Jeremy Tibbs
06-06-2009, 01:05 PM
#501
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Off topic: Sorry, maybe I am a forum noob but how and where the hell are some of these tags coming from? What does this thread have to do with carbon, fiber, harrisburg, or wrapping?
i was wondering the same
06-06-2009, 01:15 PM
#503
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not all of them. There are more issues I haven't brought up, and have even already brought to light.
Hell, I remember even YOU got mad when your car sat there for only 3 months not getting much done. You had to jump through hoops to prod him into getting it finished, and I think he had more at stake in your car because you wanted to go into business with him. You were not the normal customer and even you got the runaround.
You're GREATLY underestimating the "time" it takes for a project shop car. Does your "time" include sitting in the corner for months on end, with a dead battery, collecting dust, with flat tires? All of these cars in question were sitting there for that long.
It took him almost a year to assemble Shane's motor (which was already built by GTM), modify some headers with flanges, and bolt it and the turbo kit on the car. That is definitely the worst case but my own car was just sitting there untouched for months at a time as well.
You've never been in a situation when your car was being held by a shop and you can't reallt do much about it, so I can't expect you to identify. But don't make light of the situation and try to play it off as "normal" project time. That's ********.
Hell, I remember even YOU got mad when your car sat there for only 3 months not getting much done. You had to jump through hoops to prod him into getting it finished, and I think he had more at stake in your car because you wanted to go into business with him. You were not the normal customer and even you got the runaround.
You're GREATLY underestimating the "time" it takes for a project shop car. Does your "time" include sitting in the corner for months on end, with a dead battery, collecting dust, with flat tires? All of these cars in question were sitting there for that long.
It took him almost a year to assemble Shane's motor (which was already built by GTM), modify some headers with flanges, and bolt it and the turbo kit on the car. That is definitely the worst case but my own car was just sitting there untouched for months at a time as well.
You've never been in a situation when your car was being held by a shop and you can't reallt do much about it, so I can't expect you to identify. But don't make light of the situation and try to play it off as "normal" project time. That's ********.
I certainly understand your position on YOUR car and it was definitely a nightmare for you. I have no idea what your financial arrangement/hook ups were with JT other than you traded your time to do his web site for maybe some money you owed him. And one of/project cars do take sometimes up to a couple years if the customer doesn't have the money to finish them.
06-06-2009, 01:19 PM
#504
Wow....this has become quite the witch hunt.....even bringing old ghosts (taurran) back into the light.
from the first 18 pages of thes thread......I just don't get why everyone is so interested in the JT/AAM timeline of events? Jeremy left....end of story!
And as far as all the PF angst that is coming out of the woodwork, I find it shocking that people start jumping in all at once. It is like watching someone getting kicked while they are on the ground.....just looking for an easy way to get a cheap shot in!
All these guys with the project cars that got put ont he back burner at PF..........you knew what you were getting into. You wanted a special, custom car but you didn't want to pay squat for it! Jeremy was your means to an end, and you were his means to making a name for his shop. Those relationships/builds were born with big flaws...right from the start. maybe it is just time and maturity, but you eventually learn that you always get what you pay for. sort of a risk vs. reward situation. Both sides only saw the reward and no one really looked at the risk. Unfortunately, these situations have high risk. It is nothing more than making a a high yield/high risk investmest. You have to realize that the risk usually outweghs the reward!
I consider Jeremy a friend, and no matter what hate stories come out, it won't change my opinion. I always had easy business dealings with Jeremy. Some times, I even thought he was selling things too cheaply and I would "overpay" him for it. hell, I even sent him, as a gift, a set of aluminum AN wrenches for his toolbox just because I believed in his passion for his business.
In closing, I'd really love to these boards go back to being a great source for tech sharing. The threads recently have really been dull. I still check the FI section on a daily basis, but I rarely see anything worthy of posting. As most of you know, I mainly proivde alot of tech info/support for questions on these boards. I am not a post-***** or a drama king, just a guy with a real passion for perforance and a willingness to share my knowledge with those who need it. It is posts like this one that really turn me off to what my350z.com has become.
Here's to better times!!!
from the first 18 pages of thes thread......I just don't get why everyone is so interested in the JT/AAM timeline of events? Jeremy left....end of story!
And as far as all the PF angst that is coming out of the woodwork, I find it shocking that people start jumping in all at once. It is like watching someone getting kicked while they are on the ground.....just looking for an easy way to get a cheap shot in!
All these guys with the project cars that got put ont he back burner at PF..........you knew what you were getting into. You wanted a special, custom car but you didn't want to pay squat for it! Jeremy was your means to an end, and you were his means to making a name for his shop. Those relationships/builds were born with big flaws...right from the start. maybe it is just time and maturity, but you eventually learn that you always get what you pay for. sort of a risk vs. reward situation. Both sides only saw the reward and no one really looked at the risk. Unfortunately, these situations have high risk. It is nothing more than making a a high yield/high risk investmest. You have to realize that the risk usually outweghs the reward!
I consider Jeremy a friend, and no matter what hate stories come out, it won't change my opinion. I always had easy business dealings with Jeremy. Some times, I even thought he was selling things too cheaply and I would "overpay" him for it. hell, I even sent him, as a gift, a set of aluminum AN wrenches for his toolbox just because I believed in his passion for his business.
In closing, I'd really love to these boards go back to being a great source for tech sharing. The threads recently have really been dull. I still check the FI section on a daily basis, but I rarely see anything worthy of posting. As most of you know, I mainly proivde alot of tech info/support for questions on these boards. I am not a post-***** or a drama king, just a guy with a real passion for perforance and a willingness to share my knowledge with those who need it. It is posts like this one that really turn me off to what my350z.com has become.
Here's to better times!!!
06-06-2009, 01:35 PM
#505
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wow....this has become quite the witch hunt.....even bringing old ghosts (taurran) back into the light.
from the first 18 pages of thes thread......I just don't get why everyone is so interested in the JT/AAM timeline of events? Jeremy left....end of story!
And as far as all the PF angst that is coming out of the woodwork, I find it shocking that people start jumping in all at once. It is like watching someone getting kicked while they are on the ground.....just looking for an easy way to get a cheap shot in!
All these guys with the project cars that got put ont he back burner at PF..........you knew what you were getting into. You wanted a special, custom car but you didn't want to pay squat for it! Jeremy was your means to an end, and you were his means to making a name for his shop. Those relationships/builds were born with big flaws...right from the start. maybe it is just time and maturity, but you eventually learn that you always get what you pay for. sort of a risk vs. reward situation. Both sides only saw the reward and no one really looked at the risk. Unfortunately, these situations have high risk. It is nothing more than making a a high yield/high risk investmest. You have to realize that the risk usually outweghs the reward!
I consider Jeremy a friend, and no matter what hate stories come out, it won't change my opinion. I always had easy business dealings with Jeremy. Some times, I even thought he was selling things too cheaply and I would "overpay" him for it. hell, I even sent him, as a gift, a set of aluminum AN wrenches for his toolbox just because I believed in his passion for his business.
In closing, I'd really love to these boards go back to being a great source for tech sharing. The threads recently have really been dull. I still check the FI section on a daily basis, but I rarely see anything worthy of posting. As most of you know, I mainly proivde alot of tech info/support for questions on these boards. I am not a post-***** or a drama king, just a guy with a real passion for perforance and a willingness to share my knowledge with those who need it. It is posts like this one that really turn me off to what my350z.com has become.
Here's to better times!!!
from the first 18 pages of thes thread......I just don't get why everyone is so interested in the JT/AAM timeline of events? Jeremy left....end of story!
And as far as all the PF angst that is coming out of the woodwork, I find it shocking that people start jumping in all at once. It is like watching someone getting kicked while they are on the ground.....just looking for an easy way to get a cheap shot in!
All these guys with the project cars that got put ont he back burner at PF..........you knew what you were getting into. You wanted a special, custom car but you didn't want to pay squat for it! Jeremy was your means to an end, and you were his means to making a name for his shop. Those relationships/builds were born with big flaws...right from the start. maybe it is just time and maturity, but you eventually learn that you always get what you pay for. sort of a risk vs. reward situation. Both sides only saw the reward and no one really looked at the risk. Unfortunately, these situations have high risk. It is nothing more than making a a high yield/high risk investmest. You have to realize that the risk usually outweghs the reward!
I consider Jeremy a friend, and no matter what hate stories come out, it won't change my opinion. I always had easy business dealings with Jeremy. Some times, I even thought he was selling things too cheaply and I would "overpay" him for it. hell, I even sent him, as a gift, a set of aluminum AN wrenches for his toolbox just because I believed in his passion for his business.
In closing, I'd really love to these boards go back to being a great source for tech sharing. The threads recently have really been dull. I still check the FI section on a daily basis, but I rarely see anything worthy of posting. As most of you know, I mainly proivde alot of tech info/support for questions on these boards. I am not a post-***** or a drama king, just a guy with a real passion for perforance and a willingness to share my knowledge with those who need it. It is posts like this one that really turn me off to what my350z.com has become.
Here's to better times!!!
Agreed
06-06-2009, 01:46 PM
#506
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't know the specifics so I will offer an unbiased opinion on the matter. coach, how can you not agree with those statements? Basic contract law dictates that you're not even supposed to do that. If you contracted to perform a specific job for X amount of dollars, then that is what you're supposed to do. If you cannot do it, that does not give you the right to leave the car half done and ask for more money. If you cannot honor the contract, then it is up to the breaching party to restore both parties to their original state before the contract were made. Meaning that the car should be restored to its original condition when it first arrived and any monies paid should be refunded. He isn't allowed to keep those cars at all if he couldn't honor the original contract. IMO, that is considered theft. Now, if the customers have yet to pay the full amount of the original agreed upon price, then JT should have put a mechanic's lien on those titles.
As for the outsourcing comment, how can you not agree with that either? Consider this, say you brought your car in for a warranty spark plugs. (Hypothetical situation here folks so brands may not be accurate) Would it be ok for Nissan to deny your claim because they said those are NGK or Denso plugs because that's where they outsourced the plugs from? No, it would not be right. It would be Nissan's obligation because they chose to outsource those plugs, not the end consumer. What if your rim fractured from faulty casting, can Nissan deny your claim and say, "Sorry. You're gonna have to take that up with Mackin Industries." No. So if JT chose to outsource a motor as part of his work, why would he not be responsible?
I'm not trying to offend you or anything. I know that you're a long time and respected member here but I think your interests here may conflict with your ability to see the bigger picture. As a long time lurker with really no allegiance here in the FI forum, I figure I'd just lend an outside unbiased opinion.
-Jim
As for the outsourcing comment, how can you not agree with that either? Consider this, say you brought your car in for a warranty spark plugs. (Hypothetical situation here folks so brands may not be accurate) Would it be ok for Nissan to deny your claim because they said those are NGK or Denso plugs because that's where they outsourced the plugs from? No, it would not be right. It would be Nissan's obligation because they chose to outsource those plugs, not the end consumer. What if your rim fractured from faulty casting, can Nissan deny your claim and say, "Sorry. You're gonna have to take that up with Mackin Industries." No. So if JT chose to outsource a motor as part of his work, why would he not be responsible?
I'm not trying to offend you or anything. I know that you're a long time and respected member here but I think your interests here may conflict with your ability to see the bigger picture. As a long time lurker with really no allegiance here in the FI forum, I figure I'd just lend an outside unbiased opinion.
-Jim
I didn't say I don't agree with those statements, I just had to clarify a few things. Once again the problem with Craigs and the other project cars was JT DIDN'T have a written agreement/contract with these guys so neither one really had any idea how much this was going to cost and how long it would take. Mistakes made by all parties involved.
06-06-2009, 01:51 PM
#507
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
and no offense, but that is not a failure of his business sense, but his mechanical skill as well, because he should have been able to accurately time, price and design any job he decided to undertake. Greed, zeal or ignorance it doesn't really matter the reasoning behind his decisions.
These problems stray past his business acumen issues and to continually push back (coachk) and try to limit the culpability to this is only -at least to me- you defending a friend. But that isn't really called for.
These problems stray past his business acumen issues and to continually push back (coachk) and try to limit the culpability to this is only -at least to me- you defending a friend. But that isn't really called for.
06-06-2009, 02:00 PM
#510
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I respect your opinion,but don't agree with it at all. I'm probably the wrong guy to debate with about a legal issue, but anyways...
I didn't say I don't agree with those statements, I just had to clarify a few things. Once again the problem with Craigs and the other project cars was JT DIDN'T have a written agreement/contract with these guys so neither one really had any idea how much this was going to cost and how long it would take. Mistakes made by all parties involved.
I didn't say I don't agree with those statements, I just had to clarify a few things. Once again the problem with Craigs and the other project cars was JT DIDN'T have a written agreement/contract with these guys so neither one really had any idea how much this was going to cost and how long it would take. Mistakes made by all parties involved.
And if that's the case that the terms were not set in stone and that both parties were just doing it as they go, then I would have to agree with you that fault lies on both parties involved. And if you do know more in legal matters, is there any professional duty or fiduciary duty owed to the customer from JT?
06-06-2009, 02:02 PM
#511
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't know the specifics so I will offer an unbiased opinion on the matter. coach, how can you not agree with those statements? Basic contract law dictates that you're not even supposed to do that. If you contracted to perform a specific job for X amount of dollars, then that is what you're supposed to do. If you cannot do it, that does not give you the right to leave the car half done and ask for more money. If you cannot honor the contract, then it is up to the breaching party to restore both parties to their original state before the contract were made. Meaning that the car should be restored to its original condition when it first arrived and any monies paid should be refunded. He isn't allowed to keep those cars at all if he couldn't honor the original contract. IMO, that is considered theft. Now, if the customers have yet to pay the full amount of the original agreed upon price, then JT should have put a mechanic's lien on those titles.
As for the outsourcing comment, how can you not agree with that either? Consider this, say you brought your car in for a warranty spark plugs. (Hypothetical situation here folks so brands may not be accurate) Would it be ok for Nissan to deny your claim because they said those are NGK or Denso plugs because that's where they outsourced the plugs from? No, it would not be right. It would be Nissan's obligation because they chose to outsource those plugs, not the end consumer. What if your rim fractured from faulty casting, can Nissan deny your claim and say, "Sorry. You're gonna have to take that up with Mackin Industries." No. So if JT chose to outsource a motor as part of his work, why would he not be responsible?
I'm not trying to offend you or anything. I know that you're a long time and respected member here but I think your interests here may conflict with your ability to see the bigger picture. As a long time lurker with really no allegiance here in the FI forum, I figure I'd just lend an outside unbiased opinion.
-Jim
As for the outsourcing comment, how can you not agree with that either? Consider this, say you brought your car in for a warranty spark plugs. (Hypothetical situation here folks so brands may not be accurate) Would it be ok for Nissan to deny your claim because they said those are NGK or Denso plugs because that's where they outsourced the plugs from? No, it would not be right. It would be Nissan's obligation because they chose to outsource those plugs, not the end consumer. What if your rim fractured from faulty casting, can Nissan deny your claim and say, "Sorry. You're gonna have to take that up with Mackin Industries." No. So if JT chose to outsource a motor as part of his work, why would he not be responsible?
I'm not trying to offend you or anything. I know that you're a long time and respected member here but I think your interests here may conflict with your ability to see the bigger picture. As a long time lurker with really no allegiance here in the FI forum, I figure I'd just lend an outside unbiased opinion.
-Jim
If you read what I said, I did say that its JT's responsibility not the customer.
Last edited by coachk; 06-06-2009 at 02:05 PM.
.. he remains classy about the whole situation.. he won't talk.. he would rather talk about anything else under the sun.. he loves his truck more than his car now..
06-06-2009, 02:11 PM
#513
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Edit: If you, in fact agree with the bolded parts, then we are both on the same page.
No but seriously, I don't want to pry into your personal life but if you are a lawyer, how about an internship? Job market sucks here in Philly. LOL
Last edited by Cloud35; 06-06-2009 at 02:16 PM.
06-06-2009, 02:13 PM
#514
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Boynton Bch FL
Posts: 1,262
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I know you will defend him to the end and that's fine he did good by you. If you feel that what I said is the furthest from the truth maybe you don't know everything. Now as far as bringing Japtrix and gus into this that makes you look like the idiot and a puppet. They have nothing to do with what I said. As a matter of fact either one of them can come here and make a comment if they choose too. Don't base a argument online with not getting along. People can argue and move on no matter how heated it gets. At least none of us are like jt he argues, threatens and then tries to sell you his services...LOL What a tool he was.
06-06-2009, 02:14 PM
#516
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In regards to the debate, may I ask why? I'm currently a law student and at this stage, I would welcome any debate. The way I see it, any debate will lead to more information and knowledge on both ends so regardless of the victor, both parties still gain something. Not meant to challenge you at all, but that statement implies either you are an experienced lawyer or have more background in it than I do and I am more than willing to learn a few things.
And if that's the case that the terms were not set in stone and that both parties were just doing it as they go, then I would have to agree with you that fault lies on both parties involved. And if you do know more in legal matters, is there any professional duty or fiduciary duty owed to the customer from JT?
And if that's the case that the terms were not set in stone and that both parties were just doing it as they go, then I would have to agree with you that fault lies on both parties involved. And if you do know more in legal matters, is there any professional duty or fiduciary duty owed to the customer from JT?
Lets just say I met my wife a long long time ago while we were both in law school.
06-06-2009, 02:22 PM
#519
Banned
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I know you will defend him to the end and that's fine he did good by you. If you feel that what I said is the furthest from the truth maybe you don't know everything. Now as far as bringing Japtrix and gus into this that makes you look like the idiot and a puppet. They have nothing to do with what I said. As a matter of fact either one of them can come here and make a comment if they choose too. Don't base a argument online with not getting along. People can argue and move on no matter how heated it gets. At least none of us are like jt he argues, threatens and then tries to sell you his services...LOL What a tool he was.
06-06-2009, 02:23 PM
#520
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well from what was already stated, don't you think I know that? I will be the first to tell you that too. If you read further doug, I realize that I don't know nearly enough and that my reason for the debate was hopefully to learn something if anything. You really do live up to your title 