Relentless Autosports - VRT: You be the judge
10-18-2007, 08:30 PM
#161
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Oh thats right..Louies car.Sharif did the entire build and tune, and then RA and another shop come and do some free work on it, and next thing you know, there is a big a$$ RA sticker on the car as if they built it..
To me that was very tacky on both the owner of the car, and the shops that offered the sponsorship, knowing that the quality of the build would reflect ultimately to the shops stickered up on the car, when in fact they did VERY little to make the car what it was.
To me that was very tacky on both the owner of the car, and the shops that offered the sponsorship, knowing that the quality of the build would reflect ultimately to the shops stickered up on the car, when in fact they did VERY little to make the car what it was.it was ETG's choice what to run on his car (I am sure) and I don't get why that is of any concern.
10-18-2007, 08:30 PM
#162
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Originally Posted by Motormouth
but is that the point of this thread?
first it was stated that the customer was not given the parts promised, AFTER sharif already knew from the customer, RA & noah that he got the parts he was supposed to and that his misgivings could be explained by a clerical error.
and he still.made.the.thread. < am I the only one who sees a problem with this?
first it was stated that the customer was not given the parts promised, AFTER sharif already knew from the customer, RA & noah that he got the parts he was supposed to and that his misgivings could be explained by a clerical error.
and he still.made.the.thread. < am I the only one who sees a problem with this?
10-18-2007, 08:31 PM
#163
Originally Posted by Vegas Speedstar
The fact that Scott stands behind the engine and is willing to warranty and RACE that car speaks volumes. You other so called tuners, get your best car and meet Scott on the track. That's where real racers settle disputes, not on a PC. Let the best build win.
This is not about "winning a race"
ITS ABOUT PROPPER BUSINESS ETHICS.... is Rentless even Licensed as a shop... again no one answers this question.
Last edited by D350Z10; 10-18-2007 at 08:33 PM.
10-18-2007, 08:31 PM
#165
Originally Posted by Motormouth
no, show me proof, since you want to state something as FACT, where any RA car is making 1-200whp less than they have stated.
I am not a technical expert to tell you whether or not the engine is up to snuff. I know you are notorious for overbuilding cars. not that it is a terrible thing to do, if for the right reasons.
I am not a technical expert to tell you whether or not the engine is up to snuff. I know you are notorious for overbuilding cars. not that it is a terrible thing to do, if for the right reasons.
This is how I look at it, When VRT came around with their outrageous claims some believed them and some didn't. I never believed VRT's claims and I now don't believe RA's.
I don't need to prove they are making less power than what they stated, they need to prove that what they stated is TRUE.
-George
GT Motorsports
10-18-2007, 08:32 PM
#167
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Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Wow, just wow..I just got home and i heard rumors of this thread brewing but had no idea the whole picture.
My oinion for what its worth, is that if the owner of the engine is content with paying for something that will not come close to what it is advertised to do, then he was taken advantage of.
Poor or improper documentation of something as simple as a spec sheet and what parts were used or billed in a particular motor, would be enough to make me, as a consumer to run the other way. How is this motor supposed to handle 600hp and being abused on race track , when the engine builder dont even know what parts were put in the motor. Thats not casual that negligentat the least if not deceptive ,fraudulent practice.
If you cant even sit down, write up a build spec, and parts quote with real and worthy parts that have been proven time and time again, then how the hell do you have the nerve to even attempt to assemble something so precise and critical an a high performance engine?
I find this to be a slap in the face to all of the worthy 350Z tuners and shops in the country.How a person comes out of an operation like VRT and goes on to even work in this industry is beyond me.And the fact that people trust them cause he is NICE, is even more disturbing.
I think i will change from being Legit and an a$$hole, to being Nice and scamming people of their money..Seems to be the in thing to do...
My oinion for what its worth, is that if the owner of the engine is content with paying for something that will not come close to what it is advertised to do, then he was taken advantage of.
Poor or improper documentation of something as simple as a spec sheet and what parts were used or billed in a particular motor, would be enough to make me, as a consumer to run the other way. How is this motor supposed to handle 600hp and being abused on race track , when the engine builder dont even know what parts were put in the motor. Thats not casual that negligentat the least if not deceptive ,fraudulent practice.
If you cant even sit down, write up a build spec, and parts quote with real and worthy parts that have been proven time and time again, then how the hell do you have the nerve to even attempt to assemble something so precise and critical an a high performance engine?
I find this to be a slap in the face to all of the worthy 350Z tuners and shops in the country.How a person comes out of an operation like VRT and goes on to even work in this industry is beyond me.And the fact that people trust them cause he is NICE, is even more disturbing.
I think i will change from being Legit and an a$$hole, to being Nice and scamming people of their money..Seems to be the in thing to do...
LOL, I was waiting for you.... and no surprise here
10-18-2007, 08:32 PM
#168
Originally Posted by Motormouth
but is that the point of this thread?
first it was stated that the customer was not given the parts promised, AFTER sharif already knew from the customer, RA & noah that he got the parts he was supposed to and that his misgivings could be explained by a clerical error.
and he still.made.the.thread. < am I the only one who sees a problem with this?
first it was stated that the customer was not given the parts promised, AFTER sharif already knew from the customer, RA & noah that he got the parts he was supposed to and that his misgivings could be explained by a clerical error.
and he still.made.the.thread. < am I the only one who sees a problem with this?
So in answer to your question, yes.
10-18-2007, 08:32 PM
#169
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Originally Posted by D350Z10
This is not about "winning a race"
ITS ABOUT PROPPER BUSINESS ETHICS.... is Rentless even Licensed as a shop... again no one answers this question.
ITS ABOUT PROPPER BUSINESS ETHICS.... is Rentless even Licensed as a shop... again no one answers this question.
10-18-2007, 08:33 PM
#170
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Originally Posted by D350Z10
This is not about "winning a race"
ITS ABOUT PROPPER BUSINESS ETHICS.... is Rentless even Licensed as a shop... again no one answers this question.
ITS ABOUT PROPPER BUSINESS ETHICS.... is Rentless even Licensed as a shop... again no one answers this question.
10-18-2007, 08:33 PM
#171
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Originally Posted by Canadian
I don't need a dyno sheet to know, and its pathetic that you all need proof of a claim that isn't even ground breaking. I've seen the Z in person numerous times. It has won numerous time attack events. Do you think the car with 400whp would win??? Afterall, you guys are claiming all of RA's cars are ~200whp less than anything they say.
thats like saying its fine to walk around saying u got xxx amount of power.....and then u get beat and make up some excuse of why u got beat......lol or maybe it just blow up from using to many oem parts lol
10-18-2007, 08:33 PM
#172
Originally Posted by rcdash
That's an unreasonable request since it's not possible. And attacking GTM for overbuilding is going O/T. jeez.
and for you to back a shop participating in that action is rediculous.
and if you get my point about that comment then it really isn't O/T.
10-18-2007, 08:35 PM
#174
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Originally Posted by George@GTM
So if this was you, and you were going to build a 600rwhp time attack car, would you do what is virtually a OEM build? For a car that is going to be abused on a roadcourse?
10-18-2007, 08:35 PM
#175
Originally Posted by rcdash
The point of this thread is to present the evidence involved and put everything on the table to allow discussion and explanation.
So in answer to your question, yes.
So in answer to your question, yes.
this obviously, especially at this stage, is nothing that needs discussion or explantion, nor was this intended as such. it's a hack job and I cannot believe you are trying to deny it.
what is there to discuss? private details of a customer's build that hasn't even FAILED yet? if it is going to of course...
explanation of a clerical error he already had the answer to.
please oh please answer that riddle.
10-18-2007, 08:35 PM
#176
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Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Which it will not do.
i have my strong doubts it will make it too
i have no doubt that the customer was not ripped off since he stated it himself...but id like to see if i can be proven wrong on the engine...cause that is questionable....
maybe budget given by the customer was not enough and he is aware of it... i dunno..(i know i am speculating)
10-18-2007, 08:36 PM
#177
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Originally Posted by Canadian
I don't see how this is about business ethics. If one shop does something different, and it works, and their engine builder is THAT good, and other shops don't do specific things - why does it matter? If it works, it works. And, it does work.
sorry but i dont see skill of building being enough to hold together a n/a block running a 600whp of Forced induction on stock parts.... maybe if he had magic skills at tuning but it still u likely to survive the beating of a track event
10-18-2007, 08:36 PM
#178
Originally Posted by failsafe306
Somebody's bluffing. He knows damn well that motor isn't going to hold up, and that he isn't running OEM stuff in his motor...
To many guys on this site have blown head gaskets using OEM parts . What he is trying to tell us is . His builder [ Mark ] knows some tricks that no other builder on this site knows . And can make OEM head gaskets and head bolts hold to 600whp.....yea right !
10-18-2007, 08:37 PM
#179
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Originally Posted by Zilvia
sorry but i dont see skill of building being enough to hold together a n/a block running a 600whp of Forced induction on stock parts.... maybe if he had magic skills at tuning but it still u likely to survive the beating of a track event
10-18-2007, 08:37 PM
#180
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Originally Posted by Canadian
I don't see how this is about business ethics. If one shop does something different, and it works, and their engine builder is THAT good, and other shops don't do specific things - why does it matter? If it works, it works. And, it does work.
Do the laws of physics not apply for RA in ther magical world?