Always tires just before suspension so they can align to new tires. (Especially if changing sizes)

 

^ What Mic said - tires BEFORE alignment.

As far as the ABS and BRAKE dash lights, I'm not sure if the incorrect tire setup is causing that. Maybe? Or maybe the tire installers messed up one of the ABS sensors?

That battery should be fine.

 

Awesome, im right on track! The more i think about it, i probably will tackle suspension twice. I was trying to avoid that, and spend money on parts not alignments. I want to maybe replace some stuff that may not be neccessary, simply because z1s description acts like they can affect handling being older, and worn out (like tie rods and wheel bearings). i also want to change the size, on atleast rear wheels. all of this is just way too much money, while trying to get rpm dip fixed, alignment, tires, brakes, last performance parts and tune. Plus, maybe it will be good to get another alignment, later on.

 

OK, so, this is my primer for car mods since there seems to be some confusion. That is, if the stock car isn't doing it for you to your liking. A stock Z is a fine handling car as is, stock. But, there are those (like me) that get to the magical 70% mark (ability to drive the car to 70% of the car's potential) and want a little more "reserve" for the hills or track pushing the car out to 80-90%. This is MY opinion only but if you ask around, it's pretty much common knowledge with perhaps the order of things a bit different depending on application (drifting comes to mind). But in general...

Mic's Golden Rules of Modifying Cars (Pretty much any car.)

Baseline the drivetrain - get the motor in good tune, trans, clutch, driveline squared away first. Just get yourself a good running car.

Then, after carefully PLANNING out your build based on purpose and budget, start doing stuff.

NOTE: Don't be swayed by all the "cool stuff" you see on Farcebook or Instaswag, always do your supporting mods after baseline and get that out of the way: tires, brakes, suspension and make sure you replace the needed basic stuff like worn tie rods, compression rod/bushings etc) before the fancy stuff. Again, this is baselining to give yourself a solid platform upon which to build. And, I would do them in that order (unless your brakes need servicing). There is absolutely no reason to do power-adds unless you can turn and stop. I know, that stuff is boring. But you'll thank yourself later when something basic fails after you've just dumped big $$ into the fancy stuff.

Gonna stop here for a minute. You say "i probably will tackle suspension twice." Uhh.... why? Didn't you already do Bilsteins? Anyways...

Suspension/Handling, in this order:

- Good tires (and wheels if you must) - as previously mentioned, all suspension modifications should be based around the four contact points with the ground. ALWAYS.

- Baseline the shocks (done) - meaning, "get ones that work". If the car has more than 50k on it, throw away the stock shocks. They're in a postmortem state.

- Add adjustable sway bars - set 'em how you like 'em, under/over/neutral steer.

The following/last items WILL REQUIRE an alignment so plan to do all three steps at once. This is non-negotiable in my book.

- Then and only then, drop the car an inch with a set of good springs. (Or, if you must, quality coilovers, but not the $300 junk unless all you want is moar low for Instaswag points.) This is entirely optional. For those with rocky roads and generally poor driving conditions, this might be a skip point.

- At the SAME time as lowering, add adjustable front and rear camber/toe/caster alignment as the Z only has toe adjustment as stock. Lowering changes the suspension geometry and you'll go through your tires in 5k miles if you don't have the capability to align out the alignment changes. Imagine ruining a set of Supremo Mushylin PSSes.

- ALIGNMENT - this is the key to making all of the stuff above work. I would NOT recommend you going for excess camber (or toe/caster FTM) because of tire wear. You may want to realign for track use but if your driving is mostly street/highway, keep the alignment settings within factory setting range. Personally, I have my alignment settings at near the maximum allowable settings, e.g. -1.2° F and -2.1° R camber and so forth to preserve those expensive rubber donuts but giving me the handling I want. Adjust toe and caster to your desired steering feel, staying within factory range. I've set mine to give the highest response to steering input but others might not like this feel.

Once that's set, you can play with the sway bar adjustments to fine tune the amount of under/oversteer you want by softening/stiffening one end or the other. (That's another story.) Suffice to say, my settings (front at hole #1, rear at hole #2) are set to give slight oversteer when needed.) I mean, sometimes ya just gotta get the tail out ; but moreso, I've set it for instant response but know that I might just have to catch the rear out with a little opposite lock (but not even close to a drift setup).

I love my settings but YMMV.

To long time readers: You'll note the absence of my usual preachy "driving school" commentary. No point as it will go unheeded anyways.

 

very interesting! I read your response days ago, but needed more time for my response. I did do the bilstein b12 kit already. I guess the reason for doing suspension twice, is its in bad condition, and i want alot of stuff for suspension. the bill is looking high, but the car needs to stop eating tires soon too. I also want different sized wheels sometime.

Your alignment settings sound close to what i would want. It sucks i cant feel all the different ones, and know what i need. i probably wont have it tweaked too many times. I hope they align it right the first time. You would think there would be a golden formula for fastest lap time, but i guess different drivers may prefer diff setups. Its funny because usually in video games, theres not alot of drifting in road racing. im not sure how many do in auto x either. They give off the idea that better traction equals better times. In my evo though especially in tight curvy roads, i drifted and felt like it got me from point a to b quickest possible. its scary and high speed drifting in that evo, didnt even do it all the time.

im kind of mad at myself. got a speeding ticket , not even really enjoying the car. i should have atleast had suspenion right and been driving spirited. im done speeding for no fun. i would love to make it to track, idc about being competitive.

So you suggest sway bars before other suspension components? Is there certain parts i should save for round 2? ill list all of the parts i want to order for suspension.

1. compression rods w monoball bushings. round 1

2. spl shock/ front lower control arm bushings. round 1

3. z1 sway bar kit. round 2

4. front inner tie rod kit. round 1

5. spl front outer tie rod ends. round 1

6. dayton one usa rear knuckle bushings. round 2

7. oem front hub and wheel bearing. round 2

8. rear axle and wheel bearing upgrade kit on z1. round2

9. rear camber arms and fucas. im looking at spl and spc. may just go spl. round 1

10. different sized tires for rear. I assume for road racing, its still nice to have wider tires in rear somewhat. round 2

11. I also have some rack and pinion bushings already. should they be round 1, 2 , or done with trans install?

Ive considered moving the tie rods and tie rod ends to round 2, to make this first stop cheaper. Is there anything else you would re-arrange? If you had to make two stops for suspension? After the first stop, i want my tune, and maybe even brakes or new trans. I may even wait until the end of the year, for round 2

 

I'd recommend the Hotchkis sway bars. On my '06 they were the only suspension upgrade I did. Huge difference. Was quicker around the track than my friend in his GTR.

 

thats a feat!

if you think theyre better ill get hotchkis. the kits are similarly priced and come with everything. z1 brackets looked pretty.

i forgot to add, i was going to get the z1 sway bar end links, w the z1 sway bars. Any specific endlinks i should get with the hotchkis?

is this a mod that should stay with round 2? Its tempting to do it first, since it helps so much. it would be kind of crappy if they were hard to take off, when i did round 2.

 

End link brand doesn't really matter. If you plan to lower the car, get adjustable length.

 

cool. its lowered on bilstein b12 rn. ill go with hotchkis since we have real life tests on it. I think i now remember you recommending that particular brand earlier in this thread. Ill probably still get z1 endlinks

i also thought heel reprimanded me for wanting aftermarket "front outer tie rod ends". i skimmed this whole thread this weekend and didnt see it. So maybe im crazy. This is something, im going to buy though

 

Aren't you still destroying your front tires because your alignment is way off? Did you ever get adjustable front upper control arms installed?

There's no need to get all of those things you mentioned in your previous post in different "rounds" until you resolve your current issues - especially since it sounds like you're light on cash. Tires (even used) aren't free.

 

lol well round 1 shouldnt be too long. i may get this stalling out problem checked out before that and i got a speeding ticket, so maybe still a month. I mean i could spend money on an alignment at a normal alignment place, if you suggest that. The only place that does these control arm alignments in my town, is an expensive performance shop. They also stay so booked up, i need to schedule soon. I just wanted to save a tad more first, i thought maybe even one more set of used tires. My front tires are not bad, and ive never changed them. You can see the camber is worse in rear

 

I think you're still at like round -2 right now.

As Mic's post above mentions, get to BASELINE. That's round 0. You don't currently have a good running car with everything squared away. Unless I missed something (it's near impossible to keep track of everything with so many posts about random things going wrong and overthinking the minutia), aren't you still getting trapped in your car and might die from heat suffocation? That should be like step 1.

It sounds like your battery install is also jacked up. Fix that.

You need to correct your camber/caster/toe issue that you caused by opening a can of worms with your B12 installation decision. Get the appropriate things (FUCAs, rear adjustable traction and camber arms) installed so you stop shredding your tires.

Then, get some correctly-sized tires - used or new - whatever, then get it aligned. At least you will then be at BASELINE.

Then, you can go crazy getting all these unnecessary modifications of solid race bushings, sway bars, etc. etc.

(Maybe before all this, get your speeding ticket paid so you still have a license)

 

wait, so i thought you all previously said that for my setup with shocks and springs, i need camber arms, but not traction arms too?

I see. I have not been trapped in the car again since it happened, but i only got a legit battery tie down. I still need to fix the battery, and its definitely one of the first things. Its so tempting to do suspension first, with battery still working, and only maybe affecting throttle over hard bumps. I usually ride with my phone charged and window down some, just incase. and of course the speeding ticket is first.

I definitely understand what youre saying though, and i want to reach baseline bad. It really is difficult on my end. I feel the bushings may be affecting ride alot too, and i didnt want to do 3 rounds lol. I was hoping to tough this out and save a little more for round 1. I guess ill try to figure it out. Maybe i should wait on sway bars. The place that aligns them, is so bad about scheduling. I called them awhile back, they said they could definitely help out, but are booked up for weeks. They also said its alot easier on them, if they can have my car sitting on their lot for a week or two, not worried about time. Which i am going to try to avoid.

 

my car still behaves much differently in the rain. when i hit bumps in the rain, i actually swerve side to side. im thinking its maybe the worn bushings. i dont see why being out of camber would do that, and its way more solid on dry land. So i was including the bushings in round 1, which i was hoping would baseline the suspension.

 

Or bald/trash tires.

 

I dont think so. It could be an alignment issue, but it feels worse than that. ill try to explain it. i hit a bump in rain, and car feels like it shifts to the side with one wiggle, with tires still on road with traction. i hit a decent bump at 40 and got that same feeling but sometimes its more pronounced. this time my car did a really tight figure 8 swerve back and forth that actually were my tires turning and leaving tracks and all. while i was just in a rainstorm hitting a bump. dry its way more solid. the front feels out of whack and is clanky and pops still. rear feels solid but is the worse in camber and eats tires.

 

If what you're saying is correct, your car behaves differently on wet roads as opposed to dry roads.

And you don't think it's tire-related?

It must be your special water-sensitive suspension setup.

 

lol as you know im pretty dumb, but i thought it was a possibility that my bushing problems slipped more when wet, or something.. It definitely noticably handles different in rain.

The reason it didnt seem tire related to me, is it feels more like suspension. The tires dont lose traction when it is doing that, and its done it through some different rear tires. Plus with the clanging and all, i know i still have suspension problems. It does feel like if i hit the bump at too high of speed, i would lose traction. I drive slower in rain.

 

So, these used tires you bought? What are the specs (sizes and such)? Are they even the same brand? These swerve maneuvers are CLEARLY tire related but that also means HOW they're hooked up. If your alignment is out, even a set of super tires, say, a brand new set of properly sized Michelin PSS will misbehave in the wet.

Does somebody else need to spell out the order of things for you to do? I wrote it out for you. What part of my exhaustive recommendations is not clear to you? Net-net: BASELINE THEN GO! That includes proper parts to get the alignment in check. Until those things are done, no use making any other suggestions because I feel like I wasted my time already.

 

I get the recommendations and im definitely trying to get to baseline, without getting parts i dont want. Im actually getting the stalling out issue looked at, and any codes pulled monday. You put the engine as high priority, and i agree. It will be cheap to diagnose.

i understand you all want me to get the adjustable arms, and not the bushings at same time. I just want the bushings done so soon too though.. Anyways, just one question. My tires on front are good looking. Do you think a normal alignment can help? without the adjustable arms. It is so much easier to do, with no waitlist. maybe i could get two new tires, and an alignment, and be way better off until i do arms and bushings soon.

btw the tires on rear are 255/35/18. front 255/40. The time before i got used tires, they were 255/40 like the fronts, but not as sporty. This time they were same brand, but time before no