Powerlab 35R kit will not make 500 HP
go-fast, as I recall the equation relating hp to air density is a square root of the absolute temp, so I don't think it would equate to 1 degree to 1 hp anyway - much less I suspect but I gotta dig it out to see how much exactly...
You need to run some basic tests and answer some fundamental questions before even continuing.
1. how does the removal of the exhaust effect power/AIT
2. what is the exhaust back pressure
3. does wrapping the charge pipes affect AITs
4. will an extra 50 hp really make you that much happier? what is it you want to accomplish that is directly related to +50whp?
those are cheap/free tests that can be run on the street/hwy using the data logger.
As you can tell there are soooo few members with PL kits on here. And essentially 1 that used that 1.06 A/R housing.
Did you call Garrett and they said the new housing will shift your piping? A/R is area/radius. Looking at a typical housing, there is ALOT of room to port out for a bigger A/R without changing the external dimensions.
Sounds like some people are getting ready to try the PTE 6765 which would be about the same as that PL GT37r. That would be a useful comparison as well..
1. how does the removal of the exhaust effect power/AIT
2. what is the exhaust back pressure
3. does wrapping the charge pipes affect AITs
4. will an extra 50 hp really make you that much happier? what is it you want to accomplish that is directly related to +50whp?
those are cheap/free tests that can be run on the street/hwy using the data logger.
As you can tell there are soooo few members with PL kits on here. And essentially 1 that used that 1.06 A/R housing.
Did you call Garrett and they said the new housing will shift your piping? A/R is area/radius. Looking at a typical housing, there is ALOT of room to port out for a bigger A/R without changing the external dimensions.
Sounds like some people are getting ready to try the PTE 6765 which would be about the same as that PL GT37r. That would be a useful comparison as well..
I am considering the 1.06 over the .82 housing but would like to have some hard data before heading down the rabbit hole again. How much more power could be made and what increase in spool time would this mod produce. I have been speaking with another member, off the thread, who is about to start the final phases of a build project with the powerlab gt35r kit and he is seriously considering the 1.06 housing before he starts the tuning. It is a somewhat tight space with the .82 housing between the engine and the firewall and I don't enough know if the larger housing would fit. Also, the hotside outlet would change position alittle and this could throw off the piping which would mean some modification to the downpipe. Finally, with the 4 inch opening on the GT37r inlet, one could reduce from 4 inches to 3.5 inches and fit an intake on the turbo with very little mod to the support braces since there is more space than the current 3 inch intake requires.
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From: under the hood
i have no math to back that up......that statement is a sort of "kentucky windage".my point was cooler iat temps = hp,i would be interested to see any calculations you might have though.
I personally would prefer a filter as well, especially if the car is a daily driver or is street driven on a regular basis. However, a proper metal screen/mesh should provide adequate protection against rocks and pebbles. My previous post addressed the issue and what would most likely be involved in the custom fab for an intake.
The reason PL doesnt put a filter on the gt37r is because the piping cant fit though the regular hole on the radiator support when most people run the "cf ducts"....so i dont think they wanted to make the kit where you have to bring the hammer or a saw to cut your way around to get it to fit......just "cutting" for the crashbar to help fit the FMIC is about the limit for a off-the-self kit....
Originally Posted by rude
Edit: Just saw your edit.
Nobody suggested that the OP should run his car without an exhaust. It was suggested that the exhaust should be disconnected on the dyno to see if it nets any significant gains and to rule out the possibility that the exhaust is a restriction that could be contributing to the problem. That's just basic troubleshooting that any decent shop should/would do.
doh..i just said that since it was the easiest way to test there is no restrictions on that end... if it proves me right, he can run the SP cut-out or a bigger more straight exhaust.... he knows what i mean ...he is just trying to make strawman assumptions here...hes done it already by insinuating deception here too
Originally Posted by str8dum
The choice between running a filter or not would be up to the buyers personal level of risk acceptance.
The street driven supras mostly run filters. They may take the filter off at the track.... Hal's personal car is still a "shop" car. If I only had to pay dealer wholesale for a GT4088r, i wouldnt care either.
The street driven supras mostly run filters. They may take the filter off at the track.... Hal's personal car is still a "shop" car. If I only had to pay dealer wholesale for a GT4088r, i wouldnt care either.
Again, do you think the gt35r with bigger A/R is better than a gt37r...i think not..and the gt37r is already in a kit or upgradable....i guess for cost wise he just has to run the numbers but runnign the bigger A/R could cause fitment issues that might involve more fabbing that he wants to get involed or unknowns of mesing with porting to a bigger A/R ....and that should be factored into what he has to do......Thats why if OP wants a turbo change he should try the gt37r IMO.
All the costs discussion is why the meth kit should be his 1st inmediate mod, anyways IMO... before changing turbos...... and i think i already suggested a couple of the "free/tests" you suggested such as removal of the exhaust...which your buddy raj got all strawman about .
Last edited by IIQuickSilverII; Jun 8, 2010 at 11:23 AM.
For most others it would be somewhat less.
Last edited by rcdash; Jun 8, 2010 at 12:15 PM.
Well of course, but that extra fabrication isnt free (money or time). Bottom line is we are both on the same page Jorge
Like I suggested, the OP needs to contact Garrett to see how the dimensions might change with any of these upgrade.
An OTS new Gt37r costs about 1700$. No idea what going rate on a used GT3582r is, but prolly not even 1/2 that amount. And the GT3788r is not even what PL sells though...
Since the GT37r provided by PL still has the same turbine, who knows if that will fix his problem. Sure it can produce more boost and make more top power with its bigger compressor, but none of that is relevant if the AITs are still too high due to exhaust back pressure.
Too bad there's just not more VQ relevant data out on this forum. Pretty much all the builds are cookie cutter and fairly conservative, so not much 'experiementation' to test other ideas
Like I suggested, the OP needs to contact Garrett to see how the dimensions might change with any of these upgrade.
An OTS new Gt37r costs about 1700$. No idea what going rate on a used GT3582r is, but prolly not even 1/2 that amount. And the GT3788r is not even what PL sells though...
Since the GT37r provided by PL still has the same turbine, who knows if that will fix his problem. Sure it can produce more boost and make more top power with its bigger compressor, but none of that is relevant if the AITs are still too high due to exhaust back pressure.
Too bad there's just not more VQ relevant data out on this forum. Pretty much all the builds are cookie cutter and fairly conservative, so not much 'experiementation' to test other ideas
rich...i think it was made clear that mesh is the alternative... HAls isnt the only suppra with a gt42r or similar sized turbo out there on the road...plenty of those out there that arent "shop cars"...and ...my point is that yes... a filter is nice...but when you are tryign to run a bigger turbo... something else has to give/change... or adjust... simple stuff...
Again, do you think the gt35r with bigger A/R is better than a gt37r...i think not..and the gt37r is already in a kit or upgradable....i guess for cost wise he just has to run the numbers but runnign the bigger A/R could cause fitment issues that might involve more fabbing that he wants to get involed or unknowns of mesing with porting to a bigger A/R ....and that should be factored into what he has to do......Thats why if OP wants a turbo change he should try the gt37r IMO.
All the costs discussion is why the meth kit should be his 1st inmediate mod, anyways IMO... before changing turbos...... and i think i already suggested a couple of the "free/tests" you suggested such as removal of the exhaust...which your buddy raj got all strawman about .
Again, do you think the gt35r with bigger A/R is better than a gt37r...i think not..and the gt37r is already in a kit or upgradable....i guess for cost wise he just has to run the numbers but runnign the bigger A/R could cause fitment issues that might involve more fabbing that he wants to get involed or unknowns of mesing with porting to a bigger A/R ....and that should be factored into what he has to do......Thats why if OP wants a turbo change he should try the gt37r IMO.
All the costs discussion is why the meth kit should be his 1st inmediate mod, anyways IMO... before changing turbos...... and i think i already suggested a couple of the "free/tests" you suggested such as removal of the exhaust...which your buddy raj got all strawman about .
Last edited by str8dum1; Jun 8, 2010 at 12:39 PM.
Perfect! Thanks for the clarification. 
athenG, I think you're right - it works out better with whp. PM Terry for his nifty spreadsheet (if he's still sharing it around) - it's got lots of nifty calculations that seem to be more in line with real world outcomes... It doesn't plot onto a compressor map, but it calculates the max airflow that the turbo needs to provide to hit the target whp level (so you don't have to manually work through Garrett's formulas in their turbotech 102 and 103 web pages)...
athenG, I think you're right - it works out better with whp. PM Terry for his nifty spreadsheet (if he's still sharing it around) - it's got lots of nifty calculations that seem to be more in line with real world outcomes... It doesn't plot onto a compressor map, but it calculates the max airflow that the turbo needs to provide to hit the target whp level (so you don't have to manually work through Garrett's formulas in their turbotech 102 and 103 web pages)...
^^^^
Also, I made some changes a few months ago. So, if anyone has an older version and wants the newer one, PM me.
Also, I have further updates planned to take into consideration compression ratio and maybe some other things, I just haven't had the time to get to it yet.
Also, I made some changes a few months ago. So, if anyone has an older version and wants the newer one, PM me.
Also, I have further updates planned to take into consideration compression ratio and maybe some other things, I just haven't had the time to get to it yet.
The spreadsheet calculates things like fuel flow, air flow and boost pressure for a desired hp. You then can take the boost pressure and air flow and manually plot those on a compressor map. I don't have compressor maps in my spreadsheet.
I do list some turbo information that I was able to get for Garrett and Greddy turbos, but this data is not used in any of the calculations, it is just there for informational purposes. If you want a copy, let me know and I'll send it. Feel free to add whatever information that you have for the Precision turbos.
I do list some turbo information that I was able to get for Garrett and Greddy turbos, but this data is not used in any of the calculations, it is just there for informational purposes. If you want a copy, let me know and I'll send it. Feel free to add whatever information that you have for the Precision turbos.
The spreadsheet calculates things like fuel flow, air flow and boost pressure for a desired hp. You then can take the boost pressure and air flow and manually plot those on a compressor map. I don't have compressor maps in my spreadsheet.
I do list some turbo information that I was able to get for Garrett and Greddy turbos, but this data is not used in any of the calculations, it is just there for informational purposes. If you want a copy, let me know and I'll send it. Feel free to add whatever information that you have for the Precision turbos.
I do list some turbo information that I was able to get for Garrett and Greddy turbos, but this data is not used in any of the calculations, it is just there for informational purposes. If you want a copy, let me know and I'll send it. Feel free to add whatever information that you have for the Precision turbos.
jeffbinder@gmail.com
i want this ninja software! thanks!
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From: Davie
so quick cliff notes on upgrading the gt35r on powerlab set-up is that you can't?
Using the current piping that comes with the PL GT35R will not work if you want to upgrade to a GT37R without most likely having to switch the entire piping? How much modifying would be needed to make the GT37R fit? Is this something the guys at Intense has/sells as sort of an upgrade to the GT35R?
Using the current piping that comes with the PL GT35R will not work if you want to upgrade to a GT37R without most likely having to switch the entire piping? How much modifying would be needed to make the GT37R fit? Is this something the guys at Intense has/sells as sort of an upgrade to the GT35R?
found this gem on the merits of the GT3582 being discussed back in 2006.
https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...installed.html
too bad that kit never caught on as it woulda taken PL's market share as 1st to market.
https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...installed.html
too bad that kit never caught on as it woulda taken PL's market share as 1st to market.
^^^ ...but was still completely wrong. The GT35R has been proven to make over 600whp on multiple platforms for the past several years.
As 1ZweetZ already pointed out...
I don't see how that other thread is relevant or helpful to this one. IMO it's worthless OT.
As 1ZweetZ already pointed out...
Wow, did this thing get off topic in a hurry! You guys must be REALLY bored. A couple of things you should be aware of....compressor maps aren't a 'ruler', that says what it's limits are, but rather a guidline as to how they are meant to be operated. Every turbo I have ever played with (and that has been quite alot) has made to the tire, more than it was suppose to make at the engine. So use the map as a guide for selecting a turbo, but it is NOT a hard number by any means. A 35R WILL make between 620 and 660 to the tires, this isn't a question, it has been proven countless times. This kit has been proven to make 650's to the tire. No one said it was on pump gas, and who cares? If you want to make 650's to the wheels on pump with a VQ, that isn't hard to do at all. Doing it on a small turbo (like the 35r) is a bit dangerous because of the back pressure involved. I still wouldn't say it's impossible, I would just say it isn't recommended. People do alot of things that aren't "recommended" all the time.
FYI, the 37R in question is a 35R with a larger 67mm compressor wheel and a different compressor cover. Otherwise it's the same turbo on the 'hot' side.
A couple of things you should be aware of....compressor maps aren't a 'ruler', that says what it's limits are, but rather a guidline as to how they are meant to be operated. Every turbo I have ever played with (and that has been quite alot) has made to the tire, more than it was suppose to make at the engine. So use the map as a guide for selecting a turbo, but it is NOT a hard number by any means. A 35R WILL make between 620 and 660 to the tires, this isn't a question, it has been proven countless times. This kit has been proven to make 650's to the tire. No one said it was on pump gas, and who cares? If you want to make 650's to the wheels on pump with a VQ, that isn't hard to do at all. Doing it on a small turbo (like the 35r) is a bit dangerous because of the back pressure involved. I still wouldn't say it's impossible, I would just say it isn't recommended. People do alot of things that aren't "recommended" all the time. FYI, the 37R in question is a 35R with a larger 67mm compressor wheel and a different compressor cover. Otherwise it's the same turbo on the 'hot' side.
I don't see how that other thread is relevant or helpful to this one. IMO it's worthless OT.
Last edited by RudeG_v2.0; Jun 9, 2010 at 07:17 PM.