while i agree with what you said...somethign need to be clear up a bit.
its really easy to get confused...its a 536WHP and 371WTQ at 19psi! (93 Octane)
..... on a DD... how do you knwo those numbers already dont have a DJ factor applied...... it has to becuase thats about what you would expect if you compare it to other builds of "same" size enginea dn same piping (3" dps).
here is another build http://www.agency-power.com/catalog/...8-p-47998.html @ 510 horsepower on 91 octane at 20psi
another one:
505whp cutout open, 93 octane http://www.iwsti.com/forums/power-br...hp-418wtq.html

 

By comparing IP DD dyno numbers with DJ dyno numbers I think your DD # (465whp) is ~520whp DJ which I think is right.

 

I think IP installed the yellow .8 tial wastegate spring with the Haltech boost solenoid. We have attempted boosting level up to ~18-20 psi but do not see anymore power at those levels. The car was final setup at 15psi which drops to 14 psi by redline at 8000rpm. IP stated that the torque level continues the rise but the hp levels peak at ~13-14 psi boost. As stated before, the AITs continue the increase to unsafe levels as the boost reaches higher boost levels and the hp starts to drop off. Hal has told me in phone conversation that the boost solenoid has to struggle to maintain a steady boost level due to high levels of back pressure on the hot side of the turbo.

I rechecked to turbo housing last night and it is definitely an Garrett gt35r with a .82 turbine housing.

The turbo does not feel sluggish and the powerband is excellent; the car starts boost at 2800 rpms, achieves full boost at 3300 rpms and makes hp all the way up to 8000rpms with only a small amount of torque loss by redline. The issue that I have with the kit is that it is maxed out at this level of boost. Intense now proclaims that if you use race gas and dangerous boost levels, the kit will produce power but this is not stated anywhere in any of our conversations, the produce info or advertised in this manner at the time of my purchase or up till this thread hit this site. Intense/ supporters started the discussion with claims of several GT35R setups that came out of their shop making 500+ hp but has not posted one of them; the only other valid dyno that has been posted demostrates the same limitations of the kit that I,m am facing at this point Also, the data that collected during tuning and the experience that IP has from working with FI on several platforms, has lead them to believe that increasing boost levels and utilizing race gas will not increase power levels anywhere close to what Intense claims to achieve with this setup. I am not calling Intense/powerlab liers, I am only going off of the data that has been collected on my vehicle and the expert opinion from one of the top shops working in this platform. If the dynos that are posted by Intense were performed by a third party source, weather it be another shop not affiliated with powerlab, private customer or ind research company, I would be more apt to believe their claimed finding at this point.

 

yes sir u r correct! In reality he's already broken the 500hp mark on a DJ

 

did you try meth injection to reduce the air temps?

that's a lot cheaper/easier solution than full race gas and will def make the ait's safer up top. Even if you don't change timing to pull more power you should have better AIT's for more consistent performance.

i'd like to see the dyno of this. It sounds like you are making nasty tq which is way more important than a hp number when you are talking about how well it pulls when driving. I'd kill for tq. My vortech only put down 350ftlbs all the way up at 6200rpms.

 

^^^

1. How did YOU physically check the turbine housing AR last night (after business hours?) when your car is at Injected and the IP guys are currently at ZDayz?
2. Here we go again with you talking out of your ***... "Dangerous boost levels" on race gas??? WTF are you talking about? Where did Intense supposedly proclaim they used dangerous boost levels? No "crazy boost controller/wastegate setup" or "dangerous boost levels" were involved in the 653whp dyno run on C16 race gas. By saying things like this, you are showing that you either lack technical knowledge or have an ulterior motive to discredit PowerLab/Intense.
3. You have insinuated several times since the beginning of this thread (even in this latest post of yours) that Intense/PowerLab have lied and misled people.

Bottom line: I smell a rat. Your posts seem more intended on discrediting PowerLab and Intense rather than seeking seeking a solution or advice for the problems with YOUR PowerLab kit on YOUR car. You have been quick to make negative proclamations even though it is quite clear (from the info posted in this thread and from the scope of discussions that have taken place off of the forums with Injected prior to them leaving for ZDayz) that not all possibilities have been checked/investigated and eliminated yet to narrow down and troubleshoot the problem.

• You keep ignoring the posts that point out that the 465whp # on IP's DD dyno could likely be 500+whp on a DJ somewhere else.
• Even though you made comments that cast doubt about the kits piping, you dismiss posts that point out that the kit has accomplished higher power levels with the SAME piping and you try to limit the discussion to the GT35R turbo. The crucial fact that you continue to ignore and dismiss is that if the kit's piping flows well enough to produce significantly higher power levels with larger turbos, there is no logical reason why the piping isn't sufficient for use with a GT35R turbo.

Based on the totality of what I have seen with your behavior, the communication (or lack thereof) that Injected has had with Intense/PowerLab up to this point, and the timing of this thread right before ZDayz... I will come right out and say it...
I will not be shocked if this thread ends up being a precursor to Injected Performance announcing THEIR OWN single turbo kit in the near future.

 

someone give me $5,000 (of course I'd pay the rest) I'll get my block built and test this. I'll have F:T do it with Meth, then without meth and I'll report back.

I think this kit should be able to hit 17-20 psi and put out 500-525 on a DD with pump 93...at least I assumed that based upon the claims when I bought it. I thought it would hit 500 without meth.





....Someone seriously give me $5,000...please?

 

Lol rude that's a pretty bold statement. If that does happen I'd think that would be pretty low on their part but I doubt it'll be like that. The guys at Injected r good guys n idk if they'd resort to doing it like that.

 

UMW...525s DD ... thats like over 600whp.... ...on pump... i doudbt it... DJ is different......u should, if you do meth is a whole different story too and def u can run more psi.


And i find it funny that people are questioning a dynojet number...when a dynojet is a number that usually gets less scrutinized because its industry standard for a reason, you cannot fake the numbers ona dynojet, you cannot put a 1.2 or a 1.3 correction factor like you can on a DD which sometimes makes it confusing from when they are showing true DD numbers and not.

The only reason why function, forged or others with DDs have to go out there by 3rd party is because they cannot claim the power numbers since their dyno could have a factor build applied. So if they want to report what their numbers in DJ that compare to all the rest of peeps with DJ numbers, its not a made up one, but rather that is spit out straight from a dynojet...in this case, it was 0 smoothing no extreeme temp correction.... nothing with with the straps, its been posted on videos how intense runs their dynos..and always have the bumpers on. thE KIT IS BEEN PROVEN ON THE 1/4 MILE....how on EARTH can injected say(from your statement) that putting race gas or not isnt going to make a difference on the kit and the numbers are basically fake ... how can you run those 1/4 miles times/trap speed then????......
Ii could also start strawman comments about the true numbers on injected big single turbo bild, but with the 1/4 mile times/traps there is no need to show what the actual comprable DJ-spitted numers are or anything... its a 1000+whp car. Stop OVERLOOKING this fact.

I agree with rude too... he he talks of "crazy wg" crazy" boost".... it kinda shows that he isnt aware of how facts work... boost pressure has nothing to do with the head lift, cylinder pressure does. ie. you could run 21psi and only make 400whp and never have a problem. The tune is most critical. If you detonate you have cylinder pressures that equate anywhere from 3x-5x or more pressure, or more than the cylinder pressure that's actually being produced.

rude is calling it as he sees it... he is 100% consistant... doesnt care about pandering the choir . Having talk to greg and hal before since the supra days for both vendors, this isnt their 1st rodeo,... i doubt they are not pulling the same move other vendors did here(hope) like ...err the one that was pushing hard for APS products and then release their kit and had nothing but trash words at aps after wards. Funny thin is that other than from very few there wasnt not much of an outrage at claiming horse power capabilities of the kit with out even a dyno sheet or having neverreach that number then.

 

I realize that it's a bold statement. I said IF it happens, I would not be shocked. I sincerely hope I am wrong. However, my opinions and suspicions are based on what I have seen with this thread and what I know about the history between Intense and Injected, which hasn't exactly been the most amicable or cooperative of relationships.

 

First, just like you are doubting my results with your findings, I am doubting yours with the results that was achieved by IP.

Second, IP is not looking for a fight, bashing your product, or planning a release of their our line of single turbo kits. In fact they were supportive of your product from the beginning of the project and believed that the kit would make a conservative 500whp run on their DD. Now, that they have attempted it and collected objective data; they feel that either the turbo or the combination of the turbo and the hot sided piping is inefficient causing extreme back pressure limiting the ability of the car to produce anymore power. I am not an expert on FI motors and have stated that several times but the experts are saying to if the kit is inefficient at higher levels then race will not produce greater power. Finally, if the car can only produce 465 with 93, do you realistically believe that you will produce another 200 whp with race gas?

Third, I live in NC ~20 miles from the Hendersonville, NC airport were the first day of ZdayZ is being held. The car was delivered to me on Friday because IP has tried almost everything in their power to resolve the issue with the lower numbers that the vehicle is producting; and at this point, I just wanted my car back for await to enjoy it.

Fourth, I am not some sort of fanboy/cronie of IP; I have used all of the Southeastern Shops since I have started playing with this platform since 2006. I connected with the guys IP when I had my Haltech retune with the stock block / Powerlab setup. Believe me, we have had issues as well;but unlike Powerlab they own up to their mistakes and fix them.

Fifth: I have already explained that I misspoke about the wastegate setup. I was alluding to the unsafe, highly risky use of 29 psi to achieve the higher power levels that were posted by Intense. Most twin setups are achieving the 500 whp mark at 15 psi and are not risking the health of the engine by pushing the boost levels that high. If you you want to speak of product bashing, this is what Intense did when we discussed the use the Powerlab kit on a built engine vs the twin kits that I was interested in purchasing at the time I started this project with PF. Along with the info provide on the powerlab website, this conversation help finalize my decision on purchasing this kit long ago.

 

I hope for the sake of the community that u r wrong.
I'm looking forward to a response from op on the facts stated about already making 500hp
also waitin to hear what Injected has to say about the tests done.

 

^ That's very interesting. Because Injected admitted to someone that they had not yet checked for a boost leak and Greg didn't answer all of Intense's questions on AIM, yet the car apparently was already being returned to you.

 

yea tru also if the ait temps r high I'd imagina it's not safe to drive in boost at all so what do u mean by "enjoy the car for awhile"?

 

Straight from the horse's mouth: "I also continued to tell you that I felt it was probably irresponsible of a tuner of this platform to stretch it to 500-550 wheel on pump because it would be putting enormous stress on the motor based on high boost levels with this turbo. I was very careful to clarify my thoughts on this to you."

 

They backed the tune back to 14-15 psi were the car made the highest power without Climbing AITs and risking head lift as mention by Rude.

 

The car was delivered to me at Hendersonville at 1:00 pm est on Thursday, 5/20/2010. I was told by Greg that they worked on checking the engine and kit prior to delivering the car. I know that several tests were done on the vehicle on the previous Sunday and on Tuesday and Wenesday after I started this thread. They had worked on the tune for several days before tuning for high power levels the prior week. I will let them expand on this even farther on Monday when they get back from ZDAYZ. Finally, I had felt that they needed to consult with the other experts on this platform and needed to step away from the project to get a better perspective on things. As I stated before, they were supportive of the Powerlab kit and felt it could achieve the goals that I had in mind.

 

Straight from your mouth...
^^ See the obvious and crucial difference in those two statements?

 

I am planning on returning the car to IP in approximately 1 month to allow time for everyone to brainstorm, discuss the problem and hopefully come up with a simple solution. I know from talking with Greg and Hal, they would like to see this thing to the end and achieve the results I wanted. I also hope that Intense/powerlab will discuss in length the data that was collected by IP as a result of my project and if it is the kit, which is limiting the power production, be willing to come to a happy medium and help me achieve these goals. Even though this thread has become heated at time and I admit that my frustration has not helped matters, I would hope that it educates the followers of the thread and advances the platform that much further.

 

This thread is crap and it's even more obvious now that you were premature in making it. Let's recap the facts and your douchebaggery in this thread:

1. You withheld pertinent information in your thread title and your first two posts that only pump gas was involved. It wasn't until Injected posted that we learned the dynos were done on pump gas.
2. Neither you nor Injected contacted Intense and consulted them about the problems being experienced on your car with the PowerLab kit EITHER BEFORE OR AFTER THIS THREAD WAS CREATED. Instead, I notified Intense when I saw this thread and they immediately contacted Injected.
3. Intense asked Injected some questions via AIM in an attempt to troubleshoot the problem and some of those questions were not answered. Thus far, their communication and cooperation with Intense leaves much to be desired.
4. Based on posts by you and Injected, indications are that the car has yet to be dyno tested with the HKS exhaust and reverse Y-pipe removed. This is one of the first things that should have been done in the process to troubleshoot the problem. Thus, the exhaust setup has not been eliminated as a possible cause.
5. You again withheld pertinent information that your car is no longer at Injected and was returned to you on Thursday. You did not divulge this information until I pressed you for an explanation on how you checked the turbine housing last night.
6. The car was returned back to you before every possible test had been done to determine the problem(s) and before any meaningful consultation had occurred with Intense/PowerLab. Yet you continued to make posts that contain statements and language that attempt to smear the integrity of PowerLab and Intense.
7. You have made several statements that vilify the marketing of the PowerLab kit as misleading and deceitful even though I pointed out that none of the other turbo kit manufacturers explicitly state what their kit's maximum horsepower capabilities are on PUMP gas. It is unfair and unreasonable to expect PowerLab to do this when none of the other manufacturers do so. Furthermore, some of the other manufacturers state their kit's maximum horsepower capabilities solely based on the power rating of the turbos and have no dynos to back up their claims. However, PowerLab has consistently provided dynos and videos to support their power claims.
8. You didn't give PowerLab/Intense ample time, opportunity, or consideration to consult with Injected in the effort to troubleshoot the problem and attempt a resolution BEFORE you created this thread and proceeded to make negative proclamations about both the product and the company. You didn't give them a chance before you started flaming.

Now you divulge that your car is going back to Injected in approximately one month "to allow time for everyone to brainstorm, discuss the problem and hopefully come up with a simple solution". That's EXACTLY what should have happened BEFORE you got your car back and BEFORE you started this thread.