APS TT Dyno