jj1814

I had the TSB done on 9/24 @ ~10K miles

~2K miles later, the cupping/feathering has returned. The roar still isnt as loud as before, but I do see and feel the pattern on the inside of the tires.

I have an appointment on 10/16 with the dealer. I also called NNA to report the issue with them, and they have given me a reference number and will call the dealer next Thursday morning to authorize new Bridgestones, which I dont really want.

I'm going through all this, and I'm going aftermarket in a minute - soon as I get some wheels lol but who cares! I may be getting free tires

Question: people who are going w/ aftermarket wheels and tires (not suspension mods) are not having the issues, correct?

Boomer

Not necessarily. People who changed tires and wheels immediately seemed to be OK, but that meant they usually got the car properly aligned also. IMO, it was getting the alignment early which made all the difference, not just changing tires and wheels.

If your alignment is in spec now, going to different tires may help to cure the wear problem, but there are NO guarantees. If your alignment was out for a long time, some suspension wear may have ocurred and the tire wear may happen again, sorry about any misunderstanding. In any case, getting rid of the 040s is a must, IMO, I think their tread is just too soft for the Z's suspension and they are more prone to wear abnormally than most tires.

perauto1

Boomer
A cars alignment can be out of the manufactures specifications for the whole life of the car, and it will not cause any suspension damage.
They have nothing to do with each other. The alignment settings have a limit of adjustment. One of the main problem's with the Z is that the camber is not adjustable and it cant be totally corrected by adjusting the toe

Boomer

Really? Why then have owners' tire wear accelerated from 4-5000 miles at first, then happen again in 2-3000 miles? I'm not challenging your statements, I don't have a problem with being incorrect about a car subject, unlike some others. I welcome enlightenment, fire away.

perauto1

Boomer
I respect everyones opinion because we all want the same thing. To solve the problems with our cars. But I cant sit back and allow mis-information to side track our quest for an answer.

Suspention systems are designed to take well over 100,000 miles of abuse before parts need to be replaced. Most wear items are tie rods, ball joints and after many miles the control arm bushings.
In my many years of road racing and tinkering with all types of cars I have never had a suspention system or any part damaged by the alignment.
Our road race car a 85 lx Mustang coupe ran with alignment specs well beyond any thing you would use on the street. I put thousands of miles on the car at many tracks..Summit point,road america,Robeling road,Watkins glen,Charlotte,and the Atlanta motor speedway.
I respect everyones opinion and do not want to dis respect you please do not take this wrong but your theory of alignment damaging the suspentions is incorrect.
If you want to discuss this I will be happy to talk to you. My office number is 804 784 8851 ,10-5 EST
I can't explain why some of us have more wear than others,but I am not the only one NNA seems to be stumped too.
Thanks Mark

Boomer

OK, I'll give you a call tomorrow or early next week, Mark. Theories are only theories, not facts. I would welcome some facts, Nissan is certainly not supplying them. Keith

BROKE

Could it be that this tire wear problem is a result of damaging our car's front alignment during shipping. We drive our cars until we hear noise and then return to the dealer and they apply the TSB which is to swap front tires left to right and then adjust the front alignment and send us on our way. This strategy works at first but once tires start a wear pattern it returns. Once the tires are ruined nothing can be done to fix them.

I still don't buy the theory that badly worn tires can cause suspension damage. Damaged or poorly designed suspensions cause tire problems like we have.

kawataworks

I agree with Mark. I do not believe the incorrect toe settings damaged the suspension parts of our cars. Most of the mechanics that I have talked to about the problem with our cars feel it is a Caster problem. They feel that Nissan designed the cars to have too agressive a Caster stance and that they should replace the lower control arms to bring the caster into a more nuteral stance. (Agressive caster is great for high-speed stability 100+ mph, but not so good for daily driving 20mph- 80mph)

For those of you who have pulling to the left or right, probably DO HAVE suspension damage, due to improper shipping. From what I know, some cars were shipped improperly (they were tied down on the boat from Japan using chains across the lower (aluminim) control arms and were bent out of spec. causing the cars to pull left or right depending on which arm was bent.

I believe Nissan knows they can fix the problem by giving us new lower control arms, but that would be very costly for them to pay the dealerships (labor) to do this sort of work vs. just giving us new tires and sending us on our merry way. If you notice, most of us get new tires once OR twice and then when you go back a third time, the dealer tells you. "it is your driving style or it is where and what roads you are driving on that is causing the problem...etc...." It is this type of BS! That is getting me mad!

My goal is to get Nissan to admit there is a problem and then authorize a recall to fix the problem once and for all! If you would like to join me in this quest please write me an email.

mindfullivin@yahoo.com

I hope this helps.
Ian

spn350z

I had my car aligned / worked on by NNA representative during TX Lemon Law auspices to get suspension worked on and or settle complainted.

They replaced front tires with 040, aligned /worked on suspension and installed TSB for pulling to right. This was done in late June by NNA tech from Dallas (won't label him a master tech or expert since problem wasn't fixed).

I have an appointment on 16 OCt 2003 for return of problem! I have less than 18 000 miles on car.

Regarding breaking traction with rears, well I have the original 040 rear tires. Now that they are bit more worn, the tires are a loose traction (spin) with just a bit of accelleration. This is getting to be a problem because it invokes the TCS or VDC during turns (left or rigth) if you give it a little gas, much more noticeable if you try to get out of traffic on left turns.

Also brakes need a extra pump if you try to stop after cruising for a couple miles down the highway (5 to 10 minutes). Yes, the first application seems a little wier lacking the normal pedal response. Requested Nissan look at rotors and beaings for wear.

Car has never been on track or autoX. To from work and highway trips. Car has seen couple of pushs to triple digit speeds but these were by Nissan sales/tech demonstrating car stablility at speed.

Car mods are Nissan bra and tinted windows.

dangspam

have there been any issues with the 2004s?

ezchief

Hey guys. Some food for thought as I do not know why this is. All this talk about defective or damaged suspension got my my attention on Saturday.

I took my car to an independent alignment shop referred by the guys at Discount Tire. The shop has a nice set up and state of art machine so I gave them a shot. I had them do my wife's Tahoe the weekend before and was impressed.

Any way, the interesting thing was my toe settings just 5 months ago my left and right toe was set at .07 for a total of .14. About 6500 miles later my toe was at L .05 and R -.35 before alignment.

I have not raced or Auto X'd so I am puzzled. No big pot holes hit either. Is toe that sensitive that it needs to be adjusted every 4-6 months?

Is this good proof to NNA that it is F'ed up?

Boomer

Toe should not be that sensitive. I've driven cars for years and only had 1 alignment. I think the Z's suspension is F'ed up.

lake_villa

i have my car in the shop.(dealer)

they are replacing the tires and doing an alignment...will let you all know what happens.

bnbutler

Well, I did the same thing, but I'm at 14K miles already... the tires are unacceptable. The wear is unbelievable on the inner tread. I am going to start the yelling today. I was told that NNA wants us to let the dealerships correct this with an alignment and balance, drive on it 3K miles and then if "they deem it necessary" replace the front tires. I can't stand the way it handles, the way it drives, and I can't even hear my cellphone! It's loud. But again, keep in mind that I'm at the 14400 mark... Anyone have any ideas on what I need to do to get this done quicker???

YourMomma

EZChief,
Good catch. This has been in the back of my mind to test, but until this point I haven't racked up enough miles.

I've now put about 6,000 miles on since having the original TSB performed. I've been back to the dealer and they're opeing a case with NNA for replacment tires. When the replacements are installed I'll have them align again and compare to the post TSB alignment sheet.

I've never performed an alignment on any of my cars. How exactly is this done on something like the Z? Is it possible that the tie rod is flexing/bending over time? I remember you saying that Hunter examined the suspension, did they try forcing an alignment change?

My_Tampa_Z

I just took my car into the dealer to address the feathering. I told them up front, I would not accept the tire swap TSB and wanted new tires. They agreed. The dealer scratched my track wheels in the process. The dealer had to repair the wheels which took them 6 days. They did an allignment and said this would fix the problem. After reading this thread, I am not too confident the feathering will not return. We shall see.

ezchief

Hunter inspected the geometry and strength. Remeber they thought the suspension was floating backwards at load like some Audi's did. This was not the case with my suspension.

I am going to go back in a few thousand miles and have the independent shop check it again for grins. See if it is out again.

Pit Bull

I just bought my 350Z, it was built in May of 03 and is a late 03 model. Just wondering if Nissan as done anything to correct this problem at the factory? Normally if a Manufacture issues a TSB they incorporate these changes to later manufactured models so they don't have to keep fixing a known problem. Sorry if this is a dumb question.

lew f

I had the car aligned at 1700 (outside wear very noticeable). I now have 9000 and the tires seem to be wearing evenly. I check them every few hundred miles and over inflate them (35psi). I have been replying to this thread for months. My car was built in February '03 and I truly believe, even though I am not in any way "hard" on the car, it's just a matter of time before the front end goes. It just doesn't feel "together".
My dealership admits Nissan has a problem and they are working a fix (no idea when the fix will hapen). I have also been told if the tires show wear on the inside, they will replace the tires. I do not want and will refuse to replace the tires with the OE 04's, they are horrible.
I am even more amazed that the trade magazines (Car and Driver, Automobile, Motor Trend to name a few) have not even commented on having a similar problem. They have had their test cars in some cases over a year. Something is wrong there!
There is enough proof out there that a problem exists, however since we all are in different places, it is difficult for all of us to start a class action and force Nissan to publicly admit they have a problem and provide a date to fix it.
Any ideas? I certainly do not want to be stuck with a "worthless" beautiful lemon

jeffa55

Not sure if this has been suggested (the thread is just wayyyy too long), but I was talking to a 'expert' recently who said that true scalloping only occurs because of 'loose' suspension/steering components. He suggested that either the wheel bearings have play in them OR there is a steering component that is loose.
He said that alignment would almost never cause scalloping like we see (we went on to explain it and it makes sense).

Has anyone checked wheel bearings or other components for 'play'??? He did say that the play would be so slight that you would almost never be able to tell by look or feel, but correct guages and tools would be required... anyone go down this path????

This type of explanation would also explain why many people are not getting the problem (some cars have play, and others don't).