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My 03 has a JWT clutch/fw and it grabs very hard. I'm trying to decide if i want to swap it into my "keeper" or let it go when that car sells; hard to tell how much life it has left; feels like it only has 1" of grip; is that normal for a race clutch? also, Z1 offers a 18-20 lb flywheel as i recall.
As Long as is not slipping it can handle the abuse )
What I like about the JWT Clutch :
1.The Fly wheel is lite and is made of parts,so if anything happens I can change what is damage not the entire flywheel
2. The clamping force of the Plate
I did not give up on the DE because I don't see a BIG difference in the setup that I want
When an engine build is done it doesn't matter if it is a DE or HR in my opinion you have to change most of the internals.
Besides the pistons that are custom made everything was bought and in stock.
The only limitation that I see in the setup is the 8000 Rpm limit because of the crank. I need a reliable engine to last one season before opening it up and the chassy as light as possible and of cours weight distribution and a good setup. This is the recipe with which I started with this project.
If I will swap the engine, but only after beating the turbo cars with an aspirated engine, I will definitely change to the VR30DDTT
In my opinion is the best option for any body who wants big horse power since it is a compact set up and very capable engine, after swapping with some reliable turbos
I agree to disagree. It will take quite a bit for the DE to reach 370z numbers.
Big factors that prove how much better they are:
Both switched to a plastic manifold and dual throttles resulting in 130mm of total throttle vs 70mm DE (even a 90mm is still inferior)
Diamond coated lifters (less drag)
Better balanced crank (HR/VHR can see 8k without the need of gears but drop off power before)
Dual VTC on the 3.5 helps dial and adjust the timing of ANY cam oem/aftermarket, helps dial overlap which helps make more power
VVEL on the 3.7 which many HR owners are switching to. VHR block HR heads with JWT cams making 360+ whp on pump.
I suspect a decent 300-312whp when it's all said and done. Ethanol will help, the engine should last and you should be beating some turbo cars.
Just know once you've reached your power goal that factory VHR blocks are hitting 400whp with exotic fuels. This speaks in volumes about the reliability of the HR/VHR and also it shows there's no replacement for displacement for those that choose the 3.7
Over here in the states we get to see more and more owners who get into the game to follow numbers and do pretty well surprisingly and they are the driving force behind all of this research and data.
If we are Talking DE vs VHR which one is better from the factory of cours the VHR is better is called evolution.
I'm talking about building a Car ,My Car.
In my case I had the car with a good engine so for me to take the engine out and buy a good VHR with 4000-4500 euro and after that put some more money in that.....No thanks.
It can be done of course but I decided to hold that money and put them in engine parts for the DE
I did not care about the intake system and all that since I will put ITB's .
If we are Talking DE vs VHR which one is better from the factory of cours the VHR is better is called evolution.
I'm talking about building a Car ,My Car.
In my case I had the car with a good engine so for me to take the engine out and buy a good VHR with 4000-4500 euro and after that put some more money in that.....No thanks.
It can be done of course but I decided to hold that money and put them in engine parts for the DE
I did not care about the intake system and all that since I will put ITB's .
I'm talking about putting together an engine that would fit your chassis, that could use recycled OEM parts and still provide the same reliability you will get from yours and without going much into.
Unsure how the 370z scene is over there however usually after oil coolers and the proper measures taken you can usually see them survive quite a bit. What slows them down is weight, gutted ones can only get so fast.
Where I'm trying to get to is that over here we are starting to find out that for all motor purposes a newer engine will compete in power vs longevity compared to older built VQs.
They are being pulled from SUVs, full bolt ons, ethanol and a tune and are making 340whp. With cams bumping to 360whp and if any of them break due to crazy tuning most of these engines over here are $1200
Regardless of that the only ones breaking seem to be tuning or lack of maintenance.
I apologize If I come off as rude or if at any point I made it seem like you are wasting your time.
You don't have to apologize. I understand your point but I don't think you see mine.
If in the USA you can get an engine for 1200$ and I get the same engine with 4000-4500Euro ....i think we are 2 worlds apart.
What I don't agree ''use recycled OEM parts and still provide the same reliability you will get from yours and without going much into''.....realy? The abuse that a car takes in Racing,Endurance Racing,Hill Climb NOT street Racing is huge trust me.
Even if the engines ''have the same power'' the reliability in OEM vs Built engine I just don't see it.
I say again I understand your point but it depends on the project. Not every situation is the same and I don't think it's just one recipe that is the best and work's for all, it depends on a bunch of factors and Motorsport VS Street Racing are 2 different worlds.
You don't have to apologize. I understand your point but I don't think you see mine.
If in the USA you can get an engine for 1200$ and I get the same engine with 4000-4500Euro ....i think we are 2 worlds apart.
What I don't agree ''use recycled OEM parts and still provide the same reliability you will get from yours and without going much into''.....realy? The abuse that a car takes in Racing,Endurance Racing,Hill Climb NOT street Racing is huge trust me.
Even if the engines ''have the same power'' the reliability in OEM vs Built engine I just don't see it.
I say again I understand your point but it depends on the project. Not every situation is the same and I don't think it's just one recipe that is the best and work's for all, it depends on a bunch of factors and Motorsport VS Street Racing are 2 different worlds.
In reality any engine will survive as long as no extreme parameters are met and acceptable ones are maintained.
A type of building doesnt mean it's better than and more reliable than stock if not treated from an engineered perspective. Many times folks can throw Forged pistons and rods at something from a stronger point of view however the added weight weight now and maybe different compression or fully forged pistons vs top forged, coated etc adds it's own type of stress only to that type of combination. This is meant to upgrade engines from a lesser end to a better one. You wont outlive a factory 5.0 mustang engine and it's crazy 130-140C oil temps, porsche's, and other higher power making engines.
Racing has always been a brother of efficiency, you can only be so fast with a limited efficiency. The Rev-Up engine can only be so efficient until is outflowed, outpowered and out torqued. This is to a point that it would take a reinforcement of said engine to compare to the new ones.
Not every engine in a class is a built one, in many folks try to find what's affordable and this is where these things get heavy.
You are in a country where it sounds like building would make better sense than replacement with upgrades due to high costs. You might not believe in the HR vs VHR longevity but being that you own one of the most unreliable Nissan VQ and managed to keep it in great shape means you'd be killing with a newer engine.
Thank you !
To be clear for this thread this build is done with the help of my brother who is a car engineer AND also for a second opinion and much more expertise is Clark from JWT with whom I talked quite a lot on the phone before I started to disassemble the engine, it was not like order some parts and put some random forge rods and pistons , some cams and let's see what happens.
Why the DE and not the other engine? is simple because this was on the car! If I can buy the VHR with the price in the USA I will buy 3 not 1 but that is not the case here. And is not just the money but I don't see the logic, like I said the amount of money to buy here the VHR I put that money in parts for the DE.
And like the Title in the thread says this is a PRO RACE CAR BUILD the engine is just a piece of the puzzle other pieces like Chassi, suspension, weight, weight distribution, transmision, engine management.....and so on. All these need attention.
This platform is a blast. Thanks to a great AM it's cheap compared to other brands. I am more of a mechanic than driver (and not great at either but I try) so I am vicariously enjoying your thread. when I shifted gears from a goal of comp to street/track, that gave me a lot more flexibility for enjoying the cars. whereas with a comp build, as an amateur, you have to meet certain minimum expectations and then it's not so much fun as much as an addiction. imho. you need deep pockets to go deep into comp. I experienced just a hint of that last year and knew that I would not enjoy it. for me HPDE4/tt is "comp" enough. 😉
This platform is a blast. Thanks to a great AM it's cheap compared to other brands. I am more of a mechanic than driver (and not great at either but I try) so I am vicariously enjoying your thread. when I shifted gears from a goal of comp to street/track, that gave me a lot more flexibility for enjoying the cars. whereas with a comp build, as an amateur, you have to meet certain minimum expectations and then it's not so much fun as much as an addiction. imho. you need deep pockets to go deep into comp. I experienced just a hint of that last year and knew that I would not enjoy it. for me HPDE4/tt is "comp" enough. 😉
12-21-2022, 10:51 AM
