New Dnx7100 Kenwood All In One Special Forum Price
09-24-2007, 10:39 AM
#341
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Originally Posted by Spike100
^^ Wow!... Just a great post and useful message... obviously you understand.
I would like to respond, and it is not my intention to argue or debate your very accurate posting. I include quotes from your message only for clarity and to make my response more clear.
re>"1. Menu and Options
The menus are complicated and not very intuitive. This may be due to the DNX7100 being so feature rich but it makes "learning' the unit very difficult. One example of this is there are 3 different menus that can adjust the volume of the gps commands"
I don't agree, and here is why I say this: From an application programming point, the issue is making the device very flexible (so it handles just about any user preference) while keeping it "user friendly." I can tell you that is a difficult stance. The idea was to provide many user preferences (zoom-options, map-display, field selection, etc.). The menu also allows going to a "standard" display (reset) by simply selecting this option that takes the user to a setup that 99.99% of users would select.
re> 2. User interface
The layout of the various screens on the unit can be greatly improved. Some screens are too cluttered and while others are almost empty. Some screens provide provide a row of button for various options but some of the buttons are blank. Remember these are virtual button on a screen - very unprofessional probably due to lazy programmers.
Ouch!... I'm not a "lazy programmer." The DNX 7100's user interface allows just about any custom arrangement the user wants. See above.
re> 3. USB connection
While this is one of my favorite features of this unit because it lets me play music through my flash drive. The user interface is only so so. Also the 250 file limitation is a pain (see previous discussions on this thread).
Not sure why you are hitting the 256 limit here since the DNX 7100's directory can support something like 79,000+ directories and files.
re> 4. Bluetooth
This isn't really a problem with DNX7100 because it is a Kenwood add on, BT100 but hey to me it is one system. The Bt sound quality works fine. I guess this is another user interface problem. The interface is not very intuitive and requires too many key strokes to work the features. For example to access the address book to dialing the number. I also wish there was voice recognition. Also cannot get my steering control unit to work with the BT, again not a DNX7100 problem per se.
I cannot offer any comments here since I have no experience. Hopefully someone else can provide some useful advice and comments.
--Spike
I would like to respond, and it is not my intention to argue or debate your very accurate posting. I include quotes from your message only for clarity and to make my response more clear.
re>"1. Menu and Options
The menus are complicated and not very intuitive. This may be due to the DNX7100 being so feature rich but it makes "learning' the unit very difficult. One example of this is there are 3 different menus that can adjust the volume of the gps commands"
I don't agree, and here is why I say this: From an application programming point, the issue is making the device very flexible (so it handles just about any user preference) while keeping it "user friendly." I can tell you that is a difficult stance. The idea was to provide many user preferences (zoom-options, map-display, field selection, etc.). The menu also allows going to a "standard" display (reset) by simply selecting this option that takes the user to a setup that 99.99% of users would select.
re> 2. User interface
The layout of the various screens on the unit can be greatly improved. Some screens are too cluttered and while others are almost empty. Some screens provide provide a row of button for various options but some of the buttons are blank. Remember these are virtual button on a screen - very unprofessional probably due to lazy programmers.
Ouch!... I'm not a "lazy programmer." The DNX 7100's user interface allows just about any custom arrangement the user wants. See above.
re> 3. USB connection
While this is one of my favorite features of this unit because it lets me play music through my flash drive. The user interface is only so so. Also the 250 file limitation is a pain (see previous discussions on this thread).
Not sure why you are hitting the 256 limit here since the DNX 7100's directory can support something like 79,000+ directories and files.
re> 4. Bluetooth
This isn't really a problem with DNX7100 because it is a Kenwood add on, BT100 but hey to me it is one system. The Bt sound quality works fine. I guess this is another user interface problem. The interface is not very intuitive and requires too many key strokes to work the features. For example to access the address book to dialing the number. I also wish there was voice recognition. Also cannot get my steering control unit to work with the BT, again not a DNX7100 problem per se.
I cannot offer any comments here since I have no experience. Hopefully someone else can provide some useful advice and comments.
--Spike
09-24-2007, 04:20 PM
#342
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No offense taken. 
As a matter of fact I thought your posting was valuable since it comes from a different perspective pointing out that a very feature rich GPS device requires some amount of effort to become familiar with the device and its capabilities.Garmin (the OEM supplier for Kenwood) has been around for some time producing consumer and professional GPS units almost before anyone else. They have had a lot of time to refine their software (read that as adding a ton of features). Mercifully Garmin’s programmers have also worked to incorporate “default-resets” into the software. This allows a user who isn’t much interested in doing elaborate configurations to experiment with various settings (e.g., screen configurations with custom buttons, voice controls, etc.), but still return to a more intuitive and simple interface. Creating the interface is probably the most difficult aspect a programmer faces when writing a software application. You want it powerful allowing the user many options, but not so complicated that it makes using the device difficult.
Garmin has done just a great job with the Kenwood DNX7100.
--Spike
09-25-2007, 10:46 AM
#343
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Originally Posted by Spike100
re> 3. USB connection
While this is one of my favorite features of this unit because it lets me play music through my flash drive. The user interface is only so so. Also the 250 file limitation is a pain (see previous discussions on this thread).
Not sure why you are hitting the 256 limit here since the DNX 7100's directory can support something like 79,000+ directories and files.
--Spike
I am not talking about the 256 limit. I do mean 250. In any one directory you are limited to 250 entries be it files or folders or any combination thereof. So if I have 256 files (songs) in my usb drive's root directory the DNX7100 will only recognize 250 files. The work around for this limitation is to use folders. For example if I have one folder in the root directory I can also have 249 files in the root directory. The in the folder I can have 250 more files. So you may be right that it can support 79,000+ directories in total but that is only possible by nesting directories within directories.
The reason I don't like the 250 limit is that I like to dump all my songs into the root directory of my USB drive without having to put them in folders.
I do agree with you that the NAVI in the DNX7100 is great.
I also have an 06 Acura TL and I think the DNX7100 NAVI is much better. Only 2 features on the Acura NAVI I like better. 1) The size of the screen is bigger. Hey, but the DNX7100 screen is a good size also.
2) The Acura voice prompts for turns tell you in terms of how many intersections till you need to turn (e.g. "take the second right turn") as opposed to the DNX7100 tells you in fractions of a mile till the turn (e.g. "turn right in .2 miles") I think it is harder to judge the distance of fraction of miles than counting intersections.
09-25-2007, 04:36 PM
#344
New Member
OK, got it… I think… sometimes I’m a little slow.
Re> “For example if I have one folder in the root directory I can also have 249 files in the root directory.”
I agree that is odd. You would expect the device to count the root plus any combination of files and folders as 256 (and not 250 as you point out). You would think you can put 255 of any combination of files and folders on the root level:
((Root=1) + (255 folders or files or any combination)) = 256
What you point out is less than this. In your example:
((Root=1) + (1 folder=1) + (249 files=249)) = 251
Did I get this right? If I do understand, then there are 5 missing files. So… where are these “missing” 5 files. I think I know, but I’m really guessing here since this is proprietary and protected information that Kenwood is probably not willing to reveal.
Your home computer has a powerful processor that runs MS Windows. Your home computer uses the file-directory in MS Windows to maintain millions of remote servers, local drives, folders, and files. Obviously the disk directory in MS Windows supports a huge directory. The 256 limit is puny and only there on software applications you use on MS Windows to support simple devices where you write your music directories.
The DNX 7100 probably has a main processor which is very simple to save power consumption and reduce heat output. I would bet there is at least one other processor in the device (for sure one that runs the Garmin navigation application). That requires using at least (probably more) files on the main processor’s root level to coordinate activities between the two processors for things like voice guidance. So… that explains why there is at least one “missing” file. We’re now down to 4 missing files.
Since the DNX 7100’s processor must be small (this is a 12 volt system) to conserve energy use, and it cannot run a large operating system (i.e., running MS Windows is not an option); the processor needs another file slot to maintain its directory to provide fast access to music files that can be buried deeply in the 79K number of potential folders and files. We’re now down to 3 missing files.
The DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. That means the device must reserve another file slot for updates. We’re now down to 2 missing files.
And… the device also has capabilities to directly access the SD slot for live data access in case that is ever needed (instead of just using the SD slot for updates). We’re now down to 1 missing file.
Holding at least on file in reserve is only prudent. My compliments to the great programmers who are making Kenwood’s product(s) superior in a very competitive market.
--Spike
Re> “For example if I have one folder in the root directory I can also have 249 files in the root directory.”
I agree that is odd. You would expect the device to count the root plus any combination of files and folders as 256 (and not 250 as you point out). You would think you can put 255 of any combination of files and folders on the root level:
((Root=1) + (255 folders or files or any combination)) = 256
What you point out is less than this. In your example:
((Root=1) + (1 folder=1) + (249 files=249)) = 251
Did I get this right? If I do understand, then there are 5 missing files. So… where are these “missing” 5 files. I think I know, but I’m really guessing here since this is proprietary and protected information that Kenwood is probably not willing to reveal.
Your home computer has a powerful processor that runs MS Windows. Your home computer uses the file-directory in MS Windows to maintain millions of remote servers, local drives, folders, and files. Obviously the disk directory in MS Windows supports a huge directory. The 256 limit is puny and only there on software applications you use on MS Windows to support simple devices where you write your music directories.
The DNX 7100 probably has a main processor which is very simple to save power consumption and reduce heat output. I would bet there is at least one other processor in the device (for sure one that runs the Garmin navigation application). That requires using at least (probably more) files on the main processor’s root level to coordinate activities between the two processors for things like voice guidance. So… that explains why there is at least one “missing” file. We’re now down to 4 missing files.
Since the DNX 7100’s processor must be small (this is a 12 volt system) to conserve energy use, and it cannot run a large operating system (i.e., running MS Windows is not an option); the processor needs another file slot to maintain its directory to provide fast access to music files that can be buried deeply in the 79K number of potential folders and files. We’re now down to 3 missing files.
The DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. That means the device must reserve another file slot for updates. We’re now down to 2 missing files.
And… the device also has capabilities to directly access the SD slot for live data access in case that is ever needed (instead of just using the SD slot for updates). We’re now down to 1 missing file.
Holding at least on file in reserve is only prudent. My compliments to the great programmers who are making Kenwood’s product(s) superior in a very competitive market.
--Spike
09-25-2007, 05:35 PM
#345
New Member
Originally Posted by 5ZVP
… I also have an 06 Acura TL and I think the DNX7100 NAVI is much better. Only 2 features on the Acura NAVI I like better. 1) The size of the screen is bigger. Hey, but the DNX7100 screen is a good size also.
2) The Acura voice prompts for turns tell you in terms of how many intersections till you need to turn (e.g. "take the second right turn") as opposed to the DNX7100 tells you in fractions of a mile till the turn (e.g. "turn right in .2 miles") I think it is harder to judge the distance of fraction of miles than counting intersections.
2) The Acura voice prompts for turns tell you in terms of how many intersections till you need to turn (e.g. "take the second right turn") as opposed to the DNX7100 tells you in fractions of a mile till the turn (e.g. "turn right in .2 miles") I think it is harder to judge the distance of fraction of miles than counting intersections.
_______________
I see the advantage you describe (“The Acura voice prompts for turns tell you in terms of how many intersections till you need to turn (e.g. "take the second right turn") as opposed to the DNX7100 tells you in fractions of a mile till the turn (e.g. "turn right in .2 miles") I think it is harder to judge the distance of fraction of miles than counting intersections.”) but I actually prefer the way Kenwood does this.
This one is personal preference. You like “Acura voice prompts for turns tell you in terms of how many intersections till you need to turn” while I like voice navigation to tell me the distance to the next turn, do an auto-zoom on the intersection and display down to the number of miles or fraction of miles, then yards or meters, and finally feet to the turn, and then tell me to turn there.
--Spike
09-26-2007, 06:30 AM
#346
Originally Posted by Spike100
... missing files ...
Reading a FAT32 directory with an arbitrary number of files and directories isn't that hard. If you're short on memory, store less files and keep a record of where you stopped reading. Then you can quickly come back to the directory entry you stopped at and eliminate any directory entry limitation. I don't know anything specifically about the device or the embedded system in question, but I doubt that hardware was the cause of the limitation. It was most likely a cut corner that only a very few people will ever encounter.
09-26-2007, 10:20 AM
#350
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Originally Posted by Spike100
The DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. That means the device must reserve another file slot for updates. We’re now down to 2 missing files.
--Spike
--Spike
I didn't know that DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. How is that done? Where is the connection on the unit? What kind of connection is it? Has there been any updates? I am assuming you don't mean the NAVI updates via the sd card slot.
09-26-2007, 04:21 PM
#352
Originally Posted by 5ZVP
Spike,
I didn't know that DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. How is that done? Where is the connection on the unit? What kind of connection is it? Has there been any updates? I am assuming you don't mean the NAVI updates via the sd card slot.
I didn't know that DNX 7100 supports flash ROM and updating via Internet. How is that done? Where is the connection on the unit? What kind of connection is it? Has there been any updates? I am assuming you don't mean the NAVI updates via the sd card slot.
09-26-2007, 04:46 PM
#353
New Member
Originally Posted by sig11
As a programmer I would just say it is a shoddy design. Reading a FAT32 directory with an arbitrary number of files and directories isn't that hard. If you're short on memory, store less files and keep a record of where you stopped reading. Then you can quickly come back to the directory entry you stopped at and eliminate any directory entry limitation.
I don't know anything specifically about the device or the embedded system in question, but I doubt that hardware was the cause of the limitation. It was most likely a cut corner that only a very few people will ever encounter.
Reading a FAT32 directory with an arbitrary number of files and directories isn't that hard. If you're short on memory, store less files and keep a record of where you stopped reading. Then you can quickly come back to the directory entry you stopped at and eliminate any directory entry limitation. I don't know anything specifically about the device or the embedded system in question, but I doubt that hardware was the cause of the limitation. It was most likely a cut corner that only a very few people will ever encounter.
Obviously the code addresses the hardware directly, but creating an arbitrary limit that differs from an industry standard seems foolish. 5ZVP’s report is the first time I’ve ever heard of anyone doing something like this. Since almost every application builder/compiler comes with libraries to handle standard directories, it’s strange that the programmers would devise their own directory structure. It would cost more to build and test a proprietary directory.--Spike
09-26-2007, 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted by THEDUKE
There will be an update for the Ipod firmware in the near future. You will be able to download off the website onto a flash drive. Plug the flash drive into the USB port and you are set to go. Once again this will be only for the new Ipod firmware.
09-28-2007, 04:16 PM
#356
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i have the bose system and was wandering when i replace my head unit with the DNX 7100 can i still use my factory amps? i know that they are seperate from the head unit. It would seem that they might be better quality than the amp that comes on the 7100..
09-28-2007, 04:31 PM
#357
Yes. I just put in my DDX6019 and used a scosche wiring harness. At the moment, I have a two channel amp going to the rear speakers. The headunit is running the fronts and sub by itself. I am upgrading my sub and to a 5 channel amp soon.
To answer your question easily...
Yes.
Use a wiring kit and you're done.
To answer your question easily...
Yes.
Use a wiring kit and you're done.
10-04-2007, 03:18 PM
#358
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am i getting an ok deal? i am buying the 7100, bluetooth, ipod hookup, stearing wheel audio control hookup, and wiring to use my stock amps. plus intallation, tax ect... for $1800.00 it sounds like alot...but there is alot of stuff there. what do you guys think?
10-04-2007, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by THEDUKE
There will be an update for the Ipod firmware in the near future. You will be able to download off the website onto a flash drive. Plug the flash drive into the USB port and you are set to go. Once again this will be only for the new Ipod firmware.
10-05-2007, 05:54 AM
#360
Originally Posted by jm4475
am i getting an ok deal? i am buying the 7100, bluetooth, ipod hookup, stearing wheel audio control hookup, and wiring to use my stock amps. plus intallation, tax ect... for $1800.00 it sounds like alot...but there is alot of stuff there. what do you guys think?
I can save you a lot of money if you can do it yourself. It is real easy.
You can get the parts 7100 + bl tooth + I-Pod adapter + St wheel adapter for $1350 + shipping... From me. Labor you can fond an installer to do it for $200
Remember there is no VSS wire needed for the kenwood.