Resolute

iTrader: (2)

I think it would be a good idea for you to have Terry check out your break-in process. Considering what ZeeForce's engine looks like, with a very slow break-in, I would think it beneficial to get a UOA done. I won't use the data in the comparisons, just as I haven't used ZeeForce's or thekinn's, since it is from engines which are not done with the process. However, having Terry keep an eye on your engine would be good peace of mind.

Will (Already knows Terry will tell you to use PP 5W-30 or BioSyn)

06CPV35

Thanks Will. Had planned for Terry to watch over my revised VQ as he has in the past, watched and confirmed many interesting facts on my old VQ with OC. Knew VQ's with OC were not considered for your stats due to obvious reasons. Now know VQ's in break-in are not included either.

I'll post my UOA regardless when completed, since DuraBlend in service is the third oil change already on fresh VQ and normal break-in contaminants are mostly, if not all, flushed out by now. Plus I'm having very little consumption on this interval it seems, so fuel dilute hopefully will be at a minimum and raw numbers will be a better representation on this oil to possibly still consider in general.

You are correct about PP and BioSyn. There's another one liked, but can't disclose.

UpRev

iTrader: (5)

I'm just at the shop to help a customer real quick so I didn't read the whole thread. Has anyone built a database for all these reports? Is anyone interested in doing so if it hasn't been done?

Obviously with the samples coming from so many different cars with so many different mods, there's no perfect solution, but I'd be interested in seeing numbers based on specific applications.

Daily drivers, race cars, N/A, FI, high/low boost, etc. Just to get a clearer picture of whats going on. I'd also like to have some single person to send reports to so they can be added to the database. We're moving our customers to Torco oils based on information we get from industry people and we've been really happy with it in our personal cars. But proof is proof.

Also do they test gear case oils?

rich@uprev.com - resolute, can you e-mail me?

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

All the current formulations of oils which have been tested are compiled into tables for easy comparison. The average results for each brand and oil weight are included in these tables, which are attached to the first post of this thread.

The table includes only those oils which are currently available. Oils are removed form the table when new formulations come out, but the old formulas of every oil tested are kept in my database for my own comparisons. Oils from engines with mechanical problems or from break-in periods of new engines are not compiled into the averages. Only NA engines are included in the comparisons. This keeps the results consistent, since the clearances, tunes, and temps are all consistent in terms of what alters the oil's physical properties. The variance between FI or built engines will alter the correlation between how one oil will perform across multiple individual engines, so there is no comparison chart for these engine oil samples. I do have them included in my database, however, in case some one with a certain build/boost level/FI type wants to see UOA results from a similar engine.

Gear oils may be tested by Dyson and Blackstone. They are not collected in this thread. I have been debating making a separate thread for gear and transmission fluids for some time, and probably will. Just like the first six posts in this thread, it will include the basic chemistry and tribology involved with these oils and give information critical for proper selection, including gear oil viscosity and grade.

Will

Nederlander75

Iron 13
Chro 1
Lead 5
Copp 5
Tin 0
Alum 0
Nick 0
Silv 0
Sili 15
Boro 4
Sodi 10
Magn 582
Calc 1821
Bari 0
Phos 784
Zinc 1018
Moly 25
Tita 0
Vana 0
Pota 1

Fuel <.5%
Visc 12.2 cst@100C
Soot <.1
Water 0%
TBN 4.75
Oxid 12
Nitr 23

Air filter was OEM up to last 2500 miles, oil filter was Amsoil. Car did see 3 tanks of E85 (only E70 in Colorado) mixed with reg 85oct to mix to 93oct total. This may have scewed potassium or sodium or the winter drivinng could have due to road salts. Or its an additive to some point. Coolant system checks out with no leaks and res is full from fall change out. Driving style is unchanged as is fuel beyond the Eth mixing. MPG was steady. Oil was installed in January and sampled in July.

Would have put in some old school Rotella T Syn, but my neighbor bought alll my stash at 4.5$/qrt profit, 28 qrts. So, its got M1 0w40 in it now. Actually feels to run just a bit smoother and revs just a bit easier, but I expect more FE wear typical of the M1 at this time.

Thanks for the reviews and thoughts.

SteveZ

iTrader: (3)

I suspect given how ground up and dry the salt gets there is a small amount getting past the air filter, esp PM10 sized particles with K&N or similar. At first read I thought "wth?" but when I look at the salt spray I get up into the motor area, and how much hits the mouth of the intake, it easily could skew both Ka or NaCl.

When it's really cold here (CT) the dry air turns the road salt into very fine dust, and you have to know some of that is making it into the intake. Whether any gets into the oil, who knows?

Guess I'll find out - I'm running also 0/40W M1 until my next change, then getting my first UOA done. Bums me out to see higher Fe with M1 in the VQ, in my other motors it has served me well for over 125k miles in each (SR20DE and a KA24DE).

SteveZ

iTrader: (3)

Will, if you have the time and initiative to do so, that would be great. Trans is somewhat of a weak point on many Z33/V35's in terms of failure rates. Also the stock LSD diff fluid seems to sludge up badly sooner than I'd expect. Given what I've seen there, the LSD is now more of a concern to me in terms of fluid change intervals.

Thanks for all the info you've put here, it's great.

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

Looks pretty good. I'm guessing that this is GC gold and not the older green formula, based on the additive levels. The wear is low, with the exception of Fe. It is the only element out of spec from the 3 GC green samples I've averaged. Everything else is low, including the Silicon, Sodium, and Potassium. I wouldn't worry about any coolant issues just yet, you have trace amount, and the Silicon is lower than it has been on any of your other UOA's, iirc. The TBN looks good and this oil is impressive for its resistance to shear. 12.2. How long did you run it? Always liked the GC, it has solid reports to back up its growing fan base. Looking forward to the M1 0W-40. Thanks for sharing this!

Will

Nederlander75

Thanks Wil. GC was run for >7 months. Im guessing the higher than rec'd avg FE wear is due to the Ams filter, and was speculated as such on BITOG when I posed the question. I got much more timing chain rattle at cold start going to the GC/Ams filter combo, though Id have to credit the oil filter with reducing Sil. The chain rattle goes away above 25F or so. The run of M1 0w40 will have an Ams air and oil filter.

Nederlander75

7K miles and GC gold, batch 2007.

ZeeForce

Will,
Here is the third UOA from Dyson on the freshly built 2006 VQ35 Rev-Up.

Note: that the coolant drop on this OCI (below) may have been a false visual reading. The good new is there is no glycol on this sample UOA. But I am still monitoring it.

I have blacked out the "Watch Advisory" info as this info comes from the lab and Terry Dyson uses his own interpretation methods which is included in his audio commentary and stickies on the raw data sheet. Therefore the data is irrelevant; also the "Reference" data was from the extra virgin sample taken from Castrol GTX 5w-30.

Oil used in the” Sample Dates":
Sample Date: 01/25/2008 = Castrol GTX 5w-30
Sample Date: 05/10/2008 = Castrol GTX 5w-30
Sample Date: 08/23/2008 = Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30

Thanks
Curtis

************* Data on this OCI UOA ****************

Data on the 2006 350Z freshly rebuilt engine.

Nissan 2006 350Z manual transmission.
Engine: 3.5 L V-6 VQ35 300hp Rev-Up
Fuel: Shell V-Power 91 octane
Fuel additives:
Air Filter: Amsoil EaA paper air filter.
Recent repairs: None
Mods: Nissan’ Nismo CAI and Catback exhaust system.
Driving habits: Daily driving, no track or autox. No revs above 4000. 40/60 freeway/street.

Never overheats

Date of oil change: 8/23/08
Oil Type: Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30
Oil Filter: Amsoil Ea0
Miles on oil change interval: 3657 mi

Mileage on engine: 11,260 mi
Oil changed on regular intervals at 3750 mi.
Oil added on this interval = Zero
Oil loss = 6 mm (1/4 quart)


On this oil change dated 8/23/08 the oil was swapped out for the SAME brand/weight: Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 and Amsoil Ea0 oil filter.

Follow up on the monitoring of coolant level from the last UOA:
Reporting that there was a tad (1/16’ drop in the over flow reservoir) of consumption when measured at engine operating temperature.

03aeroZ

iTrader: (11)

Resolute - I just took my sample, but realized i was supposed to run the car for 20 min or so and also get oil from the middle of the pour. I instead, forgot to read the instructions and almost forgot to take the sample, and got it from the final 1/4 of the pour. I also got it after the car sat for about 2 hours after a 40min drive. is the sample worth sending in or should i do it again later? thanks for any info.

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

Send it. This isn't ferrography, it's ICP, so the sample you've got will do fine for what spectrometry measures.

Will

06CPV35

Got my UOA using Valvoline DuraBlend 10w-30.
This sample was third oil service on a fresh built revup VQ with only 3750mi on it.
Sample is from last 2000mi of 3750. I'm pleased with this oil with such a freshly built V2.
Just thought I'd share what Nissan/Infiniti is building as their revised rev-up VQ replacements.

Jonathan Allyn

iTrader: (3)

Here is my report from Blackstone using RP 5w/30. Car has test pipes, dual exhaust, headers & pop charger.


EDIT: I havent tracked my car in a couple years. So I am not sure where the lead is coming from.

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

Hi Curtis!

Sorry I took so long to get back with you on this. Wear has continued to improve, and everything is trending positive. It's nice to see your fuel dilution improve, and the drastic drop in sodium is reassuring. Makes sense that your coolant level dropping might have been a false reading, since there is such an improvement in the UOA. I still don't like the copper levels or Pb levels being so high. Pb is really not bad at all and I would be content to see it stay there, but 3ppm or less is better. The copper is another matter. I wonder, since PP uses Moly disulfide and not MoDTC, if the sulfur isn't contributing to the copper levels. This would be similar to a condition found with some RP oil blends. The viscosity was stable for a change, TBN was decent, even though your oxidation was high. Oxidation could be from several things, but mostly comes from cleaning varnishes and other deposits from inside the engine. This breaks the oil's TBN down and contributed to the higher TAN levels, and often helps shear the oil. Oxidation can be a good thing as long as your acids remain in check, since the oxidation shows PP is living up to its "cleaning" reputation. In this case, your viscosity and TBN are fine, so it looks good, Curtis. Next one will be a key UOA, to see if the trending continues and the Pb and Cu drop, as well as see if the slight increase in Nickel reverses.

Will

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

Fuel dilution needs to drop, and I'm sure it will as the rings continue to seat. Glycol is way off. Have you noticed coolant disappearing on you? Sodium is low for a freshly built engine, so either your coolant doesn't use a lot of sodium or the glycol is from something else. I'm leaning towards the former. Copper is a bit high, but that could be from residual gasket leachate, anti-seize compounds, and assembly lubes. Everything else looks pretty good. I have to say, I think your V2 engine might be off to a better start than ZeeForce's. I'd be curious to see how much the fuel dilution improves over the next 3k miles or so.

Will

Resolute

iTrader: (2)

Your wear metals are all within 2ppm of the other RP 5W-30 sample we've seen, with the exception of Lead. Even your viscosity is identical. The other sample was form an engine with almost 5k miles on it, though. I would say two things; that the new formulation of RP 5W-30 is more stable and less prone to shearing than the old formula (a good thing), and that your Pb wear is way too high (bad thing). Did you re-fill with RP 5W-30? If so, get another UOA to check and see if the trend continues. No need for a TBN test, this oil is fine for at least 6k miles in the VQ. However, if the Pb comes back higher than average again, I would say a different oil is in order. RP oils have traditionally not looked very good in the VQ. The new formula has better stability and good wear numbers for the one sample we have of it. This sample looks more like the old wear numbers of RP 5W-30 we're used too, but with the better shear stability. There are better options for less money if the Pb wear doesn't drop off on the next UOA.

Will

Jonathan Allyn

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for the analysis. Yes I did fill back up with RP 5w/30 but am thinking about switching over to Castrol Syntec 5w/30 as I have seen some favorable impressions for this oil in the VQ. Is it OK to switch it out being that I have used RP for the last 20K?

adamhoud

iTrader: (1)

May be a dumb question, but what is the difference between castrol GTX and castrol syntec (not the blend)?