Longevity of full builds, the good the bad
#241
Vendor - Former Vendor
iTrader: (14)
This one lasted 5000 miles at 580whp and 540wtq:
https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...on-thread.html
Last edited by Boosted Performance; 12-10-2010 at 11:16 AM.
#242
Cranky FI Owner
iTrader: (14)
The way this community hides failures (many, many big name shops have and are currently doing this-including nasty law suits) and the way dyno queens are glorified as being run hard by shops and nuthuggers is ultimately why we arent progressing.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
#243
Vendor - Former Vendor
iTrader: (14)
The way this community hides failures (many, many big name shops have and are currently doing this-including nasty law suits) and the way dyno queens are glorified as being run hard by shops and nuthuggers is ultimately why we arent progressing.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
If there was only a way to find out how many busted built motors are out there. Cass I think is on number 5, so at least he shares his experiences, and people learn from it. This community will not go any further with the VQ if this keeps up.
#244
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: ATL, FT Benning, North Cak
Posts: 498
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I'm on 17k on my build, but besides some hard highway pulls, I don't push it much. I guess I'm still a little nervous of constantly rocking it. I keep boost at 10 psi most of the time.
Last edited by suprasam; 12-10-2010 at 11:40 AM.
#245
New Member
iTrader: (18)
Hmmm... I'm into the low 20k miles on a FP S1 block running at 15 psi, daily (when it's not freezing out). Spun bearings that occur thousands of miles after break in are caused by what exactly? Over-rev or lubrication failure (low oil or overheat). Perhaps early failure may be clearance/build errors or tuning error. Show me a perfectly running car that suddenly spins a bearing with (a) normal oil pressure, (b) an oil temp gauge in operating range and (c) a rev limiter engaged... I think that excludes all the failures?
Last edited by rcdash; 12-10-2010 at 01:11 PM.
#246
New Member
iTrader: (7)
I understand where you're coming from, but due to your experiences, Cass's and a host of other built guys I decided against a built setup. Hence, why the V8 swap was decided on. I would love to have kept the VQ and build it with a TT kit, but the uncertainty of weather or not it will hold together. I beat on my car very, very hard. Plus I race AutoX, and HPDE so I want to have a setup I can count on. I wouldn't want what happened to you and Cass happen to me. I can't afford 3 or more built setups. Either way I hope you get things straightened out. Sorry for the thread jack....
#247
Registered User
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 635
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The way this community hides failures (many, many big name shops have and are currently doing this-including nasty law suits) and the way dyno queens are glorified as being run hard by shops and nuthuggers is ultimately why we arent progressing.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
Most shops claim they run their cars hard, then when a customer has an engine issue, they are scrutinized for "abusing" the car. Funny how that works.
#248
New Member
iTrader: (18)
^Suits and countersuits go hand in hand. Only the attorneys make out - everyone else loses.
Alberto may be right, but you have to look a little deeper into why failures get hidden. He didn't mention the finger pointing, back stabbing and mob mentality that this forum has the potential to engender. There is also a flip side with enthusiasts that have an infectious passion for this platform. Guess you have to take the bad with the good...
Alberto may be right, but you have to look a little deeper into why failures get hidden. He didn't mention the finger pointing, back stabbing and mob mentality that this forum has the potential to engender. There is also a flip side with enthusiasts that have an infectious passion for this platform. Guess you have to take the bad with the good...
#249
Registered User
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 635
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm wondering if some of these shops he's talking about are initiating the lawsuits. I could see how a customer could be the one initiating, but how I read his post was that the shops are going after the customer for posting what happened or maybe for them bashing the shop.
#250
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Hmmm... I'm into the low 20k miles on a FP S1 block running at 15 psi, daily (when it's not freezing out). Spun bearings that occur thousands of miles after break in are caused by what exactly? Over-rev or lubrication failure (low oil or overheat). Perhaps early failure may be clearance/build errors or tuning error. Show me a perfectly running car that suddenly spins a bearing with (a) normal oil pressure, (b) an oil temp gauge in operating range and (c) a rev limiter engaged... I think that excludes all the failures?
Exactly. These motors that are spinning bearings @ 5000+ miles are not just doing it because they were built poorly or because they are VQs. I do know that I have to keep a very close eye on my oil level as my turbos and crankcase ventilation both consume a good amount of oil. I check my oil two times a week and have to add 1.5-2 quarts roughly every 3000 miles. Then again, I built my own car (with a BZM longblock), so I'm very familiar with the car and constantly monitor things. I highly doubt most owners of built motor 350Zs are as **** as I am about their car's fluids, temps, etc.
ANY platform with a built up motor and a lot of extra power has issues. I have friends with evos, vettes, mustangs, etc. that have all had issues with built motors and 500+hp.
#251
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I understand where you're coming from, but due to your experiences, Cass's and a host of other built guys I decided against a built setup. Hence, why the V8 swap was decided on. I would love to have kept the VQ and build it with a TT kit, but the uncertainty of weather or not it will hold together. I beat on my car very, very hard. Plus I race AutoX, and HPDE so I want to have a setup I can count on. I wouldn't want what happened to you and Cass happen to me. I can't afford 3 or more built setups. Either way I hope you get things straightened out. Sorry for the thread jack....
#252
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
I always believe one should add to the cooling system every bit as much as the motor/whp is added to...seems to almost always be overlooked.
Last edited by djamps; 12-11-2010 at 04:20 AM.
#255
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I always believe one should add to the cooling system every bit as much as the motor/whp is added to...seems to almost always be overlooked.
#258
350Z-holic
iTrader: (34)
Just going to offer my opinion on the bearings...
I had a rev limiter on my setups and monitored the oil level. The oil temp was my fail if I had to guess. EVERY time I took the car out it saw max boost and several hard pulls. On this last build I will try to drive more normally on a regular basis and I'm having a whole new host of gauges installed to more closely monitor oil temp, EGT, oil pressure and coolant temp.
I would say that I just over cooked the oil, or heated it to a point where it wasn't able to provide adequate lubrication. I had been runing the car with the anti-lag on and doing several back to back to back highway pulls when the oil pressure dropped and the bearing started to fail (confirmed by Blackstone). I cannot be sure if my customized setup of turbos and anti-lag or high boost with meth is in any way contributing to my failures. I do agree that most shops shy away from their FAIL in an effort to save face and cost the community as a whole. I can also say that I saw several Forged and Injected cars abused all day last year at the airstrip and they are all still running to my knowledge.
Now I will take a lesson from Raj and XKR and be vigilant about monitoring baseline readings and letting oil temps determine how hard the car gets pushed. Also, I will stop driving just like Alberto and drive in a more sane manor on most occasions so I can stop feeling like my 7 year old that breaks his brand new toy on Christmas day.
I had a rev limiter on my setups and monitored the oil level. The oil temp was my fail if I had to guess. EVERY time I took the car out it saw max boost and several hard pulls. On this last build I will try to drive more normally on a regular basis and I'm having a whole new host of gauges installed to more closely monitor oil temp, EGT, oil pressure and coolant temp.
I would say that I just over cooked the oil, or heated it to a point where it wasn't able to provide adequate lubrication. I had been runing the car with the anti-lag on and doing several back to back to back highway pulls when the oil pressure dropped and the bearing started to fail (confirmed by Blackstone). I cannot be sure if my customized setup of turbos and anti-lag or high boost with meth is in any way contributing to my failures. I do agree that most shops shy away from their FAIL in an effort to save face and cost the community as a whole. I can also say that I saw several Forged and Injected cars abused all day last year at the airstrip and they are all still running to my knowledge.
Now I will take a lesson from Raj and XKR and be vigilant about monitoring baseline readings and letting oil temps determine how hard the car gets pushed. Also, I will stop driving just like Alberto and drive in a more sane manor on most occasions so I can stop feeling like my 7 year old that breaks his brand new toy on Christmas day.
#259
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Just going to offer my opinion on the bearings...
I had a rev limiter on my setups and monitored the oil level. The oil temp was my fail if I had to guess. EVERY time I took the car out it saw max boost and several hard pulls. On this last build I will try to drive more normally on a regular basis and I'm having a whole new host of gauges installed to more closely monitor oil temp, EGT, oil pressure and coolant temp.
I would say that I just over cooked the oil, or heated it to a point where it wasn't able to provide adequate lubrication. I had been runing the car with the anti-lag on and doing several back to back to back highway pulls when the oil pressure dropped and the bearing started to fail (confirmed by Blackstone). I cannot be sure if my customized setup of turbos and anti-lag or high boost with meth is in any way contributing to my failures. I do agree that most shops shy away from their FAIL in an effort to save face and cost the community as a whole. I can also say that I saw several Forged and Injected cars abused all day last year at the airstrip and they are all still running to my knowledge.
Now I will take a lesson from Raj and XKR and be vigilant about monitoring baseline readings and letting oil temps determine how hard the car gets pushed. Also, I will stop driving just like Alberto and drive in a more sane manor on most occasions so I can stop feeling like my 7 year old that breaks his brand new toy on Christmas day.
I had a rev limiter on my setups and monitored the oil level. The oil temp was my fail if I had to guess. EVERY time I took the car out it saw max boost and several hard pulls. On this last build I will try to drive more normally on a regular basis and I'm having a whole new host of gauges installed to more closely monitor oil temp, EGT, oil pressure and coolant temp.
I would say that I just over cooked the oil, or heated it to a point where it wasn't able to provide adequate lubrication. I had been runing the car with the anti-lag on and doing several back to back to back highway pulls when the oil pressure dropped and the bearing started to fail (confirmed by Blackstone). I cannot be sure if my customized setup of turbos and anti-lag or high boost with meth is in any way contributing to my failures. I do agree that most shops shy away from their FAIL in an effort to save face and cost the community as a whole. I can also say that I saw several Forged and Injected cars abused all day last year at the airstrip and they are all still running to my knowledge.
Now I will take a lesson from Raj and XKR and be vigilant about monitoring baseline readings and letting oil temps determine how hard the car gets pushed. Also, I will stop driving just like Alberto and drive in a more sane manor on most occasions so I can stop feeling like my 7 year old that breaks his brand new toy on Christmas day.