replicas or lookalikes
#61
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Which wheel manufacture do you work for again?
-Dan
#62
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haha.
at least they admit to copying..
Originally Posted by process.shtml
Product designs in tune with world trends and ever-changing motorists' preferences
By regularly participating in international automotive exhibits such as the SEMA show in Las Vegas, Nevada, USA and the Automechanika show in Frankfurt, Germany plus some top local exhibits, PAWI gets a feel of the latest international and local trends including the best selling wheel designs and accessories. From these inputs, our design team is able to come up with totally new or modified, mixed and matched concept designs from which the selection process begins.This complements the painstaking yet worthwhile design reviews to ensure that the every detail is covered.
By regularly participating in international automotive exhibits such as the SEMA show in Las Vegas, Nevada, USA and the Automechanika show in Frankfurt, Germany plus some top local exhibits, PAWI gets a feel of the latest international and local trends including the best selling wheel designs and accessories. From these inputs, our design team is able to come up with totally new or modified, mixed and matched concept designs from which the selection process begins.This complements the painstaking yet worthwhile design reviews to ensure that the every detail is covered.
Last edited by Chebosto; 09-24-2009 at 02:56 PM.
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You made an assumption based upon a dark picture. Maybe you should do better research ![](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/icon44.gif)
Funny how many people who are crying "support the companies that come up with original designs......" are unpaid members here. I got an idea, how about supporting this forum?
![](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/icon44.gif)
Funny how many people who are crying "support the companies that come up with original designs......" are unpaid members here. I got an idea, how about supporting this forum?
Last edited by bomber; 09-25-2009 at 05:02 AM.
#67
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But more importantly for those who are just regular members currently, supporting this forum has what to do with optionally supporting a company with unique wheel designs by purchasing their product? Draw me a parallel, please.
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First, many unpaid members here are premier members at our own respective forums, ever notice how G35driver, myG37, my350, etc are all linked up as they are owned by IB?
But more importantly for those who are just regular members currently, supporting this forum has what to do with optionally supporting a company with unique wheel designs by purchasing their product? Draw me a parallel, please.
But more importantly for those who are just regular members currently, supporting this forum has what to do with optionally supporting a company with unique wheel designs by purchasing their product? Draw me a parallel, please.
As far as parallels are concerned, I'm not sure why I need to state the obvious. At the base level, it's an opinion just like those who think I should only buy certain products. On the next level, it comes accross as disingenuous to fault others for not supporting companies by purchasing $3000 wheels when they haven't even ponied up 1% of that to support this website.
YMMV
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Thanks for pointing out that you and others maybe paid members via G35driver, myG370, etc. Didn't consider that.
As far as parallels are concerned, I'm not sure why I need to state the obvious. At the base level, it's an opinion just like those who think I should only buy certain products. On the next level, it comes accross as disingenuous to fault others for not supporting companies by purchasing $3000 wheels when they haven't even ponied up 1% of that to support this website.
YMMV
As far as parallels are concerned, I'm not sure why I need to state the obvious. At the base level, it's an opinion just like those who think I should only buy certain products. On the next level, it comes accross as disingenuous to fault others for not supporting companies by purchasing $3000 wheels when they haven't even ponied up 1% of that to support this website.
YMMV
Fair enough, but this isn't even about supporting the companies that make 3000 dollar wheels. The people with 1000 dollar budgets are not considering those more high end wheels, so those respective companies aren't really losing profit from customers not even thinking about making that purchase.
Mackin Industries (Rays, etc) could give a crap about Rota because most budget customers won't consider their products anyways, so their customer share isn't really affected. Those people who want the real thing rarely will settle for a set of knock offs.
But there are plenty of more 'budget' wheel companies that make their own designs and try to make a unique product that are overlooked because companies like Rota, Linea, Drag, R-1, Ruff, etc etc piggyback on the success of proven designs from Volk, Work, BBS. And as I explained before, this disincentivizes those companies from making unique wheels at a relatively lower pricepoint.
This is why you don't see Dan ever reply to me, only to those with 'misinformation' about how they friggin cast their wheels...
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://my350z.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
But he avoids any of the REAL ethical points I bring up like the plague.
Now if another company came out and made a budget budget wheel that was a Rota knockoff and started to eat into his market share, I guarantee you his feathers would be ruffled.
You run Work CR Kai knockoffs, maybe you can or can't afford the real thing. I don't care and it doesn't matter, it's a personal choice how much to spend on wheels. But for what you spent on your Rotas, you could have easily supported a company making their own design but you wanted the look of Works without paying the actual price. That's BS to me, because if Rota didn't make a knockoff you'd easily find another wheel for that price that looked just as good if not better...
Last edited by stradaONE8; 09-25-2009 at 06:27 AM.
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That is the same point I was making in my post (the one you quoted). I own the TE37s, but I did not want people to think all manufacturers produce forged monoblocks. In my original post I pointed out most forged wheels are 2 or 3 pieces, because they are. I tried to be fair and honest with my comparisons. I often suggest people buy an original wheel design, but I will not use false claims about Rota's quality to get them to side with me. I pointed out the differences in the quality, strength, and weight without being dishonest.
Last edited by bkultra; 09-25-2009 at 07:19 AM.
#73
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Sick of guys and there "knock off" ******** when every **** on this damn forum has a knockoff kit. Yet it's fine for an exact replica of the kit but its not fine for a similar looking wheel. Wheels can't get anymore "unique" when there's so much you can do with 5-6 spoke..mesh whatever you want to call it.
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+1 it's getting old. If you like a wheel and can afford it then buy it and enjoy it. Honestly if you look at any of the wheels other than the baller boys ie: (volk, work, ame, hre, etc..) the wheels are all heavy as *&^% and all have crappy looking rivets and chrome lips and or crappy offsets. I think it's cool that a company like Rota can offer an alternative specifically for Z owners and other highly desirable car like BMW, Subaru, etc..
Or better, a more recent example - Vossen, they have stormed the market of luxury wheels with a decent product but nowhere near as good as Volk or HRE. Yet they are not copying anything, every single design is their own, and it seems they are doing wheel on the market. I have a lot of respect for them for their lineup, which I cannot tell about Linea Corse.
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As for your comments on replica bodykits...at least the people making them have the decency to plainly say they are replicas instead of acting like it's a unique product NEW to the line as most Rota products are introduced...that is out right douchebaggery to me.
Example: Rota DPTs for sale. Where does it clearly state here's a CE28 replica? Exactly, no where. Instead "HERE'S A NEW WHEEL FER DA TRACKK, derrrr...." Hell they even gank colors...mag blue and takata green are now cosmic and absolute, like seriously are you kidding me?
Example: Rota DPTs for sale. Where does it clearly state here's a CE28 replica? Exactly, no where. Instead "HERE'S A NEW WHEEL FER DA TRACKK, derrrr...." Hell they even gank colors...mag blue and takata green are now cosmic and absolute, like seriously are you kidding me?
A very fine example was posted earlier in this thread regarding a body kit.
Post for reference
https://my350z.com/forum/7771514-post25.html
Forum member "TSG-Z" was under the impression that this kit is a "replica" and thus it must have the same/better materials, the same/better fitment, etc.. but because it's a "replica" it is priced at a much lower price than the original product. This is clearly not the case though as pointed out by forum member "engiNERD350Z" in his post regarding this body kit. I feel that by saying it's a "replica" you are implying that it's the exact same product, which to me is misleading.
-Dan
Last edited by WheelDude.com; 09-25-2009 at 01:12 PM.
#77
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I seriously don't know how Dan deals with it. Dudes a great guy with top notch customer service.
And The VQ.. The thing is people want those wheels but they cannot afford it thus having to go with a replica for cheaper. I still see it the same way as buying a Shine Nismo V2 instead... which 99.9% of the people on this board do. I like volks rota's and all but if it's going to cost me taking out a loan to purchase some volks..I'd deal with the replica.
And The VQ.. The thing is people want those wheels but they cannot afford it thus having to go with a replica for cheaper. I still see it the same way as buying a Shine Nismo V2 instead... which 99.9% of the people on this board do. I like volks rota's and all but if it's going to cost me taking out a loan to purchase some volks..I'd deal with the replica.
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The reason I don't reply to your posts is because it's all opinion. Every month or two there is a new "member" who goes on a tirade against Rota Wheels and or WheelDude. You have your opinion on the subject and I have my opinion, it is obvious we see things different so why should I debate it with you in every single thread?
There are other companies that do this, you mentioned one company in your posts which is Drag Wheels. They have a lower price and offer many wheels that are exact copies in terms of appearance. There are also other vendors that take images we use for marketing and use them in their emails, posts, and or Ebay listings to help sell wheels (wheel pictures, images of the wheels on cars, etc..). There is really nothing I can do about this, so instead of crying about it, I work hard on areas that I can control. We pride ourselves in offering great customer support (can be seen in our itrader rating/reviews of various forum members), stocking all of our items so we can get our customers their orders in a timely manner, offering fitments/sizes/colors other wheel manufactures don't, actually visiting the manufacture so we know 100% everything about the product we carry, etc.. It may not be as apparent in this market however in other markets some manufactures don't offer wheels in certain fitments, don't offer certain colors, require special ordering which takes 3+ months to arrive, etc.. You mention risk when making a new style but that is just one aspect of the big picture.
Products succeed when demand is high, and that comes from making something people want, if you can't do the latter, it doesn't matter how much service you can offer. As for waiting lists, buy a Ferrari, there is a list. That means demand is high, not service is low.
I help my friend run business that stemmed from his very original idea in my limited spare time. A large part of my anger towards companies like Rota and etc, comes from people we have talked to and have essentially stolen our idea and gone to people to undercut us with a knockoff version of it because it's not against the law. It's ********, it's not honorable. There isn't much of that left in the world, but instead of looking down upon a lack of it, it's brushed aside more and more.
I can understand your frustration when people steal your work, but your wheels, while not 100% replicas, ARE design copies. I could ask 100 random people with the pictures I posted of the 10 spoke wheels and I guarantee 95 of them would ID the Rota and the Drag is copies of the CE28. Not just my 'opinion', it's how it is.
But, again see above where I have never knocked your quality or service, not once.
Yes, all current Rota's are inspired by other wheel designs. This doesn't mean every wheel is an exact copy though as you describe. The SVN has a larger lip, the Grid has more concave, the Torque has a different spoke shape, etc.. (read below for my full response on this)
Your market is cut out for you to have to do as little as possible when coming up with a new wheel. That to me is moral relativism and ********. That is my opinion, but again, come up with a truly original idea and have someone copy it 99% and pretend it's theirs, and you will understand. I'm not sure you've really had that happen other than had some pictures stolen, and look how it made you feel.
You mention the Rota DPT which is a new model we just released. Upon the release of this wheel I marketed it as a Rota Wheel because that's exactly what it is.. If I was to say "Here's a brand new CE28 replica" that would be unethical in my opinion. By saying it's a replica I am implying that it's made of the same materials, it uses the same manufacturing process, etc.. and it's an exact reproduction of the Volk Racing CE28 wheel. The Rota DPT is not though and this is why I market it as a Rota Wheel. This is why our wheels come in a Rota Wheel box, they come with Rota Wheel center caps, and they have no markings on the wheel to imply that it's a Volk Racing product.
I get that your wheels are not 100% identical in material or spec, but in a jury of 100, I guarantee 95% side with me that it's a replica and not a 'inspired' or 'reimagined' design. It's chicken parm, just not as good.
A very fine example was posted earlier in this thread regarding a body kit.
Post for reference
https://my350z.com/forum/7771514-post25.html
Forum member "TSG-Z" was under the impression that this kit is a "replica" and thus it must have the same/better materials, the same/better fitment, etc.. but because it's a "replica" it is priced at a much lower price than the original product. This is clearly not the case though as pointed out by forum member "engiNERD350Z" in his post regarding this body kit. I feel that by saying it's a "replica" you are implying that it's the exact same product, which to me is misleading.
Post for reference
https://my350z.com/forum/7771514-post25.html
Forum member "TSG-Z" was under the impression that this kit is a "replica" and thus it must have the same/better materials, the same/better fitment, etc.. but because it's a "replica" it is priced at a much lower price than the original product. This is clearly not the case though as pointed out by forum member "engiNERD350Z" in his post regarding this body kit. I feel that by saying it's a "replica" you are implying that it's the exact same product, which to me is misleading.
You say it's just my opinion, but my opinion is backed while your seems to rely on minor nuances in definition to make you look not as bad as you might really be in terms of copying designs. But again, thanks for replying, I do appreciate it.
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And The VQ.. The thing is people want those wheels but they cannot afford it thus having to go with a replica for cheaper. I still see it the same way as buying a Shine Nismo V2 instead... which 99.9% of the people on this board do. I like volks rota's and all but if it's going to cost me taking out a loan to purchase some volks..I'd deal with the replica.
Replica wheels are like sporting fake watch
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Last edited by The_VQ; 09-25-2009 at 02:51 PM.