Forged Performance: High Boost Greddy TT with Meth/FCON
#41
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Originally Posted by r0mey
yes we were sharif do you have any knowledge on this man?
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Originally Posted by Zivman
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Very nice post. Nice to see you backing the unsleeved motors. IMHO, the extra heat, machine work, cost, and risk of sinking with sleeving this motor just isn't worth it. At least not until we start seeing motors failing because of a compromised cylinder wall
#43
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
You guys are right. The 20G upgrades dont provide a whole lot more airflow..about 10% more. IMHO, its an expensive upgrade, and might not be worth it for everyone. Personally, I would suggest sticking with the basic turbos for now...they also tend to last a lot longer than the 20G's. ![Smilie](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
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Thanks everyone! To to answer everyone's question, YES I AM EXTREMELY HAPPY WITH THE RESULTS!!!
This is the power level that I was shooting for when I did this project, and I knew I could get there with pump gas and meth. There only a few meth kits out there that I would trust to do this with and Alky Control is probably the best one avail taking everything into consideration including cost.
I think with a freer flowing turbo and CJM twin pumps we could have broke 700whp on this dyno all on 93oct. But honestly guys, this power is just stupid!!! The difference between 525 and 650 is huge. Basically take every gear and shift it up one for traction issues. I will be happy with this power til at least the end of the summer! LOL
As for the tune... I thought we would need more boost than 18psi to get to 650, but with 18psi that is awesome. Turbos will last much longer not pushing them to the limits all the time. And with the FCon accepting the 5V trigger from the meth kit it is 100% seemless in the transition of the sub map for timing and fuel. This kit is very aggresive on the amount of meth that is being sprayed. Sharif had to pull 23% of the fuel at 15psi that we had before with out meth. We are adding timing, but not sure were we stopped at. I want to say 3 degrees...
We could have gone higher, but the single 255 was getting close to its limits and Sharif likes to tune in a manner that will keep the engine at that power level for longer than a month... And that is the key reason I trust him with my car, I know that when I leave there the setup is going to stay in one piece! Like Sharif said, I do all of my own work, except the tuning... I have owned my own shop before and still do a lot of side jobs to support my habits, and Sharif is the only one that is close to where I live that I would trust tuning the car. I give him crap and try to push him further all the time, but I respect the fact that he will not go further than what is reliable power. A lot to be said there, and that is why I work with him and would consider him a good friend as well!
I am heading to Friday night drags tomorrow to see what kind of trap speeds I can hit, since traction on my street tires will make my E.T.s a joke! Next on the list is a roll cage, fire system, axels, and sticky tires.
If you guys have questions about the tune or kit feel free to PM me for specifics of the setup, since this was the first kit Alky Control did for the Z it was a bit of a custom setup...
Here are some more pics of the install that I took at home... Enjoy!
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0596.jpg)
This is the power level that I was shooting for when I did this project, and I knew I could get there with pump gas and meth. There only a few meth kits out there that I would trust to do this with and Alky Control is probably the best one avail taking everything into consideration including cost.
I think with a freer flowing turbo and CJM twin pumps we could have broke 700whp on this dyno all on 93oct. But honestly guys, this power is just stupid!!! The difference between 525 and 650 is huge. Basically take every gear and shift it up one for traction issues. I will be happy with this power til at least the end of the summer! LOL
As for the tune... I thought we would need more boost than 18psi to get to 650, but with 18psi that is awesome. Turbos will last much longer not pushing them to the limits all the time. And with the FCon accepting the 5V trigger from the meth kit it is 100% seemless in the transition of the sub map for timing and fuel. This kit is very aggresive on the amount of meth that is being sprayed. Sharif had to pull 23% of the fuel at 15psi that we had before with out meth. We are adding timing, but not sure were we stopped at. I want to say 3 degrees...
We could have gone higher, but the single 255 was getting close to its limits and Sharif likes to tune in a manner that will keep the engine at that power level for longer than a month... And that is the key reason I trust him with my car, I know that when I leave there the setup is going to stay in one piece! Like Sharif said, I do all of my own work, except the tuning... I have owned my own shop before and still do a lot of side jobs to support my habits, and Sharif is the only one that is close to where I live that I would trust tuning the car. I give him crap and try to push him further all the time, but I respect the fact that he will not go further than what is reliable power. A lot to be said there, and that is why I work with him and would consider him a good friend as well!
I am heading to Friday night drags tomorrow to see what kind of trap speeds I can hit, since traction on my street tires will make my E.T.s a joke! Next on the list is a roll cage, fire system, axels, and sticky tires.
If you guys have questions about the tune or kit feel free to PM me for specifics of the setup, since this was the first kit Alky Control did for the Z it was a bit of a custom setup...
Here are some more pics of the install that I took at home... Enjoy!
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0596.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0587.jpg)
#45
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A few more pics... Custom oil cooler I did as well... I eliminated the stock oil cooler completely and all of the coolent lines that supported that system. Took a custom sandwich adapter to do it, but I think it turned out pretty good!
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0593.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0598.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0588.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0590.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0593.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0598.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0588.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0590.jpg)
![](http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z291/jkenefic/CIMG0592.jpg)
Last edited by MADScientist; 07-05-2007 at 07:56 AM.
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
You guys are right. The 20G upgrades dont provide a whole lot more airflow..about 10% more. IMHO, its an expensive upgrade, and might not be worth it for everyone. Personally, I would suggest sticking with the basic turbos for now...they also tend to last a lot longer than the 20G's. ![Smilie](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
![Smilie](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
#47
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Originally Posted by MIAPLAYA
Its too bad someone doesn't make a TD0X to T3 or T4 adaptor that will fit on the Greddy kit. I know we have talked about that before. It would let you bolt up whatever turbo you want to the Greddy system for more power potential.
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Originally Posted by doug
i guess you could also cut and weld a new flange on, but.. 25G's or T67's are also Mitsu Turbo's.. they should make good power too
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Originally Posted by MIAPLAYA
Its difficult to do that on a cast manifold. Not that it can't be done but cutting and welding to cast is not something I would do on my car. The 25G compressor would flow well yes but I'm more concerned about the turbine section. I don't think a TD05 or even TD06 is going to flow enough for the amount of power you will be making with 25G compressors.
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Originally Posted by doug
ahh.. thanks for the info
#52
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Originally Posted by MIAPLAYA
I don't think a TD05 or even TD06 is going to flow enough for the amount of power you will be making with 25G compressors.
But any above 600whp is totally nuts on the street. It's a lot of fun, with a nice wide powerband that is hard to beat.
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
Nobody really knows the answer to this question, becuase we have yet to see any stock cylinder wall failures at high power levels. The general community is starting to believe the the stock sleeves can take quite a bit more power than previously thought. My personal opinion, is that the limits of the stock sleeves will exceed the limits of the current crop of TT kits on the market at about 600-700whp, but only time will tell. The stock sleeves have some definate cooling advantages as well, particularly for those that road race/track day their cars.
Mike
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
I agree. No matter how you slice it, you will be spending a lot of money to upgrade to only a marginally better turbo, in terms of airflow. If someone wants big big power, a better option to use a kit that provides that airflow out of the box...such as SFR or the new SP kit coming shortly....and then sell their exisintg Greddy kit.
But any above 600whp is totally nuts on the street. It's a lot of fun, with a nice wide powerband that is hard to beat.
But any above 600whp is totally nuts on the street. It's a lot of fun, with a nice wide powerband that is hard to beat.
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Originally Posted by doug
excellent information Gentlemen.. thank you
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
The only other issue, MIA, is space, and that's where even if you use an adaptor, you probably wont have room for a significantly larger turbocharger. With SFR/SP, turbos are mounted low, and space is much more luxurious down there. ![Big Grin](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
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#60
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Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
The meth is injected into the intake pipe before the TB. The plenum is tapped for the HKS air inlet sensor, as Phunk mentioned.
Joe is running the AAM 3 inch downpipes with dumps. For this power level, you dont HAVE to relocate the wastegates, but you should try running a 3 inch downipe.
They are getting close to their max efficiency range. On my car, we stopped making power after 19.5psi, and on Brent's old engine...about 21psi. After 19psi, each psi increase in boost delivers less and less power. Backpressure becomes an issue as well, through these tiny exhaust housings.
Thanks for the comments, guys.![Smilie](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Joe is running the AAM 3 inch downpipes with dumps. For this power level, you dont HAVE to relocate the wastegates, but you should try running a 3 inch downipe.
They are getting close to their max efficiency range. On my car, we stopped making power after 19.5psi, and on Brent's old engine...about 21psi. After 19psi, each psi increase in boost delivers less and less power. Backpressure becomes an issue as well, through these tiny exhaust housings.
Thanks for the comments, guys.
![Smilie](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
That is an awesome setup! Great job guys. Meth injection before the turbos can usually up the efficiency of the turbos by 10-15% if you are looking to unlock more power out of those turbos.